00:00SPEAKERHey Brad, I've been thinking about building a render cluster.
00:04SPEAKERAs one does, two days before Thanksgiving.
00:06SPEAKERWell, so we're in the final push on the Anacrusis, and one of the things you do at the very end
00:11SPEAKERof a game dev cycle is bake a whole buttload of lightmaps.
00:17SPEAKERAnd lightmaps aren't like a... they're not as intense as they were in, say, the Quake
00:26SPEAKERdays when, you know, Carmack bought a SGI workstation that took three days to bake a lightmap on
00:33SPEAKERa single level or anything like that.
00:35SPEAKERI was going to say, this is taking me back to the days of reading plan files, where you're
00:38SPEAKERgoing to have to get a two CPU deck alpha to do this, and then two CPUs both running
00:43SPEAKERat 400 megahertz.
00:44SPEAKERI'm going to tell you, I'm probably running a little bit faster than two CPUs running
00:48SPEAKERat 400 megahertz these days.
00:51SPEAKERBut even with the 13900K and the 4090, it takes a while to bake a lightmap on a decent
01:00SPEAKERsized Anacrusis level.
01:01SPEAKERAnd I was looking around and I was like, I have my old computer with a 3080 Ti, and then
01:05SPEAKERI have the kiddo's computer with a 3080 Ti.
01:09SPEAKERAnd Unreal has this thing called Swarm that's just built in that if I run a coordinator
01:14SPEAKERon one of the machines and give it some hard drive space, and then run the Swarm client
01:20SPEAKERand put the Swarm on and Unreal on each of the other computers, then it'll just do the
01:27SPEAKERmath.
01:28SPEAKERYeah.
01:29SPEAKERI thought this was going to have to be some ramshackle thing that was going to take days
01:31SPEAKERof setup.
01:32SPEAKERI did not realize they had built it in that elegantly, that it's just like run an installer
01:36SPEAKERon other machines, and now they're helping you make a game?
01:38SPEAKERSo the thing I haven't sussed out yet, and I haven't got to...
01:41SPEAKERThere's a lot of docs.
01:42SPEAKERIt is going to be a little ramshackle, just to be clear.
01:45SPEAKERBut the thing I haven't sussed out yet is if I have to put the projects on all the other
01:51SPEAKERmachines because the project's like 500 gigs, so it's pretty big.
01:54SPEAKERThat's a lot.
01:55SPEAKERYeah.
01:56SPEAKERAt that point, the cost and time of getting the project on all of the different machines,
02:01SPEAKERincluding...
02:02SPEAKERI don't think my daughter's SSD is big enough to hold 500 gigs of project and the stuff
02:05SPEAKERthat she uses her computer for, honestly.
02:07SPEAKERSo there may be no upside.
02:10SPEAKERI'm kind of curious if running this on the 3080 and the 4090 at the same time is going
02:14SPEAKERto give me any appreciable benefit because the 4090 can do like 1200 rays per second
02:21SPEAKERor something.
02:22SPEAKER1200 mega rays per second.
02:24SPEAKER1200 mega rays.
02:26SPEAKERIt's very much like a...
02:29SPEAKERIt's like a Sega ad from the '90s.
02:32SPEAKERWe do more mega rays than NES don't or something.
02:35SPEAKERAnyway, the point is, I don't know if there's going to be an upside to running this on last
02:42SPEAKERgen, not high-end hardware when I'm comparing it to what I'm running on on the main PC.
02:47SPEAKERSo I might set it up on just two PCs and see what happens, and then if it's faster, I'll
02:51SPEAKERrun on the other.
02:52SPEAKERBut also by the time I get it done, probably it will be done because there's like 25 levels
02:58SPEAKERand I'm through five of them already.
03:00SPEAKERGetting down to it.
03:01SPEAKERDoes it have to run on the GPU?
03:02SPEAKERNo, you can do it on the CPU, but it takes like 10 hours per level on the CPU still.
03:08SPEAKERIt's substantial.
03:09SPEAKERWhat card is in your daughter's machine out of curiosity?
03:11SPEAKERShe's a 3080, I think.
03:13SPEAKEROh, wow.
03:14SPEAKERWow.
03:15SPEAKEROkay.
03:16SPEAKERLook, when good things run downhill in this house, so...
03:18SPEAKERFair.
03:19SPEAKERYeah, I get it.
03:20SPEAKERI know how it goes.
03:21SPEAKERI would love to hear about the outcome of your growing network of, is this rig going
03:27SPEAKERto achieve sentience at some point?
03:28SPEAKERI don't know.
03:29SPEAKERGod, I hope not.
03:30SPEAKERIf I have an hour or two to set it up this weekend, I'll put it together and we'll see.
03:35SPEAKEREven if I don't get it done and use it for the actual game, I might set it up and do
03:39SPEAKERit just to have the experience because it's like literally in like '96 when I was making
03:45SPEAKERQuake Rocket Arena levels, Quake 1 Rocket Arena levels, I was like, I have two computers
03:49SPEAKERhere.
03:50SPEAKERI could do this on a cluster and I could never make that work, the Quake light map rendering
03:54SPEAKERcluster thing.
03:56SPEAKERThere's also just something so highfalutin about the word cluster.
04:00SPEAKERAre you doing HPC in there?
04:01SPEAKERIs this high performance computing or this is like straight up research?
04:05SPEAKERLook, I just need more GPUs, man.
04:07SPEAKERJust give me some more.
04:08SPEAKERI need a workstation board with like 17 GPUs in it and then I'll let it rip.
04:14SPEAKERWhat if you have like six PCIe slots and you just put a bunch of cards in there?
04:18SPEAKERHave all these cards.
04:19SPEAKERSee, that's the thing.
04:20SPEAKERWhen you said you were going to make a cluster, I was like, okay, he's going to spend the
04:24SPEAKERcompany money and order like five more computers and they're all going to be identical, but
04:27SPEAKERthe idea that this is just a makeshift cluster, including your daughter's computer is amazing.
04:31SPEAKERWell, I mean, but that's how it works at game studios, right?
04:35SPEAKERBefore like everybody leaves their computer on when they leave at the end of the day at
04:38SPEAKERa game studio.
04:39SPEAKERAnd then you can do a CPU light bake in like four hours instead of 30.
04:43SPEAKERWow.
04:44SPEAKERYou already got all that nice workstation hardware just sitting around.
04:47SPEAKEROr just a bunch of off the shelf commodity computers, because that's the way most game
04:50SPEAKERgame developers don't have workstation money usually.
04:55SPEAKERLook, the definition of workstation is a bit flexible these days, let's say.
04:59SPEAKERThat's true.
05:00SPEAKER[MUSIC PLAYS]
05:28SPEAKERWelcome to Brad and Will Made a Tech Pod.
05:31SPEAKERI'm Will.
05:32SPEAKERI'm Brad.
05:33SPEAKERHello.
05:34SPEAKERHello, Brad.
05:35SPEAKERHi.
05:36SPEAKERHi.
05:37SPEAKERHi.
05:38SPEAKERIt's early.
05:39SPEAKERWe're recording early for the first time in quite a while, but it's a busy day today.
05:41SPEAKERThis might be the earliest we've ever recorded.
05:43SPEAKERWe said 7 a.m.
05:44SPEAKERIt is now 742.
05:45SPEAKERNo, we recorded some FOSPODs with people in Europe at 7 a.m.
05:48SPEAKEROf course.
05:49SPEAKEROr six in a couple of cases, I think.
05:51SPEAKERHave we ever done a six maybe?
05:53SPEAKERSome of those people were like, I would like to record at four o'clock in the afternoon.
05:57SPEAKERAnd I was like, oh, okay.
05:59SPEAKERThat sounds great.
06:00SPEAKERAnyway, we're here.
06:01SPEAKERWe're talking about something open source again, I guess.
06:04SPEAKERYeah.
06:05SPEAKERAdjaisance.
06:06SPEAKERYeah.
06:07SPEAKERValve was kind enough.
06:08SPEAKERWell, the Valve last week announced a new Steam Deck.
06:11SPEAKERThe Steam Deck OLED.
06:12SPEAKERNew-ish.
06:13SPEAKERI would call it a mid-season refresh, I think.
06:16SPEAKERA rev.
06:17SPEAKERYeah.
06:18SPEAKERIt's like the 1.5 version.
06:19SPEAKERIt's not quite a two.
06:21SPEAKERYeah.
06:22SPEAKERDefinitely.
06:23SPEAKERBut it's like that Switch refresh.
06:25SPEAKERThat nice one that you looked at and you're like, man, that's a pretty nice looking Switch.
06:28SPEAKERBut we're also getting near the end of the Switch generation.
06:30SPEAKERMaybe I'll...
06:31SPEAKERI don't know if I'm going to get an OLED Switch now, and then my wife was like, hey, I want
06:33SPEAKERa Switch.
06:34SPEAKERWill you get me that new OLED one?
06:35SPEAKERI was like, yes.
06:36SPEAKERI will get you that new OLED one.
06:37SPEAKERNow you don't have a choice.
06:38SPEAKERYeah.
06:39SPEAKERSo...
06:40SPEAKERYeah.
06:41SPEAKERI actually said that on the next Lander podcast when we talked about this thing, how much
06:43SPEAKERit's like the Switch OLED.
06:44SPEAKERLike it's actually kind of shockingly like it, you know, like slightly bigger OLED screen,
06:49SPEAKERslightly, just barely, barely faster internals, better battery life, a little bit.
06:53SPEAKERBut it's, you know, it's like kind of almost all the bullet points are just slightly better.
06:57SPEAKERWell, so on this one, it feels like they wanted to do the OLED version, which makes a lot
07:02SPEAKERof sense because some of the competitors that are coming out in the wake of the launch steam
07:06SPEAKERdeck are OLED, and there's real benefits to that.
07:12SPEAKERThe rest of it, I think, follows on from, hey, if you're going to redesign the board
07:15SPEAKERto work with OLED, the box to work with OLED, then you can do things like, you know, update
07:21SPEAKERthe SOC and change the way the power supply works and kind of stuff like that.
07:28SPEAKERThe internal charging, charging, charging ecosystem rather.
07:33SPEAKERSo, so yeah, not the 2.0, it's a mid-season refresh with a really nice screen.
07:37SPEAKERThe battery life is slightly better because there's more, more space, you know, the package
07:43SPEAKERfor an LCD versus the package for an OLED takes up less volume inside the box.
07:48SPEAKERThe box is essentially identical.
07:50SPEAKERLike the OLED one has a red button on top and the not OLED button has a not red power
07:56SPEAKERbutton.
07:57SPEAKERThat's how you know.
07:58SPEAKERYeah.
07:59SPEAKERThat's the way you can tell.
08:00SPEAKERThe sticks are a little bit different.
08:01SPEAKERThey did a couple of other things like the, the first Rev sticks tended to collect skin
08:05SPEAKERcruft around the, like the top is in a solid piece cause it has those touch sensitive sticks.
08:11SPEAKERSo like they, they redesigned the top of the sticks so they can, so they theoretically
08:15SPEAKERwill collect less skin goo in the groove there.
08:19SPEAKERI don't want human on my electronics.
08:21SPEAKERI don't know about you.
08:22SPEAKERThis is a personal device, so it's my human, so I'm okay with it, but I don't even like
08:26SPEAKERthat.
08:27SPEAKERBut you know, I get the brush out and brush the goo out every once in a while.
08:31SPEAKERSo, so is, is the form factor identical enough that you could just put it right in a case
08:35SPEAKERfor the original steam deck and it would fit without issue.
08:37SPEAKEROkay.
08:38SPEAKERSo it weighs 5% less.
08:39SPEAKERI think that's the only way you could distinguish it from the outside if you didn't look at
08:43SPEAKERthe red button.
08:44SPEAKERAll right.
08:45SPEAKERUm, the, the form factor is identical, the ergonomics are the same, the touch pads are
08:50SPEAKERlike, like I said, some of the mechanics inside are a little bit different, but for the most
08:53SPEAKERpart, everything feels exactly the same.
08:55SPEAKERThe buttons feel the same.
08:56SPEAKERThe D pad feels the same.
08:57SPEAKERThe sticks feel the same.
08:58SPEAKERUh, the touch screen at the screen is a little bit larger cause it is an OLED, so it's 7.4
09:04SPEAKERinches versus seven inches.
09:05SPEAKERIt's the same resolution, which is also like the, the switch OLED, I believe.
09:10SPEAKERYeah.
09:11SPEAKERIt's weird because the, like a lot of reviewers are reporting the resolution is 1280 by 720.
09:17SPEAKERThe steam site reports the resolution for both, both devices is 1280 by 800.
09:22SPEAKERI don't exactly know what it's hard to tell on the internals, which what is, what is actually
09:26SPEAKERtrue.
09:27SPEAKERThe, the OS I think reports 1280 by 800.
09:29SPEAKERSo, okay.
09:30SPEAKERYeah.
09:31SPEAKERI think that was the same as the original.
09:32SPEAKERYeah.
09:33SPEAKERAlso just like the switch OLED, it's slightly bigger screen, but same resolution.
09:36SPEAKERSo the pixel density technically is just slightly lower, but it's probably not noticeable in
09:40SPEAKERpractice.
09:41SPEAKERWell, and the, the, because it's an OLED, the blacks are really, really good.
09:44SPEAKERSo you get like less dithering on, on like dark scenes and stuff like that.
09:48SPEAKERLike the, for example, the, the launch screens, it has like little, little, uh, like pre-roll,
09:55SPEAKERlike, you know, like the little logos that play when you turn on a console, you can download
09:59SPEAKERa whole boatload of those.
10:00SPEAKERThere's a couple of them that are on solid black backgrounds.
10:03SPEAKERAnd so when you turn it on laying in bed at night, it just looks like a steam logo floating
10:07SPEAKERin space in front of you in a dark room, basically.
10:10SPEAKERThat's amazing.
10:11SPEAKERThat's pretty good.
10:12SPEAKERThat's pretty good.
10:13SPEAKERI don't, I don't have a steam deck, but can I just shout out valve for a allowing you
10:16SPEAKERto customize the boot up animation because I've never seen that in any kind of console
10:19SPEAKERlike device before.
10:20SPEAKERAnd that's amazing.
10:21SPEAKERBut B even having a boot up animation at all, because I don't know why every other console
10:27SPEAKERhas basically except kind of the X-Box has abandoned the lost art of the console boot
10:32SPEAKERup animation, but I love them.
10:34SPEAKERAnd it's the saddest thing in the world that nobody does them anymore.
10:36SPEAKERWell, I assume it's because like they don't need them anymore.
10:39SPEAKERRight?
10:40SPEAKERI guess.
10:41SPEAKERI don't know.
10:42SPEAKERThey do do them, but like with the sleep states, you just don't see them very often.
10:44SPEAKERLike my PlayStation.
10:45SPEAKEROh, PS five has nothing now or just, well, I mean, it has the sparkly as it fades into
10:50SPEAKERthe login screen, but I'm talking like a, like a gala logo and, and animation treatment
10:56SPEAKERwith cool music kind of thing.
10:58SPEAKERLike the game cube, the three 60 PlayStation two, like there have been such good examples
11:03SPEAKERof those.
11:04SPEAKERAnyway, bring them back, please.
11:05SPEAKERSo valve did these in the most valve way possible by making part of the steam point store.
11:10SPEAKERSo your loyalty points can be traded in for different, different launch screens.
11:15SPEAKERWait, can you not just, can you not just like copy your own file in?
11:18SPEAKERYou can also copy your own files, but like the ones that they made are pretty like, there's
11:23SPEAKERlike, they're, they're pretty good.
11:24SPEAKERYou can, you can go look at them even if you don't have a steam deck, I guess is what I'm
11:27SPEAKERsaying.
11:28SPEAKERYou can also get replacement keyboard skins for at the point store as well.
11:33SPEAKERAnyway.
11:34SPEAKERUm, so that's it, this is, it's a little bit early for this, like in the, in the life cycle,
11:39SPEAKERexcept for the, you know, PC life cycles, shorter than console life cycle.
11:44SPEAKERUm, the, the steam deck was announced in July of 2021, I think in a non pandemic world,
11:50SPEAKERthey probably would have started selling them then, uh, they shipped units in February of
11:55SPEAKER2022.
11:56SPEAKERLike they were widely available by that summer.
11:58SPEAKERI got mine in June, um, and a bazillion, like multiple companies have shipped competitors,
12:04SPEAKERlike big companies, small companies.
12:05SPEAKERThere's a ton of weird stuff out of China that is like small PC that runs steam OS kind
12:11SPEAKERof, and that you can do steam decky stuff on.
12:15SPEAKERYeah.
12:16SPEAKERUh, like, uh, so you just put out the ROG Ally, Lenovo just put out the Legion Go, which
12:20SPEAKERI saw one of those in person at PC world and they are gigantic.
12:23SPEAKERYeah.
12:24SPEAKERUm, I, a Neo is one of those companies in China that has, I think, I believe it's I
12:30SPEAKERa Neo.
12:31SPEAKERIf you're on our discord, go to the mister and emulation channel and scroll back a little
12:34SPEAKERbit.
12:35SPEAKERI, a Neo just announced like eight or 10 different new handhelds, all in different form factors.
12:40SPEAKERLike there's one that looks like a game boy.
12:42SPEAKERThere's one that's got a slide on it, like the old Nokia or, um, uh, sidekick and stuff
12:47SPEAKERlike that.
12:48SPEAKERLike they, they are going ham on just like every kind of handheld you can handhelds are
12:52SPEAKERbig business office.
12:54SPEAKERThis is what the China manufacturing process can do.
12:57SPEAKERIt's it's kind of remarkable, but anyway, um, and then they announced the OLED November,
13:01SPEAKERlike November 16th.
13:02SPEAKERSo shorter than I like, I knew it hadn't been that long, but when you put these dates out
13:07SPEAKERlike this, like steam decks have only been in people's hands for about a year and a half.
13:12SPEAKERAnd now here we are with a, like I said, I think in a non pandemic world, we would have
13:17SPEAKERhad steam decks six months earlier than we did properly.
13:20SPEAKERUm, I think maybe we'll get into this as we talk about different aspects of this thing,
13:24SPEAKERbut I wonder if there are supply chain realities that made it more expedient to just go ahead
13:28SPEAKERand do this.
13:29SPEAKERAnd it's not just purely, they pushed for this, but it was more like, Oh, we should
13:33SPEAKERdo this.
13:34SPEAKERCause the parts are now available and maybe even cheaper.
13:36SPEAKERI think that, um, like look, so gamers next is to a good tear down, which we'll talk about
13:40SPEAKERin a minute, which we can get into some of that stuff.
13:42SPEAKERUh, but I guess before we go any further, I should just lead with this steam deck.
13:46SPEAKERIf you don't know, is a handheld gaming PC that costs like around 300, $500, depending
13:53SPEAKERon which model you get.
13:54SPEAKERUh, and it has an AMD SOC system on a chip in it running arch Linux, and it uses this,
14:00SPEAKERthis, uh, software emulation layer called proton that basically lets you run windows
14:05SPEAKERnormalize windows games on Linux at, in a performant way.
14:09SPEAKERUh, uh, so, so you can play, so you can play not quite all, but a lot of your mostly single
14:15SPEAKERplayer steam games on Linux relatively easily.
14:20SPEAKERAnd then I also played like Diablo four on, before it was on steam, I was able to like
14:24SPEAKERload battle net on the Linux box and, and play Diablo four on my steam deck as well
14:30SPEAKERthis summer.
14:31SPEAKERSo like, God, it's also weird that Diablo four is on steam, but anyway, I mean, that's
14:37SPEAKERa whole other thing.
14:38SPEAKERLike the fact that the fact that like every call of duty that wasn't on steam before is
14:43SPEAKERalso available for the steam awards this year because it was newly released on steam this
14:48SPEAKERyear.
14:49SPEAKERYeah.
14:50SPEAKERYeah.
14:51SPEAKERAnyway.
14:52SPEAKERUm, so, okay, let me, let me add to that real quick.
14:53SPEAKERYou can also just run windows on your steep deck.
14:55SPEAKERYou can, when I first got it, I probably would have said, Hey, you should maybe think about
15:00SPEAKERthis.
15:01SPEAKERIf you're serious about playing like games that are, that have, for example, DRM or anti
15:06SPEAKERcheat that doesn't work on Linux, right?
15:08SPEAKERCause like easy and I cheat a lot of the anti cheat stuff doesn't just like they, because
15:13SPEAKERit's kernel level.
15:14SPEAKERIt's not going to work with proton ever.
15:15SPEAKERAnd the developers have to actively support it by writing Linux, uh, Linux run times,
15:19SPEAKERwhich weirdly Tim Epic isn't going to write a easy anti cheat binaries for Linux.
15:26SPEAKERSo the Fortnite can run on this, on the valve steam deck.
15:29SPEAKERI don't understand why anyway, uh, the, uh, it's the hardware changes.
15:35SPEAKERLike I said, physically the shell feels the same.
15:36SPEAKERIt's 20, it's literally 29 grams lighter.
15:39SPEAKERThat's less.
15:40SPEAKERThat's about the amount of coffee that I put in my grinder every morning.
15:43SPEAKERI can't feel 29 grams in my hands.
15:45SPEAKERReally.
15:46SPEAKERI think mice and mice are my context for this recently.
15:50SPEAKERI think like about 30 grams is like a decent reduction in mouse weights because people
15:55SPEAKERcare about mouse weights a lot these days, but, but not a huge one.
15:59SPEAKERMy mouse weighs 58 grams.
16:01SPEAKERSo it's two of these.
16:02SPEAKERThat's too light.
16:03SPEAKERThat thing's going to blow away in the wind.
16:05SPEAKERYeah.
16:06SPEAKERYeah.
16:07SPEAKERIt turns out it's been on my desk for awhile.
16:08SPEAKERAnyway.
16:09SPEAKERUm, the screen 7.4 inches versus seven inches.
16:11SPEAKERIt's the same size cut out in the case.
16:13SPEAKERI bought a new screen protector for this one and just jammed it on there as the same exact
16:17SPEAKERone is for the, for the steam, all of the non OLED steam deck.
16:21SPEAKERUh, it, it has the way they described the brightness of the OLED screen is that it's
16:26SPEAKER600 nits, but it can spike up regionally to a hundred and different places for bright
16:30SPEAKERareas.
16:31SPEAKERI started to a thousand and bright areas.
16:33SPEAKEROh, thousands.
16:34SPEAKERIt's not that's most slouch.
16:37SPEAKERI have never turned it up to full brightness once and then immediately turned it down.
16:41SPEAKERYeah, like a thousand on a handheld, a battery operated handheld is quite good.
16:45SPEAKERI think my TV, which is pretty bright as TVs go tops out at like 1500, I think.
16:50SPEAKERYeah.
16:51SPEAKERIt's like a thousand to 1500 is the, is the range for TVs.
16:55SPEAKEROLEDs I think are a little bit dimmer than LCDs usually.
16:58SPEAKERYeah.
16:59SPEAKERUm, uh, it has a much wider gamut than the original OLED at the original LCD steam deck.
17:03SPEAKERIt's 102% of the DCI P3 gamut versus 48.5% on the old screen.
17:10SPEAKERActually you can beat a hundred percent of DCI P3.
17:13SPEAKERApparently.
17:14SPEAKERYes.
17:15SPEAKERUh, and it supports HDR, but only at least for right now, only in the steam, like 10
17:20SPEAKERfoot UI, not on the steam desktop.
17:22SPEAKERCause like, because this is a Linux machine, you can actually shell out to the arch desktop
17:27SPEAKERand do like Linux stuff.
17:29SPEAKERIf you want to install emulators or whatever, uh, the HDR stuff doesn't work there.
17:35SPEAKERIt's worth mentioning.
17:36SPEAKERI think that this is the first HDR implementation for Linux that they did for this device.
17:41SPEAKERYeah.
17:42SPEAKERAs frequently as a common daily Linux user, I would believe that that had not been approached
17:46SPEAKERbefore now.
17:47SPEAKERWell, well, but I mean, it's important for games because a games are kind of the one,
17:52SPEAKERone of two real HDR applications that are fairly mainstream right now.
17:56SPEAKERThe other one being movies, uh, the, the, that means that the other OLED steam deck
18:03SPEAKERcompetitors don't necessarily support HDR in your games in the same way that this, that
18:09SPEAKERthis device does.
18:10SPEAKERYeah.
18:11SPEAKERYeah.
18:12SPEAKERThat's actually one of the cool things about the steam deck and valves contributions to
18:16SPEAKERLinux, which you will hear more about in the forthcoming FOS pod.
18:18SPEAKERI swear it's still coming.
18:19SPEAKERUh, but, but they, you know, they, they are driving a lot of development of various Linux
18:22SPEAKERfeatures and subsystems forward a lot faster than they would be otherwise because they
18:26SPEAKERhave the weight of this device and its success behind them.
18:30SPEAKERExactly.
18:31SPEAKERSo like there's a conversation often about the res, well, okay, first off the OLED blacks
18:37SPEAKERare like, I have a phone that's an OLED screen, I guess, which is the main, my main interaction
18:43SPEAKERwith OLED screens.
18:44SPEAKERI guess I've had VR headsets that had OLED screens.
18:46SPEAKERI think the blacks are crazy good.
18:50SPEAKERLike it is so nice when you look at this thing, especially in a dark room, it's, it's, it's
18:55SPEAKERlike looking at, I don't know, it's hard to, it's hard to describe how good it is to look
19:00SPEAKERat into the void.
19:02SPEAKERYeah.
19:03SPEAKERThere's, there's, there's no, I, you forget how much your brain filters out the dithering
19:09SPEAKERthat happens on most LCD screens in the dark grays to black areas.
19:13SPEAKERAnd that just doesn't exist on this thing at all.
19:16SPEAKERYeah.
19:17SPEAKERYeah.
19:18SPEAKERAnd there are battery life benefits, right.
19:19SPEAKERAnd a mobile device to having parts of the screen that can just turn off when not needed.
19:22SPEAKERYeah.
19:23SPEAKERIt's like the discord trick to make your, your discord go to OLED friendly mode on the
19:28SPEAKERphone where like you just, the black pixels just don't take any energy to render.
19:35SPEAKERIt doesn't support the, the display on the device doesn't support a variable refresh
19:40SPEAKERrates.
19:41SPEAKERI does support multiple refresh rates off of the 90 refresh rates.
19:45SPEAKERPeople are saying you can go down to 20 Hertz with some hacks.
19:47SPEAKERI think out of the box, it does 30 and 40 and 60 and 90 the, if you plug it into the
19:55SPEAKERdock and plug it into a TV that supports variable refresh rate, it will support variable refresh
20:01SPEAKERrate in that mode.
20:02SPEAKERSo you can do an external variable refresh rate display, but not the internal screen.
20:06SPEAKEROkay.
20:07SPEAKERBefore we move on from the screen, I'm going to pepper one of my supply chain questions
20:10SPEAKERin here about OLEDs.
20:11SPEAKERDo you think, are we getting to the point where supply chain realities are such that
20:16SPEAKERit actually is more cost effective or like the economies of scale are now there where
20:20SPEAKERit makes more sense to go OLED than LCD.
20:22SPEAKERI don't know if we're quite at that tipping point yet, but another thing informing this
20:26SPEAKERquestion is like leaks are coming out about the next iPhone se which has Apple's low end
20:32SPEAKERbudget iPhone.
20:33SPEAKERYeah.
20:34SPEAKERAnd the rumor is they're going to an OLED screen on that thing as well.
20:37SPEAKERAnd that made me wonder like, okay, is it actually just more cost effective to build
20:42SPEAKERwith OLED now or are we getting there than LCDs?
20:45SPEAKERI think, I mean, I think the benefits are the lack of the smaller volume inside the
20:50SPEAKERdevice.
20:51SPEAKERSo if you're talking about something that's small, like a phone that lets them increase
20:55SPEAKERthe power of the CP, especially on the se, which is a relatively small volume compared
20:59SPEAKERto modern phones, the, the, that means that they can bump up the CPU APU or SOC in that
21:06SPEAKERdevice higher to have a higher performance and higher TDP and still have decent battery
21:12SPEAKERlife would be my guess because like the battery is substantially larger, hold on.
21:17SPEAKERIt's a 50 watt hour versus a 40 watt hour battery in the new one, in the new Steam Deck
21:22SPEAKEROLED, which is a, you know, a 25% increase in volume for the battery because it's not
21:27SPEAKERlike the density has gotten better on the energy there.
21:30SPEAKERSo like that means that battery is a lot bigger than it was previously.
21:34SPEAKEROkay.
21:35SPEAKERYeah.
21:36SPEAKERMaybe it's the, maybe it's the other benefits of OLED and more than more so than cost because
21:39SPEAKERI mean, I'm sure OLEDs are getting cheaper to manufacture with, but so I'm sure LCDs
21:43SPEAKERalso continue to drop.
21:45SPEAKERSo maybe it's not a cost thing.
21:46SPEAKERIt's more just the other benefits are yeah, I mean, OLEDs are definitely like, I think
21:51SPEAKERthe Delta between the two is lower than it's ever been now.
21:53SPEAKERAnd that's going to continue to be true every minute of every day from here forward.
21:57SPEAKERRight.
21:58SPEAKERBut I, I think, I think I don't think that there are easy answers for manufacturing on
22:04SPEAKERthis kind of stuff.
22:05SPEAKERLike it is cause like they get better battery life because of the OLED blacks.
22:09SPEAKERThey also get better battery life because of the increased battery size, but that means
22:14SPEAKERthat they are then going to have to spend more on the battery.
22:16SPEAKERSo it's going to like, there's, there's a ton of downstream costs and they had to completely
22:19SPEAKERredesign the inside of the box basically.
22:22SPEAKERRight.
22:23SPEAKERLet's do we want to talk about the resolution?
22:27SPEAKERI feel like the resolution comes up a lot and I, I, I kind of felt like, Oh, it's a
22:32SPEAKERbummer that this isn't a 10 ADP thing until I started using it.
22:36SPEAKERAnd then when I realized where the limits of power for the SOC are like 1280 by 800,
22:42SPEAKER1280 by seven 20, it makes a lot of sense.
22:44SPEAKERI think.
22:45SPEAKERYeah.
22:46SPEAKERFor games.
22:47SPEAKERI mean, that's, that's the thing.
22:48SPEAKERWould you really want it to be 10 ADP with the realities of, of, of its performance even
22:51SPEAKERat seven 20 already, I think at the screen size you're dealing with on this thing, especially
22:57SPEAKERrunning at seven 20 P and running at 12 80, 10 ADP would eat significant battery for very
23:03SPEAKERlittle benefit.
23:04SPEAKERYeah.
23:05SPEAKEREspecially in a world where you can run FSR on this device and get like upscaling and
23:09SPEAKERall that.
23:10SPEAKERAnd it doesn't make a ton of sense anyway.
23:12SPEAKERSo the screen's real good.
23:13SPEAKERLike it's, it's, it's the screen is fantastic.
23:15SPEAKERIf you have a first gen steam deck, it's, I don't think the screen is a reason to like,
23:20SPEAKERit's the screen is good.
23:21SPEAKERIt's the best thing about it.
23:23SPEAKERI don't think it's, Hey, I got to get rid of my old steam deck and get a new street
23:26SPEAKERsteam deck territory.
23:27SPEAKERI think you hold off and wait for the second rev or maybe the third, depending on how you
23:31SPEAKERuse it.
23:32SPEAKERRight.
23:33SPEAKERA gamer's nexus did a really good tear down and highlighted a bunch of stuff that's changed
23:37SPEAKERthat valve didn't actually talk about on their press materials.
23:42SPEAKERThey are doing a new rev of the APU of the AMD APU.
23:46SPEAKERIt's the same basic APU.
23:48SPEAKERIt's on a smaller process.
23:49SPEAKERIt's on TSMC's N6 process, which means it's going to be more efficient and probably because
23:56SPEAKERof the way thermal throttling works on these kinds of APUs probably means you get a little
24:01SPEAKERbit more performance in the same thermal envelope.
24:06SPEAKERBut, but, but like not, you know, suddenly, suddenly your, your game that was running
24:11SPEAKERat 10 frames a second, isn't going to run at 60 frames a second.
24:14SPEAKERIt's going to run.
24:15SPEAKERIt's 12 frames per second.
24:16SPEAKERNow it's, it's a pretty negligible and that's another place where the, the switch the switch
24:20SPEAKERrefresh the OLED and the, and the light also got a slightly die shrunk.
24:24SPEAKERI should've, I should've pulled a new story on this, but I read about this six nanometer
24:27SPEAKERprocess with TSMC and the context of the recent PlayStation five models.
24:32SPEAKERApparently, apparently TSMC has some process where seven, even the seven nanometer designs
24:39SPEAKERcan be shrunk down to six without much work on the part of the client client is client
24:45SPEAKERis the word, I guess like they don't have to like substantially redesign the ship to,
24:50SPEAKERto do that.
24:51SPEAKERAnd I believe that's what happened with the, the newer PS fives as well.
24:53SPEAKERSo that seems like something maybe we'll see more of.
24:55SPEAKERYeah.
24:56SPEAKERThey, they described the steam deck SOC as semi custom, which to me means that they have
25:01SPEAKERput the like valve has said, Hey, we want a couple of things that aren't standard tacked
25:06SPEAKERonto this.
25:09SPEAKERThe one thing that is the big win about the smaller process too, because of the lower
25:13SPEAKERthermals on the, on the CPU portion is that the GPU doesn't clock down as much when it
25:17SPEAKERhits the 15 watt max, max draw.
25:20SPEAKERSo like that actually can have some fairly measurable impacts on games that were GPU
25:27SPEAKERlimited.
25:28SPEAKERYeah.
25:29SPEAKERSo that means like not substantially higher highs in the frame rate, but maybe, maybe
25:33SPEAKERsteady or lows, like maybe, maybe the you're kind of 1% lows are more consistent.
25:38SPEAKERIf you're not having it clocked down a bunch.
25:41SPEAKERIt's not something that I have been able to consciously notice switching back and forth
25:45SPEAKERbetween them playing the same game.
25:47SPEAKERIf that, if that helps sure.
25:50SPEAKERThat's probably good to state, you know, like I'm, I'm sure, in fact, I've seen a fair amount
25:54SPEAKERof hand reading from people who feel like they have not had a steam deck for very long
25:57SPEAKERlooking at this thing, going like, Oh, but maybe it's important to say like, Hey, this
26:01SPEAKERthing is better, but it's not some radical leap forward.
26:05SPEAKERYeah.
26:06SPEAKERIn terms of like performance difference between this one and the old one I don't like it.
26:12SPEAKERIt reminds me of like a 3DS refresh almost right.
26:16SPEAKERWhen, when like they added the DSI stuff and you're like, Oh, this is cool.
26:20SPEAKERIt works in two games, a similar camera on here that they will never, ever use.
26:25SPEAKERYeah, exactly.
26:26SPEAKERThis is more substantial on a camera of course, but it is, but also it's, it is quite literally
26:33SPEAKERI can switch back and forth between them.
26:35SPEAKERAnd unless I'm looking at the red button on the top, I won't, or the finger crust in the
26:40SPEAKERsticks.
26:41SPEAKERI won't know the difference between the two by, by like it's other than this, the screen's
26:48SPEAKERpretty noticeable, depending on whether the game he supports, you're playing supports
26:51SPEAKERHDR or not.
26:52SPEAKERYeah.
26:53SPEAKERThey redesigned the board a lot.
26:55SPEAKERSteve gets into this a lot in the gamers nexus review tear down.
26:58SPEAKERIf you're interested, you should take a look at it.
27:00SPEAKERThey basically disassembled both steam decks and laid out all the parts side by side and
27:06SPEAKERtalked about what's changed in them all the way down to like, like the, the board has
27:12SPEAKERthe previous boards had four memory chips on them.
27:14SPEAKERThese have two there's more memory bandwidth because they're running at 102 gigabytes per
27:20SPEAKERsecond versus 88 gigabytes per second, which I think is a 16% jump.
27:26SPEAKERThe battery's bigger.
27:27SPEAKERThe cooler is flipped upside down.
27:29SPEAKERSo they, they, his, the thought was that they thought that having the intake facing hot
27:34SPEAKERstuff would pull some air over them and that maybe in practice it didn't actually do much.
27:38SPEAKERSo they flipped it around.
27:39SPEAKERSo it was easier to assemble or disassemble or whatever, maybe quieter.
27:44SPEAKERI do notice that when the fan spins up, it's a little bit quieter than the old one, but
27:49SPEAKERthat could also just be lack of dust and cruft in the, in the blades, making the old one
27:54SPEAKERlouder.
27:55SPEAKERLack of human in there.
27:56SPEAKERI mean, man, we are just, we are constant gross humans are constant gross machines.
28:04SPEAKERI happened to be at PC world the day that they announced this thing and I was talking
28:06SPEAKERto Adam about it and he commented just off hand, I didn't actually ask him to elaborate.
28:11SPEAKERHe commented that that extra memory bandwidth would especially matter with an APU.
28:15SPEAKERAnd I was trying to figure out why is it maybe just cause all the compute is on one ship.
28:19SPEAKERSo having CPU and GPU both able to access memory faster is a boon.
28:24SPEAKERYeah.
28:25SPEAKERIt's because the GPU doesn't have discrete memory.
28:26SPEAKERSo the bottleneck is, is harder on the APU.
28:30SPEAKERAlso, it's worth saying pretty much every unreal game for unreal four game ever is memory
28:36SPEAKERbandwidth bound on, on high end GPUs.
28:39SPEAKERI don't know how it works on the APU.
28:41SPEAKERI haven't actually thought about that a lot, but, but like more memory, like more memory
28:46SPEAKERbandwidth is always good.
28:48SPEAKERAdam is correct.
28:49SPEAKERFor sure.
28:50SPEAKERYes.
28:51SPEAKERThe other thing that they did that I actually, I think is this pretty substantial change
28:54SPEAKERthat they didn't, I was surprised they didn't talk about it cause it's kind of a, the first,
28:58SPEAKERthe first steam deck is bad at charging.
29:00SPEAKERLike if you're, if you're charging it when it's off, it's great.
29:04SPEAKERIf you're charging it and playing at the same time, it gets weirdly hot, like not like dangerously
29:10SPEAKERhot, but like, I feel like at this point we know how chargers work and like devices shouldn't
29:14SPEAKERhave to spin up fans to charge, but it definitely was, was running hotter when you plugged it
29:19SPEAKERin.
29:20SPEAKERIf you're playing for a long time, you need to top off the battery and it charged kind
29:23SPEAKERof slow.
29:24SPEAKERI mean, it's a big battery, but, but with a 45 watt charger, I mean, I guess the math
29:30SPEAKERworks out, but it felt like it felt like it always took at least two hours to charge which,
29:36SPEAKERwhich is, which is kind of a lot the, the, the new board, the charging infrastructure
29:41SPEAKERon it is such that it has to, it has double the ingest components in whatever the bits
29:48SPEAKERare that make the electricity go into the device so that it can charge and run more
29:52SPEAKEReffectively.
29:53SPEAKERAnd it doesn't, it doesn't seem to get as hot when you're doing that, which is nice
29:56SPEAKEReven when you're playing a kind of intensive game.
30:00SPEAKERThere's a bunch of other stuff that they put in the box that's kind of minor.
30:03SPEAKERThere's a longer power cable on the led models, which, which, which is two and a half meters
30:08SPEAKERversus one and a half meters before, which sounds stupid, but the extra meter means you
30:12SPEAKERcan sit on a chair and have the power cord running into the, into the device with your
30:18SPEAKERcharging while you're playing.
30:19SPEAKERAnd it's not a hassle.
30:22SPEAKERIt's still a 45 watt charger, a wifi jumped from five to 60, which is, it's hard to tell,
30:30SPEAKERbut I think it's, it's making downloads a little bit faster.
30:32SPEAKERThey also have flipped on the download, the game from your steam install on your desktop
30:37SPEAKERthing across the local network lately, which is hella fast.
30:42SPEAKERThat's awesome.
30:43SPEAKERSo yeah, that's probably runs at line speed practically.
30:47SPEAKERYeah.
30:48SPEAKERIt's it, I think you're saturating the, the SSD on the, on the steam deck probably would
30:53SPEAKERbe my guess for the MMC card, if you're using one of the MMC card slots.
30:57SPEAKERWhat wifi do you have in your house right now?
30:59SPEAKER6E I have two APs, one's a six and one's a 6E.
31:03SPEAKEROh, okay.
31:04SPEAKEROh, can you mix them safely like that?
31:06SPEAKERJust hands off to whichever.
31:09SPEAKERYeah.
31:10SPEAKERJust whichever node you're on gets the fast, the six and 6E it's the throughput isn't that
31:15SPEAKERmuch better.
31:16SPEAKERIt's the, it's the congestion relief stuff.
31:20SPEAKERI just bought the 6E one because it was cheap when I needed a second one.
31:23SPEAKERIt was, it was on sale.
31:26SPEAKERLet's see the there's a two part case now.
31:32SPEAKERSo like if you, the old case was pretty bulky and was designed to carry it around and be
31:36SPEAKERa droppable and all that, there's one big, one big piece, the new one, you can pull out
31:40SPEAKERthe inner liner on and it makes it just like a sleeve to keep it from getting scratched
31:43SPEAKERup.
31:44SPEAKERIf you want to chuck it in like a messenger bag or a backpack or something.
31:46SPEAKERThat's smart.
31:47SPEAKERDoes that case come with every skew?
31:49SPEAKERComes with every skew.
31:50SPEAKERWow.
31:51SPEAKERThat's nice.
31:52SPEAKERTheir packaging is really like, I always feel weird talking about packaging, but as we've
31:56SPEAKERmade more environmentally friendly packaging, it's really good.
31:58SPEAKERTheir packaging or the actual, like if you have it on the shelf in a store is just that
32:03SPEAKERcase with a cardboard sleeve around it and like a, a lock tight thing on the zippers
32:09SPEAKERso you can unzip it.
32:12SPEAKERThe shipping box is just slightly larger than that.
32:16SPEAKERLike it's like that hangs in a frame suspended in one box.
32:19SPEAKERSo it's hardly any cardboard it's, it's, there's no plastic or stuff in the shipping stuff,
32:24SPEAKERwhich is, which is well done.
32:27SPEAKERThere's a special limited edition version that has transparent shell.
32:30SPEAKERI, my question was, Hey, is there going to be an atomic purple one, which to which I
32:36SPEAKERgot smiles and, and it's like polite chuckles.
32:42SPEAKERAnd it still supports, please don't follow the analog model of a bunch of limited edition
32:47SPEAKERcolorway drops that valves not like that.
32:50SPEAKERThey're not going to be like that.
32:52SPEAKERI hope not.
32:53SPEAKERBut like also I would love to have a orange one, like GameCube orange one.
32:57SPEAKERSure.
32:58SPEAKERYeah, you know, I bet, I bet someone can hook you up.
33:02SPEAKERThere's a reasonably robust market for aftermarket parts for these things already.
33:06SPEAKEROh yes.
33:07SPEAKERI believe that.
33:08SPEAKERSo, so you can, and, and they do embrace the iFixit lifestyle.
33:13SPEAKERLike there are guides for, you can, you can buy replacement parts, you can upgrade stuff.
33:18SPEAKERYou can, you can upgrade the SSD internally.
33:20SPEAKERYou can buy replacement sticks, buy replacement screens, buy replacement motherboards, the
33:25SPEAKERwhole thing, like it's user serviceable in a way that is shocking for this kind of device.
33:31SPEAKERAnd it still supports all the stuff that made the old Steam Deck awesome, like Emu deck
33:34SPEAKERand Chiaki, which is the PS, the stream from your PS5 thing, game pass streaming still
33:40SPEAKERworks.
33:41SPEAKERMoonlight works.
33:42SPEAKERAll of the stuff that you're accustomed to is, is still good there.
33:45SPEAKERYeah.
33:46SPEAKERAnd speaking of storage, it seems like they're de-emphasizing the EMMC storage in the, in
33:51SPEAKERthe, in the product line.
33:52SPEAKERYeah, so one of the things I got watching Steve's Gamers Nexus tear down and, and this
33:57SPEAKERmove away from the EMMC thing, first off, I, I had, so I had a 256 gig model original
34:03SPEAKEROLED that I, original LCD Steam Deck that I bought, I put a big MMC card in it.
34:09SPEAKERReally couldn't tell a difference between the MMC and the, and the SSD in terms of like
34:14SPEAKERload times.
34:15SPEAKERInteresting.
34:16SPEAKERThe install times were way worse on the MMC.
34:18SPEAKERSure.
34:19SPEAKERBut like when you're playing the games, it wasn't, it wasn't a big impact.
34:23SPEAKERThe, the, the thing that was rough about the MMCs is that like those cards are just not
34:30SPEAKERsuper reliable.
34:31SPEAKEROh, for sure.
34:32SPEAKERSo just a big SD card.
34:34SPEAKERYeah.
34:35SPEAKERIt's a big SD card that like you're, it's probably, it's probably fine until it isn't.
34:39SPEAKERRight?
34:40SPEAKERYes.
34:41SPEAKERYou'll talk through the pricing real quick and what they've done to the, I think we might
34:45SPEAKERhave skipped over that part.
34:46SPEAKERYeah, I was going to say that for the end of this frame right here, but no, that's fine.
34:50SPEAKERSo the there's three models now that are new.
34:53SPEAKERThey're also selling the old 64 gig MMC models for 350 bucks while they last.
34:58SPEAKERBut they aren't gonna be making more of those.
35:01SPEAKERIt's 450 bucks for the 512 meg, 512 gig OLED, 650 for the one terabyte OLED, 256 gigabytes
35:10SPEAKERfor the LCD version, 256, 256 gigabyte LCD version is $400.
35:16SPEAKERSo it's like a $50 bump for storage and OLED, which feels like a great, pretty good deal
35:22SPEAKERto me.
35:23SPEAKERFor only another $50, once you're already up to 400, it's hard not to get the OLED one.
35:29SPEAKERYeah.
35:30SPEAKERAt the same time, all the other benefits.
35:32SPEAKERAt the same time, that 64 gig EMMC old model, if you can get it for 350 bucks is, is I,
35:40SPEAKERyou should check this before you buy it.
35:41SPEAKERBut my understanding at least at launch was that they still had an SD slot, an NVME slot
35:46SPEAKERin them.
35:47SPEAKERSo you can, if you're comfortable cracking it open and taking it apart, you can buy those
35:50SPEAKERSS.
35:51SPEAKERYou can buy a two terabyte SSD for like 150 bucks now.
35:54SPEAKERSo when you want storage, you can chuck it on somebody on the discord.
35:57SPEAKERIt was, it was a, it was a quick sale, $89 for a crucial two terabyte NVME.
36:02SPEAKERIt's back up to like 110 right now, but like the SSDs are getting so cheap, a 350 steam
36:07SPEAKERdeck and a cheap SSD would be a pretty good deal.
36:09SPEAKERYeah.
36:10SPEAKERAnd well, and you can buy them separately so you can buy one now and then buy the other
36:12SPEAKERone later when you want it.
36:15SPEAKERAnd I will say, like I said, the compromise on the EMC SD card is install time, not play,
36:22SPEAKERnot at play.
36:23SPEAKERSo it's not bad.
36:24SPEAKERI like, my intention is to put an SSD card, an SD card with a whole bunch of ROMs in when
36:29SPEAKERI install EMU deck on the, on the new one.
36:32SPEAKERYeah.
36:33SPEAKER200 for the leap from five 12 to 10, one terabyte OLED is a bit much, are they still doing weird
36:37SPEAKERstuff like, you know, like better reflective coating on the screen for the top tier one
36:41SPEAKERand like exclusive keyboard skin.
36:44SPEAKERIt has the anti glare treatment on the high end one.
36:48SPEAKERThe limited edition version, which I think maybe is already sold out, I'm not sure was,
36:54SPEAKERwas another 50 bucks on top of the 650 bucks.
36:59SPEAKERI think I feel like, like I get why this happens and it's because it's, it's, this is the Apple,
37:07SPEAKERthe phone model leaking over where storage bumps are a thing that people understand.
37:12SPEAKERSo you charge more for the expensive one, having a lot of space is really convenient
37:17SPEAKERon it.
37:18SPEAKERLike I, I, it's still unclear to me how long these devices are going to last for people
37:23SPEAKERlike for, for me, and we can talk about this in a minute.
37:27SPEAKERIf you're playing games on the device, like we're starting to already see the limits as
37:32SPEAKERwe start to see the, the first, I want to say current gen only console games come out.
37:38SPEAKERSo like, I think when we see, for example, Spider-Man 2 land on this thing next year,
37:44SPEAKERMiles Morales runs great on it.
37:45SPEAKERMiles Morales and Spider-Man, which were PS4, PS5 cross, cross gen titles look fantastic,
37:52SPEAKERplay great, really, really wonderful.
37:54SPEAKERMy guess is that the PS5 exclusive games and the Xbox series exclusive games are going
38:00SPEAKERto have started having problems on these.
38:02SPEAKERYeah.
38:03SPEAKERI would believe that.
38:04SPEAKERI was, I was lucky enough to be on the full nerd yesterday with Alex Petalia from Digital
38:09SPEAKERFoundry.
38:10SPEAKEROh yeah.
38:11SPEAKERAnd I posed the thought experiment to him of when do you think a game ships with only
38:16SPEAKERray tracing support?
38:17SPEAKERI think I was going for the kind of maximal question of like, when do you see a game with
38:21SPEAKERno no razzle request lighting at all?
38:25SPEAKERBut he, and I was like, oh, is that 10 years, 15 years, but he actually, he made it a more
38:29SPEAKERrealistic answer of a game that requires ray tracing.
38:32SPEAKERNot necessarily that is pure ray tracing, but he actually said like one to two years,
38:36SPEAKERhe sees games coming out that are going to require hardware level ray tracing.
38:41SPEAKERAnd Spider-Man 2 came up because on the PS5, there is no, even the, even the most reduced
38:48SPEAKERperformance mode on the PS5 version of Spider-Man 2 still has like ray traced reflections and
38:54SPEAKERrequires some level of ray tracing hardware.
38:56SPEAKERSo like, yeah, this does seem like the kind of thing.
38:59SPEAKERI don't, I don't know what feature set that APU supports, like what level of our DNA features
39:03SPEAKERthey have in there or whatever, but like, it does seem like we're going to get to the
39:06SPEAKERpoint where we're going to be back to the old, like the pixel shader days again, right?
39:11SPEAKEROf like, Hey, if your GPU doesn't have pixel shading support, you're not going to play
39:15SPEAKERDoom 3, right?
39:16SPEAKERLike games are going to start requiring actual features on, on newer GPUs at some point.
39:22SPEAKERI think, I mean, so I've been thinking about minimum, minimum spec requirements for PC
39:28SPEAKERgames lately.
39:29SPEAKERAnd spending a lot of time at Steam looking at the hardware survey results as a result
39:33SPEAKERof that, like, you have to remember the 2080s, a four year old card now, right?
39:38SPEAKERLike we're we're everybody, like in a lot of ways, PC hardware went on pause because
39:44SPEAKERof the Bitcoins, the, the Ethereum stuff and, and the, and the pandemic and the longer console
39:50SPEAKERgeneration.
39:51SPEAKERYeah.
39:52SPEAKERAnd, and a very long console generation that also spanned into the first three years of
39:57SPEAKERthe next console generation for a lot of people.
40:01SPEAKERBut at the same time, like we're like a four year old mid-level card has ray tracing support
40:09SPEAKERnow.
40:10SPEAKERRight.
40:11SPEAKERSo I think, I think, I think he's, I think he's actually absolutely right that we're
40:13SPEAKERgoing to see, like, I would not be surprised if we see cards that require ray tracing games
40:17SPEAKERrequire ray tracing in the next six months or a year, whenever I, and, and like that
40:24SPEAKERwe'll leave this hardware behind with an asterisk.
40:28SPEAKERYeah.
40:29SPEAKERAnd the asterisk is the game streaming games from your desktop PC in the other room.
40:34SPEAKERIf you have a big desktop PC in the other room is fucking awesome on this thing with
40:39SPEAKERthe also asterisk that you have to have decent wifi you're running on an old 802.11n network.
40:44SPEAKERIt's not going to be great.
40:45SPEAKERIf you're running on a six or 60 or probably even five network, cause my garage APs of
40:50SPEAKERfive still, I think it works great at in the living room.
40:54SPEAKERIt's really, really good.
40:57SPEAKERIt's gone.
40:58SPEAKERIt's I played, I played as much as almost all of the star field that I played.
41:02SPEAKERI played with this on watching TV, like sitting in the living room at night, hanging out with
41:07SPEAKERthe fam, just kind of doodling at star field.
41:10SPEAKERAnd the experience was really good on the old steam deck.
41:13SPEAKERStream from your PC.
41:14SPEAKERYou mean stream stream from the PC I played, I laid in bed and played cyberpunk last night
41:18SPEAKERI yeah, like generally speaking, if I want to play a big triple a game on the steam deck
41:27SPEAKERand I'm going to be at home, I don't even bother installing it.
41:29SPEAKERI just hit the stream button and stream it from the desktop PC.
41:32SPEAKERIt's wired into the network.
41:33SPEAKERYeah.
41:34SPEAKERThat makes sense.
41:35SPEAKERI mean, I also live in a house that has a high contention for the big TV in the living
41:40SPEAKERroom.
41:41SPEAKERSo but there is a dock out there.
41:43SPEAKERLike I could, I could drop the steam deck into the dock and connect a dual sense to
41:46SPEAKERit and play that way as well, which I have with the old one, I haven't the new one as
41:51SPEAKERmuch.
41:52SPEAKERI haven't had time to do that.
41:53SPEAKERI, like I said earlier, I played Diablo four native on it using battle net.
41:57SPEAKERI've played a couple of origin games.
42:00SPEAKERI installed a park right three from the Ubisoft launcher, like all of the other non steam
42:06SPEAKERPC launchers work.
42:07SPEAKERYou can install Epic even on it.
42:10SPEAKERThe only thing that consistently doesn't work is either stuff that requires a lot of text
42:15SPEAKERinput because the onscreen keyboards kind of a pain in the ass and you're just, you're
42:18SPEAKERjust not going to want to do that.
42:20SPEAKERLike I would never play Baba is you on this probably because of the text input, right?
42:25SPEAKERI'm sure it works.
42:28SPEAKERFortnite rocket league, fall guys, pub G anything that uses easy anti-cheat isn't going to work.
42:36SPEAKERApex legends works because they're anti-cheats compatible.
42:38SPEAKERThey made their anti-cheat compatible.
42:42SPEAKERI don't know.
42:43SPEAKERI don't think it's a good idea, but theoretically you can play counter-strike on this thing
42:45SPEAKERthat'll work.
42:46SPEAKERSure.
42:47SPEAKERSteam has a really pretty granular breakdown of what does and doesn't work on each game,
42:54SPEAKERpartly through cert testing, but partly also through reports from players about things
42:57SPEAKERthey have problems with often, often a game will have the, Hey, this doesn't run too great,
43:04SPEAKERbut the only thing that's the problem is you have to open up manually, open the onscreen
43:08SPEAKERkeyboard to type in your name when you create a character at the very start.
43:11SPEAKERAnd then that's the last thing that doesn't work if it has decent controller support.
43:16SPEAKERSo generally speaking, it's, it's like, you don't get surprises when you're downloading
43:23SPEAKERsomething very often with this the, the, on the streaming stuff, I, Oh, last thing I play
43:32SPEAKERplay a ton.
43:33SPEAKERIt's great.
43:34SPEAKERI play a ton of indie games on it.
43:35SPEAKERIt's basically like indie game switch.
43:38SPEAKERFor me, I was playing dead cells machine or something.
43:41SPEAKERYeah.
43:42SPEAKERI play a lot of dead cells.
43:43SPEAKERI played, I did a complete run through of Hades from start to finish earlier this summer.
43:48SPEAKERI did.
43:49SPEAKERI do play a lot of dead cells.
43:50SPEAKERIt's funny.
43:51SPEAKERYou mentioned that I play I played, I've been playing just on, I played Dave, well, Dave,
43:55SPEAKERthe divers on indie game, but it it's sorry.
43:57SPEAKERYou're sorry.
43:58SPEAKERNo, no, no.
43:59SPEAKERThat's yes.
44:00SPEAKERYou have, you have taken the correct moral position.
44:03SPEAKERI mean, I don't know anyway.
44:09SPEAKERIt's complicated.
44:10SPEAKERWell, Hey, I mean, you're as, as an independent game developer, you have a, you have a valid
44:15SPEAKERperspective on this.
44:16SPEAKERI'm not ever going to fault any independent developer that is, has a game in development
44:22SPEAKERand somebody is like, Hey, we would like to give you a lot of money and buy your studio.
44:25SPEAKERI, I never going to fault.
44:27SPEAKERIf anybody wants to come by our studio, give me a call, please.
44:30SPEAKERSure.
44:31SPEAKERIt's no longer be independent, independent, but if we were independent while the game
44:36SPEAKERwas being made, I might still call that an indie game.
44:39SPEAKERAnyways.
44:40SPEAKERLook, the hardest part of the two hardest parts of game development are making the game
44:46SPEAKERand then also the money stuff, right?
44:50SPEAKERSo yeah, like, like that kind of game runs fabulously on it.
44:53SPEAKERThe battery life is really, really long when you get into stuff like miles Morales or starfield
44:58SPEAKERor cyberpunk running natively on the box.
45:00SPEAKERThe battery life is in, is a couple of three hours, two, three hours, depending on what
45:04SPEAKERsettings you use.
45:06SPEAKERAnd like, if you get into the steam deck subreddit, you can get into like, they're, they're like
45:11SPEAKERmileage hackers telling you exactly what you can install and what settings you can flip
45:16SPEAKERto make your game go from three hours to two hours to three and a half hours.
45:22SPEAKERBut it's still, there's a limited amount of gas in the tank.
45:26SPEAKERThe streaming battery life is insane.
45:28SPEAKERLike I, you can stream for six or eight hours.
45:32SPEAKERLike when I was playing starfield, I didn't plug in at all until I was done playing.
45:35SPEAKERAnd then it would charge back up and I would, I would be fine.
45:40SPEAKERIt, that streaming stuff used to be kind of fiddly, right?
45:43SPEAKERLike for a while there, the summer, there was a bug where the audio would drop out after
45:47SPEAKERlike 10 minutes and then you wouldn't be able to get it back and you'd have to restart the
45:50SPEAKERwhole thing on both computers and they get involved getting up and walking into the office
45:54SPEAKERand fixing, and it just sucked.
45:58SPEAKERFortnite and sunshine, which are the open source implementations of the Nvidia game
46:01SPEAKERstream protocol, solved that completely.
46:05SPEAKERThey're a little bit more fiddly, but not too bad there.
46:07SPEAKERIt's also a much easier way to get non steam games working streaming.
46:13SPEAKERSo if you want to play Fortnite on your steam deck, you can stream it from Epic on your
46:16SPEAKERPC to the steam deck pretty easily.
46:22SPEAKERThe what I will say is when I tried to stream cyberpunk earlier this year, it was a pain
46:28SPEAKERin the ass and it ended up with me walking.
46:30SPEAKERLike I say, it's fiddly.
46:32SPEAKERWhat I mean is you often would have to get up and walk into the office, do something
46:35SPEAKERon the real computer, and then suddenly it would work.
46:38SPEAKERYou'd have to switch the game from full screen to borderless or change the resolution manually
46:43SPEAKERor whatever.
46:44SPEAKERNow it just sets the settings right.
46:45SPEAKERAnd it starts and it's like I clicked the place cyberpunk game button on the steam deck
46:52SPEAKERstream it and it just worked first try out of the box.
46:55SPEAKERIt handled the launcher stuff well.
46:58SPEAKERIt switched between the virtual mouse mode and the controller modes when it needed to.
47:01SPEAKERLike I could use the touch screen to do input on the launcher.
47:05SPEAKERAll of the weird stuff that used to be kind of a pain in the ass just work.
47:09SPEAKERSo props to Valve for the work on that because it is much better.
47:13SPEAKERDidn't drop the sound after 30 minutes, all of that.
47:16SPEAKERI did have to turn HDR on on my monitor to get HDR streaming working.
47:21SPEAKERI didn't think HDR streaming would ever work.
47:23SPEAKERSo I was kind of impressed by that.
47:25SPEAKERThat's impressive.
47:26SPEAKEROver the valve, the steam streaming?
47:28SPEAKEROver the valve stream streaming.
47:29SPEAKERNot moonlight.
47:30SPEAKERNot moonlight.
47:31SPEAKERWow.
47:32SPEAKERYeah, that's cool.
47:33SPEAKERYeah.
47:34SPEAKERAnd again, that was like I changed the settings in cyberpunk to turn HDR on once I turned
47:38SPEAKERon the HDR monitor.
47:39SPEAKERI assume that if you don't have an HDR monitor hooked up to your PC, you can't stream HDR
47:43SPEAKERto the steam deck.
47:44SPEAKERWhich cyberpunk HDR did you use?
47:46SPEAKERBecause it has two and I'm not sure which one to use.
47:48SPEAKERI've never heard of either one of them.
47:51SPEAKERI think they are HDR 10 PQ and or I think it's PQ and the other one is SC RGB.
47:58SPEAKERI don't know what those HDRs are.
48:00SPEAKERMy monitor only supported one of them.
48:02SPEAKERSo I chose the one that is supported.
48:04SPEAKEROkay.
48:05SPEAKERI guess my TV must support too, but they look the same to me.
48:07SPEAKEROh yeah.
48:08SPEAKERAnd just to test, I did, I did, you know, you can disconnect a steam deck and then reconnect
48:12SPEAKERto another steam to another streaming endpoint.
48:16SPEAKERAnd I connected the HDR cyberpunk to the old steam deck and boy, was that a mess.
48:21SPEAKERSo it was actually streaming across the HDR, which was kind of nice.
48:28SPEAKERAnd apparently the last thing that I saw this morning was doing like last notes is that
48:32SPEAKERnow you can, it supports external storage.
48:34SPEAKERSo if you have like a USB SSD plugged into your steam doc, your steam deck doc, then
48:41SPEAKERyou can have a whole host of games to just like when you plug it in, did they just show
48:44SPEAKERup in your library?
48:45SPEAKERYeah.
48:46SPEAKERThat's cool.
48:47SPEAKERYeah.
48:48SPEAKERSo that's the steam deck.
48:49SPEAKERI think it's pretty good.
48:50SPEAKERYeah.
48:51SPEAKERIf I was buying one today, I would buy one of the OLED ones.
48:53SPEAKERYeah.
48:54SPEAKERFor 50 bucks.
48:55SPEAKERYeah.
48:56SPEAKERLike we said, for, for, for an extra 50 bucks, it seems like a no brainer for all the, all
48:59SPEAKERthe marginal, but significant improvements.
49:01SPEAKERYeah.
49:02SPEAKERAnd if they sold OLED, if they sold atomic purple or what was the Nintendo game cube
49:06SPEAKERorange color spice orange, I believe was the name spice orange.
49:11SPEAKERI would buy a spice orange shell for this thing.
49:13SPEAKERLike, like a, you couldn't, they couldn't take my money fast enough.
49:17SPEAKERPumpkin spice game cube.
49:19SPEAKERFuck that.
49:20SPEAKERI want spice orange.
49:21SPEAKERThat's that's spice orange is like, is like the spice melange Brad and the sleeper must
49:25SPEAKERawaken.
49:26SPEAKERYeah.
49:27SPEAKERSo that's, that's it.
49:29SPEAKERI think it's good.
49:30SPEAKERI, I find myself using the steam deck.
49:33SPEAKERIt's not every day, but most days I pick it up and use it for something in a house where
49:38SPEAKERyou have a use case for a handheld.
49:40SPEAKERIt seems like a pretty, if not the handheld to get the one thing that I'm, I didn't get
49:45SPEAKERa chance to do, because we haven't, it hasn't been sunny here is I was hoping that I could
49:49SPEAKERgo out and like ride in the car and see if I could use it in the car.
49:53SPEAKERCause the old one just, just fundamentally didn't ever get bright enough to use in like
49:57SPEAKERa bright car in the summertime.
50:01SPEAKERBut yeah, that's, that that's next, I guess, TBD.
50:05SPEAKERI wrote down the word steam deck two here.
50:07SPEAKERWe covered this on the next Lander podcast a little bit.
50:10SPEAKERWas it the verge?
50:12SPEAKERSomebody talked to Pierre Lou graffiti valve and asked just like, Hey, what about an actual
50:18SPEAKERnew steam deck with new guts and everything that gave a very, I would say an answer that
50:24SPEAKERwas both very direct and very noncommittal in that they said like, Hey, we're always
50:28SPEAKERlooking at the state of APUs and batteries and like all the things that make up a steam
50:32SPEAKERdeck, but like we don't have any explicit plans yet, but, but specifically what they
50:37SPEAKERsaid was like, we really value consistency and performance target and battery life.
50:41SPEAKERAnd we're not going to like rush into a second steam deck until those, until those, you know,
50:47SPEAKERthose, those vectors converge in a place that we're happy with on faster hardware.
50:51SPEAKERSo I think they didn't like say two years away, but I think there was some kind of language
50:56SPEAKERthat was sort of like at least, at least two or three years before there's hardware that
51:00SPEAKERis up to snuff.
51:01SPEAKERI think Lawrence Yang has been quoted, this is the worst way to attribute something, but
51:07SPEAKERI have seen at Lawrence Yang, a quote attributed as saying that you shouldn't expect anything
51:11SPEAKERbefore 2025, which, which like, if we're thinking about what the next gate is on what games
51:18SPEAKERyou'll be able to play on these things, it is, Hey, they need an APU that can do whatever
51:23SPEAKERmin spec ray tracing will be going forward.
51:26SPEAKERAnd, and that's, that seems like it's a ways off.
51:29SPEAKERYeah.
51:30SPEAKERIt seems like a kind of a quiet year next year on some fronts, like no new steam deck.
51:34SPEAKERLike the rumors are that there will not be a new Nvidia generation next year.
51:37SPEAKERThat's going to be 25 as well.
51:39SPEAKERI mean, they're usually like Nvidia is if their stuff is selling well, they'll do an
51:44SPEAKER18 month cycle without hesitation.
51:46SPEAKERRight.
51:47SPEAKERAnd that's just a little bit of an extension for that.
51:49SPEAKERYes.
51:50SPEAKERI think, I mean, I, I don't like the, honestly, the only thing I don't like about this model
51:58SPEAKERis that the ergonomics aren't always, it is not super comfortable ergonomically.
52:04SPEAKERIt is, it is if you're sitting and playing in your lap, but then you're looking down
52:07SPEAKERon your head.
52:08SPEAKERIf I'm propped up in bed, it often puts my wrist in a situation that I don't like.
52:12SPEAKERYeah.
52:13SPEAKERI think even the switch is that way for me and this thing is way bigger and heavier.
52:16SPEAKERSo like there needs to be like people, people should make some like handheld pillows.
52:20SPEAKERWell, so the, the, I have switched grips that I bought at target for like 15 bucks that
52:25SPEAKERclip onto the switch that make it work in bed or in a recline in a supine position on
52:30SPEAKERthe sofa or whatever.
52:32SPEAKERAnd also the switch has the benefit of you being able to crack those side, side joy cons
52:37SPEAKERoff and hold them wherever is comfortable, which this doesn't exactly have.
52:40SPEAKERI mean, you could plug in a controller, but that seems dopey.
52:43SPEAKERYeah.
52:44SPEAKERBut yeah, I would like more like ironically, I would like more low end on the grippy side
52:50SPEAKERthat most of the place to grip is on the high end, but that's where you use your, like that's,
52:55SPEAKERyou're using those fingers for other things.
52:57SPEAKERSo you end up in a weird, weird position.
52:59SPEAKERYeah.
53:00SPEAKERI think it's, I think it's pretty good.
53:02SPEAKERThe touch, the touch pads.
53:04SPEAKERIt's funny, the stuff that I thought was dopey when they announced it, like the touch pads
53:07SPEAKERand all that ends up being incredibly useful, especially in like desktop mode, because it
53:12SPEAKERgives you a really nice track pad surface.
53:15SPEAKERSo you don't have to try to hit touch targets on unlike the Linux desktop, which is, which
53:19SPEAKERis hard.
53:20SPEAKERYeah.
53:21SPEAKERIt's a, it's a remarkable device.
53:23SPEAKERMy, my secret hope and norm as I was, as I was, as I've been using this for the last
53:28SPEAKERyear and change, this seems like it's a path toward the guts of a VR headset.
53:36SPEAKERThat's stand, that's standalone slash streaming, right from a, from a desktop PC.
53:42SPEAKERAnd I would like that just cause I'd like to see somebody that's not Facebook making
53:46SPEAKERa dedicated, dedicated standalone VR headset, like an index two or something.
53:56SPEAKERI would like to see something that you don't necessarily, that you can play untethered
53:59SPEAKERand tethered.
54:00SPEAKERYes.
54:01SPEAKERYes.
54:02SPEAKERLike I think, I think it's pretty clear that the future of VR is untethered.
54:05SPEAKERYes.
54:06SPEAKERAnd I think if you don't, like I look at an APU and a decent battery life and all that
54:11SPEAKERstuff, and I'm like, this is, yeah, you can hang this on a belt or put it on the back
54:15SPEAKERof your head.
54:16SPEAKERNow we have not seen X86 in a VR headset.
54:21SPEAKERThose are all arm based and there you have much, much more stringent performance requirements
54:26SPEAKERthan you do on a handheld.
54:27SPEAKERSo I don't know.
54:28SPEAKERThink about how nice it would be to play Alex on a, on a standalone headset.
54:32SPEAKEROh, I know.
54:33SPEAKERI get it.
54:34SPEAKERThat'd be cool.
54:35SPEAKERI, there are crazy people just for the record that plug docs into steam decks and then plug
54:40SPEAKERindexes or other VR headsets into the, into the steam deck and then backpack the steam
54:45SPEAKERdeck.
54:46SPEAKERSo more power is not impossible.
54:48SPEAKERYeah.
54:49SPEAKERSo there we go.
54:51SPEAKERYeah.
54:52SPEAKERSounds pretty good.
54:53SPEAKERThat is the steam deck.
54:54SPEAKERI would say it's pretty good.
54:55SPEAKERI I'm going to reiterate, if you already have a steam deck and you buy this, you're going
55:00SPEAKERto probably be disappointed.
55:02SPEAKERIf you do not have a steam deck, you should absolutely, and you're going to buy one by
55:05SPEAKERthis one.
55:06SPEAKERThis is the one to buy for sure.
55:08SPEAKERYeah.
55:09SPEAKERAnd, and that'll do it, I guess for us this week.
55:12SPEAKERYeah.
55:13SPEAKERCool.
55:14SPEAKERBrad, we've reached the part of the show where we thank our patrons.
55:17SPEAKERThank you.
55:18SPEAKERPatrons.
55:19SPEAKERThis is the last episode of the month.
55:20SPEAKERIs it?
55:21SPEAKERIt is in fact, this one, we didn't even say it.
55:22SPEAKERThis would have been an emails episode, but then this hot device landed, I guess we'll
55:26SPEAKERdo emails next month.
55:27SPEAKERSo that means I need to thank two tiers of patrons.
55:29SPEAKERSo that's why I asked, but as always, this is the part of the show where we think our
55:33SPEAKERpatrons.
55:34SPEAKERSo thank you, patrons.
55:35SPEAKERYes.
55:36SPEAKERThank you.
55:37SPEAKERWe appreciate everybody who supports the show, whether, whether financially or just by telling
55:40SPEAKERyour friends and leaving iTunes reviews and stuff like that.
55:43SPEAKERBut we do offer a very special thank you to our executive producer, to your patrons, including
55:48SPEAKERour newly upgraded dollar sign, dollar sign, Andrew Slosky, Paddle Creek Games, makers
55:55SPEAKERof Fractured Veil, David Allen, James Cammack, Joel Krauska, Jordan Lippett, Just Wedge,
56:01SPEAKERNick Johnston, Pantheon, makers of the HS3 high-speed 3D printer and Twinkle Twinkie.
56:07SPEAKERThank you all so much.
56:08SPEAKERYes.
56:09SPEAKERThank you.
56:10SPEAKERAnd since it's the end of the month and we'd normally do Q&A, we still will thank our associate
56:13SPEAKERproducer patrons who we also appreciate very much, including Alejandro Navarro, Andre M.
56:18SPEAKERBurke, Arthur Gies, Ben Tolman, Eric, Eric Frey, Eric Klein, Eric IV soon to be the first
56:26SPEAKERafter the great Eric war.
56:27SPEAKERThat's one, two, three, four Eric's.
56:29SPEAKERStill no Eric's, but that's okay.
56:31SPEAKERGetting there.
56:32SPEAKERI think the Eric's, the Eric's continue to grow, I guess is when maybe we'll have a fifth
56:38SPEAKEREric next month.
56:39SPEAKERWe'll have to see.
56:40SPEAKERYou know, you can write whatever you want for your name on Patreon.
56:42SPEAKERSo I'm just going to put that out there.
56:43SPEAKERWait, wait, wait.
56:44SPEAKERYou, are you suggesting that dollar sign dollar sign is not someone's real name?
56:48SPEAKERI don't know.
56:51SPEAKERAsk the government.
56:52SPEAKEROkay.
56:53SPEAKEROkay.
56:54SPEAKERFelix Kramer, Graham Brinks, Jad Rita, Matt Walker, parentheses Walkman 8080, close parentheses,
57:00SPEAKERNathan Phelps, Sanchik Kumar, Steve Lin, Thomas Shea, and Tom Hilton.
57:04SPEAKERThank you all so, so much.
57:05SPEAKERWe really appreciate everybody's support and I didn't say this to the front cause I'm off
57:10SPEAKERmy game today, but when you subscribe to the Patreon, you get access to the patron exclusive
57:15SPEAKERepisodes and you get access to the fabulous tech pod discord, which is full of like the,
57:20SPEAKERI think the gift, the gift the gift exchange stuff is closed now, but like there's just
57:25SPEAKERlovely conversations happening all the time.
57:27SPEAKERAnd then look, Brad, did you know, and this is what we should have done the cold open
57:32SPEAKERon, but did you know that the children now use discord mod as a slur?
57:39SPEAKERI saw that being discussed shocking.
57:42SPEAKERIs that like their version of cop?
57:45SPEAKERThey are the, I think the implication is it's the kind of person who wouldn't allow memes
57:49SPEAKERin general.
57:50SPEAKERHuh?
57:51SPEAKEROkay.
57:52SPEAKERWe allow memes in general.
57:53SPEAKERWe're cool.
57:54SPEAKERThat's why I got called out by a teen, a surly teenager when I was out a few weeks ago when
57:59SPEAKERI was wearing a discord partner t-shirt because they sent me a hoodie a few years ago that
58:03SPEAKERhas like discord partner and huge block letters down the arm.
58:07SPEAKERAnd he was like, what are you a discord mod or something?
58:09SPEAKERI was like, Oh my God.
58:10SPEAKERI mean, kind of, I guess, but it sounds like this is a bad thing.
58:13SPEAKERSo I'm going to say not really.
58:15SPEAKERAll discord mods are bad.
58:18SPEAKERAd-mad?
58:19SPEAKERPassions.
58:20SPEAKERAd-mad?
58:21SPEAKERYeah.
58:22SPEAKERA-D-ad-mad.
58:23SPEAKERExactly.
58:24SPEAKEROur discord mods are great and, and mostly just shepherd conversations and help people
58:30SPEAKERexplain, understand when they're mansplaining and stuff like that.
58:33SPEAKERSo it's a, it's a friendly place to chat.
58:35SPEAKERWe try to make it inclusive for everybody.
58:36SPEAKERIf we're not, let us know.
58:37SPEAKERWe would love to hear about it, but, but lots of good conversations all day, every day talking
58:43SPEAKERabout everything from like CPU bracket mounting and how much thermal goo to use to extreme
58:52SPEAKERstorage solutions and, and like a good tool to tune your guitar.
58:57SPEAKERSo Mr. Scene Drama, you name it.
59:00SPEAKERIs Mr. Scene Drama?
59:01SPEAKERUh, maybe a little bit.
59:02SPEAKEROh, I'm going to send a question in for next week.
59:04SPEAKERThere's been, there's been some weird sniping back and forth on Twitter recently between
59:08SPEAKERpeople working on different projects in the Mr. Sphere.
59:12SPEAKERThis is a good reminder to send your emails for next week's Q&A episode to techbot@content.town
59:16SPEAKERor to post some of the questions seeking answers channel in the discord.
59:19SPEAKERThat'll do it for us, Brad.
59:21SPEAKERSee you all next week.