00:00SPEAKER- Brad, I just got back from Vegas, I'm so tired.
00:02SPEAKER- I'm sorry.
00:04SPEAKER- It's real dry, it snowed, it rained.
00:08SPEAKERIt was like shirt sleeves weather, I got the entire thing.
00:11SPEAKER- It snowed?
00:12SPEAKER- It snowed, just a little bit.
00:13SPEAKERI saw flakes from that hotel window.
00:15SPEAKER- What if it snowed in Las Vegas?
00:17SPEAKERWow. - Yeah.
00:18SPEAKERI've been there, it is not unheard of for it to snow.
00:21SPEAKERI've had it snow when I was there for CES before.
00:24SPEAKERNot like accumulation or anything, just some flakes falling.
00:27SPEAKER- It can't snow in the desert.
00:28SPEAKER- I mean, look, as long as it's less than 20 inches
00:31SPEAKERof precipitation a year, it's still a desert.
00:33SPEAKERIt doesn't matter what the precipitation is.
00:35SPEAKER- Cron ran on a headline yesterday that almost verbatim
00:39SPEAKERquoted the what if it snowed in San Francisco
00:42SPEAKERwith this nonsense that's going on here.
00:44SPEAKER- Oh, we just saw grapevine is closed this morning at I-5,
00:47SPEAKERlike where you go up the mountain to drive to LA.
00:50SPEAKER- I swear I did not plan to come into this podcast
00:52SPEAKERtalking about the weather.
00:53SPEAKER- You know, it's a high though, you know,
00:55SPEAKERwhat's up with the weather?
00:56SPEAKERNo, it's weird, weather's weird right now.
00:58SPEAKER- It's true, was dice also weird?
01:00SPEAKER- Dice was, dice is, as game conferences go, dice is weird.
01:06SPEAKERWe have multiple friends who have gone in the past
01:08SPEAKERand have told us about it and it is a conference
01:12SPEAKERthat I participated in entirely by sitting in bars
01:15SPEAKERand hotel lobbies and suites talking to people.
01:18SPEAKERI didn't see a floor at all, I didn't see any talks.
01:22SPEAKER- That's about my understanding of what dice is
01:25SPEAKERover the years.
01:26SPEAKER- I could have gone to the awards show last night,
01:29SPEAKERbut instead I chose to fly home at nine o'clock
01:31SPEAKERin the morning and be not in Las Vegas anymore,
01:34SPEAKERwhich is my favorite part of going to Las Vegas.
01:36SPEAKER- Yep, how long were you there?
01:37SPEAKERLike an hour count?
01:38SPEAKER- I got there on Monday night and I left Thursday morning,
01:41SPEAKERwhich is like six, 55 hours or something.
01:43SPEAKERIt was too many. - You made it.
01:45SPEAKERThe 72 is my personal window.
01:48SPEAKER- I'm a 48.
01:50SPEAKER- Well, okay, look, I don't hate Vegas.
01:51SPEAKERVegas is cool, it's just dangerous.
01:53SPEAKERAnd I started to say the less time in Vegas, the better,
01:57SPEAKERand I don't quite mean it that way, but you know.
01:59SPEAKER- Look, I used to, I went to, I covered 10 CESs, I think,
02:04SPEAKERsomething like that, but enough to know better.
02:07SPEAKERAnd that usually involved going and spending
02:10SPEAKERlike seven to nine days in Las Vegas.
02:12SPEAKERAnd I will tell you. - What?
02:14SPEAKERHoly shit.
02:15SPEAKER- The right number of hours for me to stay in Las Vegas
02:17SPEAKERafter doing that for a long time is zero.
02:19SPEAKERI'm fine never going again.
02:22SPEAKER- Nine days in Vegas.
02:24SPEAKER- It's hell.
02:25SPEAKERIn wintertime, so it's not even like you can go,
02:27SPEAKERlike at least if you're there in the summertime,
02:28SPEAKERyou can go out to the pool and like some hotels,
02:32SPEAKERthe pool's a real scene and that's not relaxing,
02:33SPEAKERbut some pools, some hotels is just like,
02:35SPEAKERyou go lay at the pool and you get some sun and you're like,
02:37SPEAKERokay, I feel a little bit better.
02:39SPEAKERI'm gonna have a bloody Mary
02:39SPEAKERand go back in and do this shit some more.
02:41SPEAKER- A pool in Vegas is where I randomly saw Dennis Rodman
02:45SPEAKERrunning around with what looked to be
02:47SPEAKERabout a 10 gallon bucket.
02:49SPEAKER- Of?
02:50SPEAKER- Of, well empty, he was just filling it up in the pool
02:53SPEAKERand just going around and dumping a giant bucket
02:56SPEAKERfull of pool water on people.
02:57SPEAKER- Yep, that sounds right.
02:59SPEAKERThat's Vegas.
03:00SPEAKER- Uh-huh.
03:01SPEAKER- I hit some real good soup dumplings though.
03:03SPEAKER- Hey look, you win some, you lose some.
03:04SPEAKER- Yeah, exactly.
03:05SPEAKER(upbeat music)
03:20SPEAKER(upbeat music continues)
03:33SPEAKER- Welcome to Brad and Will Made a Tech Pod.
03:36SPEAKERI'm Will.
03:37SPEAKER- I'm Brad.
03:38SPEAKERHello.
03:39SPEAKER- I should have called you Virtual Brad.
03:41SPEAKER- That's, nope.
03:41SPEAKERNo, I'm out.
03:42SPEAKERI escaped.
03:43SPEAKER- Did you die?
03:44SPEAKER- I'm back in the real.
03:46SPEAKER- Okay.
03:47SPEAKER- I did fall once in Horizon Call of the Mountain
03:50SPEAKERwhile hanging on the side of a mountain.
03:51SPEAKER- In real life or in the game?
03:53SPEAKER- No, in the game.
03:54SPEAKER- Okay.
03:55SPEAKERI've fallen out of my chair playing VR games before.
03:57SPEAKER- Oh, I said, yes.
03:58SPEAKERNo, I guess not.
03:59SPEAKERThat sounds bad.
04:00SPEAKERI've not done that.
04:01SPEAKER- I've done a lean.
04:02SPEAKERI think the first time I played Echo Arena,
04:04SPEAKERI literally, the person, they had to have spotters in there
04:08SPEAKERfor that game and I fell over.
04:12SPEAKERSomebody, they caught me.
04:13SPEAKERIt was nice.
04:14SPEAKER- That's the white glove.
04:17SPEAKERThat's the concierge VR service.
04:19SPEAKER- Well, it was before.
04:20SPEAKERWhen we were playing that game the first time,
04:22SPEAKERit was before they had any of the,
04:24SPEAKERhey, don't smash into the wall stuff
04:28SPEAKERthat came into the framework of VR hardware
04:32SPEAKERat some point after that.
04:34SPEAKERSo they put you on,
04:37SPEAKERyou know those mats that you put on the bed
04:39SPEAKERof the pickup truck that are thick to protect the paint
04:42SPEAKERso you don't crouch up your pickup truck?
04:44SPEAKERThey put a group of those out that was the playable area
04:48SPEAKERand they often would have you take your shoes off
04:50SPEAKERso you could feel the edges on the socks.
04:52SPEAKERAnd then, but some of the stuff,
04:54SPEAKERif you like Echo Arena, zero gravity.
04:56SPEAKERSo it's like Ender's game.
04:58SPEAKERLike you're flying around these zero gravity spaces
05:00SPEAKERand holding onto things.
05:01SPEAKERYou want to lean to reach and grab something
05:03SPEAKERand like, it's real easy to lean too far and just eat shit.
05:07SPEAKERSo they had a spotter.
05:09SPEAKER- True, very true.
05:10SPEAKERHey, we were both there at the beginning, you might say.
05:14SPEAKER- You were more at the beginning than me, man.
05:16SPEAKER- Was I?
05:16SPEAKER- You had to get into that E3 demo
05:18SPEAKERwhen Carmack was demoing Doom 3.
05:20SPEAKERAnd they, look, in 2012,
05:23SPEAKERwhich is when I think that would have been.
05:25SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, I can look the video up right now,
05:27SPEAKERas a matter of fact, on a giantbomb.com.
05:30SPEAKER- No one at E3 gave a shit about tested.com's VR coverage
05:34SPEAKERat that point in the game.
05:36SPEAKER- I see.
05:37SPEAKER- Yeah.
05:39SPEAKER- I think that's about right.
05:42SPEAKERKeep talking, I'll find it.
05:43SPEAKER- Yeah, there it is.
05:45SPEAKERYes, that was E3 2012, yes.
05:47SPEAKERI'm very flattered that footage of me and John Carmack
05:51SPEAKERand that duct-taped prototype VR headset
05:55SPEAKERmade it into Digital Foundry's review of PSVRQ, it seems.
05:59SPEAKER- So that was the one,
06:00SPEAKERif it's the same one that I saw at PAX later that year,
06:02SPEAKERI believe it was a pair of ski goggles
06:05SPEAKERthat had some screens duct-taped onto them,
06:08SPEAKERor it was a ski-goggle frame
06:10SPEAKERwith the screens and the head tracking stuff tacked on.
06:13SPEAKER- That looks, you know, now that I'm looking at this,
06:16SPEAKERthe headband part has got some extreme graphics on it.
06:19SPEAKER- Oh, the headband was absolutely a ski-goggle headband,
06:22SPEAKERyeah.
06:23SPEAKER- Definitely looks like the kind of thing
06:24SPEAKERyou might want to sport on the slope.
06:26SPEAKER- Well, and the weird thing was
06:27SPEAKERyou couldn't wear glasses inside it.
06:30SPEAKER- Yes, I can see, actually,
06:31SPEAKERI can see my face from over a decade ago here.
06:33SPEAKERYeah, the rubberized kind of enclosure
06:36SPEAKERis like bolted right onto your face.
06:38SPEAKERDid we, so did we use the same prototype headset
06:42SPEAKERand might support?
06:42SPEAKER- My understanding is that there were a handful of them,
06:45SPEAKERbut I don't know for sure.
06:46SPEAKER- Okay.
06:47SPEAKER- So when I saw it, a friend of the pod,
06:50SPEAKERI think Steve Lin maybe, was like,
06:51SPEAKER"Hey, if you want in, I've got an appointment,
06:53SPEAKER"you can come see this thing with me,
06:54SPEAKER"and we should check this out."
06:56SPEAKERAnd I was like, "Hell yeah, where are you?"
06:58SPEAKERAnd I went up to this little room off of the side
07:00SPEAKERof one of the elevator alcoves at PAX West.
07:05SPEAKERAnd I think Palmer Lucky probably did the demo,
07:07SPEAKERI can't remember.
07:09SPEAKERBut when I realized I couldn't put glasses on,
07:12SPEAKERinside it, I was like, "Oh man, I'm completely hosed."
07:14SPEAKER'Cause I have terrible vision.
07:16SPEAKERI'm like negative eight in both eyes.
07:20SPEAKER- Oh my God.
07:21SPEAKER- Which means that that time the focal length
07:23SPEAKERwas like two inches in front of my eyeballs.
07:26SPEAKERSo I thought I'd be fine.
07:27SPEAKER- Is prescription, is that a linear scale?
07:29SPEAKERI don't know.
07:30SPEAKER- I don't know how that works.
07:32SPEAKERI was bad at the optics section of college physics.
07:34SPEAKERIt turns out.
07:35SPEAKER- Okay, I see.
07:36SPEAKERIf that is linear, then your eyes are like twice
07:38SPEAKERas bad as mine.
07:39SPEAKERAnd I can't see more than a foot in front of my face.
07:42SPEAKER- Yeah, I correct pretty well.
07:43SPEAKERBut, and it's gotten better as I've gotten older.
07:45SPEAKERAs my lenses get brittle, my prescription gets friendlier
07:50SPEAKERuntil the bifocals come into play.
07:52SPEAKER- Well, hey, now that you've talked about corrective lenses,
07:54SPEAKERyou've reminded me of another bullet point
07:57SPEAKERI should add to this list about the PlayStation VR too.
08:00SPEAKER- Oh, is that what we're talking about today?
08:02SPEAKER- Yes, as a matter of fact.
08:04SPEAKERYeah, it's a pretty significant hardware release.
08:06SPEAKERYou certainly have spent some amount of your life
08:09SPEAKERdealing with VR.
08:10SPEAKER- Yeah, it's funny, since I stopped working in it,
08:12SPEAKERI stopped caring about it at all
08:13SPEAKERand I haven't really paid any attention whatsoever.
08:15SPEAKER- Okay, well, thanks for being here.
08:17SPEAKER- No, no, no, look, VR's in a weird place, right?
08:21SPEAKER'Cause I'm not gonna support meta endeavors, right?
08:25SPEAKER- Okay, that's a principled stance that I can respect.
08:28SPEAKER- Yeah, the quest is out and I have a relatively small house
08:31SPEAKERand I don't have a reason to have a whole room
08:33SPEAKERdedicated to it anymore.
08:34SPEAKERSo with the exception of when I sometimes fire up
08:37SPEAKERthe racing stuff, like the sim racing stuff,
08:40SPEAKERmy index is in a box over about three feet to my left.
08:45SPEAKERAnd yeah, the PSVR had been kind of moribund
08:51SPEAKERfor the last little bit until just now, so.
08:55SPEAKER- I had gotten to the point where I didn't even
08:56SPEAKERreally wanna get mine out and set it up anymore.
08:59SPEAKERIt was such a hassle with multiple cables
09:01SPEAKERand that breakout box and the tracking
09:03SPEAKERnever quite worked right for me.
09:05SPEAKER- It was a lot.
09:06SPEAKERIt's funny, you and I talked about this a lot in the past,
09:09SPEAKERbut I never had trouble with the tracking on the PSVR one,
09:12SPEAKERbut just the inherent nature of the accelerometer gyroscope
09:17SPEAKERin one point of outside data for the hand controllers,
09:21SPEAKERlike the head tracking was great.
09:22SPEAKERThe hand tracking was fine in the up and down
09:25SPEAKERand left and right, but anytime you had to go
09:26SPEAKERin or out toward the screen, it just wasn't very good.
09:30SPEAKER- Yes, the Z axis was rough.
09:32SPEAKER- Yeah, so it seems like they looked at what was going on
09:37SPEAKERand kind of made the thing that is good now
09:41SPEAKERfor the PlayStation VR stuff, right?
09:43SPEAKER- It's basically the stuff that's on PC now, right?
09:45SPEAKERI mean, anybody who listens to "Next Lander" stuff
09:47SPEAKERhas heard me say this like twice already,
09:49SPEAKERbut it seems like it's basically a parody
09:51SPEAKERwith what's out there on the PC.
09:54SPEAKERSince this is a technical podcast,
09:56SPEAKERI will say I went up and looked,
09:57SPEAKERor I went out and looked up the definition
09:59SPEAKERof slam tracking right before this.
10:01SPEAKER- Oh, yes.
10:02SPEAKER- Which I believe is involved here.
10:05SPEAKER- Yeah, so that's what most places use for it.
10:07SPEAKERMost people use for inside out tracking
10:09SPEAKERand it involves taking camera images
10:10SPEAKERand comparing the offsets based on the images
10:15SPEAKERthat are offset and based on where
10:17SPEAKERthat knows the cameras are on the headset, right?
10:19SPEAKER- Yeah, actually it's funny,
10:21SPEAKERthe Wikipedia page for slam tracking,
10:23SPEAKERsimultaneous localization and mapping, right?
10:27SPEAKERThat's the same slam, right?
10:28SPEAKER- Yeah, I think so.
10:29SPEAKERI'm bad at acronyms generally,
10:31SPEAKERbut the computational problem of constructing
10:33SPEAKERor updating a map of an unknown environment
10:36SPEAKERwhile simultaneously keeping track
10:37SPEAKERof an agent's location within that environment.
10:39SPEAKER- Yeah.
10:40SPEAKER- Which sounds about like what we're talking about here.
10:43SPEAKERDo you think that's,
10:44SPEAKERis that applicable to robot vacuums, do you think?
10:47SPEAKERSo the robot vacuums on the market
10:48SPEAKERthat can build a layout of a space
10:52SPEAKERas they navigate it over time?
10:53SPEAKER- Well, that's why Amazon bought Roomba, right?
10:56SPEAKER- Oh, 'cause they want.
10:58SPEAKER- I don't know if they're using slam or infrared ranging
11:01SPEAKERor whatever, but.
11:02SPEAKER- Wait, are you saying Amazon wants to amass
11:04SPEAKERa map of floor plans of homes across the country?
11:07SPEAKER- I think Amazon wants to gobble up all of the data
11:10SPEAKERthat it possibly can, yeah.
11:11SPEAKER- Yeah, anyway.
11:13SPEAKER- But that's definitely something people use in robotics.
11:17SPEAKER- Yeah.
11:18SPEAKER- I don't know about Roombas.
11:19SPEAKERRoombas, like the last time I had a Roomba,
11:21SPEAKERit's been 15 years probably,
11:22SPEAKERbut it just whacked into stuff
11:24SPEAKERand turned a random number of degrees
11:26SPEAKERuntil it found something else to whack into
11:28SPEAKERand then turned a random number of degrees.
11:29SPEAKER- Yes, we've got a DBOT that's like five or six years old
11:32SPEAKERand it does the same thing.
11:33SPEAKERAnd that's why I was wondering is like,
11:35SPEAKERI wonder if you could make one
11:36SPEAKERthat didn't just randomly drive around
11:38SPEAKERuntil it runs into stuff all the time
11:39SPEAKERand if it actually could build a map
11:41SPEAKERand then vacuum more efficiently.
11:44SPEAKER- Yeah, it's one of the things I wonder
11:45SPEAKERif it actually would be better
11:47SPEAKERbecause it may be that the random bouncing
11:50SPEAKERis actually highly effective at finding crumbs,
11:53SPEAKERbut I don't know, I'm curious.
11:54SPEAKER- Yeah, it's possible.
11:55SPEAKERAnyway, ours tends to cover the same ground,
11:58SPEAKERlike five times every time it's out.
11:59SPEAKER- Yeah.
12:00SPEAKER- Which is kind of useless.
12:01SPEAKERAnyway, virtual reality.
12:02SPEAKER- Yeah.
12:04SPEAKER- OLED screens.
12:05SPEAKER- Yeah, OLED screens are nice, it turns out.
12:08SPEAKERYou get better blacks.
12:09SPEAKER- Yes, absolutely.
12:10SPEAKERIt's 2,040 lines per eye per screen.
12:13SPEAKER- Did you notice screen door effect on the,
12:16SPEAKERthese are high resolution screens.
12:18SPEAKER- You know, maybe we don't need to sit here
12:19SPEAKERand go through every spec on this thing.
12:21SPEAKERMaybe it's better to talk experientially.
12:23SPEAKER- That's what I've always found with the VR stuff.
12:25SPEAKER- Because you have certainly spent
12:26SPEAKERyour share of time with this stuff.
12:28SPEAKER- So yeah, that was one of the very first things I noticed
12:29SPEAKERwhen I put this thing on was no screen door effect,
12:32SPEAKERwhich you tell me I've always just assumed
12:36SPEAKERcomes from the screen being low resolution enough
12:38SPEAKERthat you can kind of see the seams between pixels.
12:40SPEAKER- It's a combination of the optics
12:42SPEAKERand the resolution of the screen.
12:45SPEAKERThere are certain types of screen,
12:46SPEAKERlike L-cost screens generate,
12:48SPEAKERand OLED screens generate more,
12:51SPEAKERlike the area of each pixel is more filled
12:54SPEAKERwith the, like, emissive surface.
12:59SPEAKER- The emissive surface is larger, yeah.
13:02SPEAKERWith an LCD screen, you have a backlight that's emissive,
13:06SPEAKERand then that's being filtered.
13:07SPEAKERAnd the thing that supports the cells
13:09SPEAKERthat does the filtering on a per pixel basis
13:12SPEAKERhas to be, is visible.
13:15SPEAKERSo on OLEDs, you should have much less screen door
13:17SPEAKERthan you would on a,
13:19SPEAKERbut also higher resolution fixes the problem as well.
13:21SPEAKER- Right.
13:23SPEAKERAnyway, yeah, like basically no screen door effect.
13:25SPEAKERThere is, I saw the term for this yesterday
13:27SPEAKERand I forgot to make a note of it and it's escaped my mind.
13:29SPEAKERI kind of a grain,
13:31SPEAKERwhich I believe may be sort of inherent to OLED screens
13:34SPEAKERis what I was reading.
13:35SPEAKER- Well, OLEDs, yeah, they have like,
13:37SPEAKERsometimes you can see the sub-pixels a little bit.
13:39SPEAKER- It's weird, I mean, granted this is right in your face,
13:41SPEAKERso it's not like you're gonna see this on a TV at 10 feet
13:44SPEAKERor whatever, but it almost is visually kind of reminds you
13:48SPEAKERof film grain a little bit.
13:49SPEAKER- Huh, that's interesting.
13:50SPEAKER- It's, I don't know how to characterize it
13:51SPEAKERor what's causing it.
13:52SPEAKERIt's not a bad thing, but like, you know,
13:54SPEAKERif you look at a completely white field,
13:58SPEAKERyou are gonna see a little bit of this
14:00SPEAKERkind of grainy quality, but it's not,
14:02SPEAKERit's much less pronounced than a screen door effect
14:04SPEAKERand I don't mind it at all.
14:06SPEAKER- I mean, in my experience, generally,
14:11SPEAKERat full white or full black,
14:13SPEAKERmost displays are gonna have some sort of an issue.
14:16SPEAKER- Yeah. - If that makes sense.
14:17SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah, it's also not something that's very visible
14:20SPEAKERat all when you're playing an actual game.
14:23SPEAKER- Yeah, the headset I spent the most time with recently
14:25SPEAKERis the Index, which is an LCD,
14:28SPEAKERand it definitely has a little bit of a screen door.
14:30SPEAKERYou can help that stuff with optics, there isn't a grain,
14:34SPEAKERbut like the LCD panels almost always have problems
14:36SPEAKERwith blacks, so there's a little bit of a grayness
14:39SPEAKERor some light bleed around the edges of the panel.
14:42SPEAKER- Right, they have not revved the Index
14:45SPEAKERsince it came out, have they?
14:46SPEAKER- Nope, no need to, probably.
14:48SPEAKER- Although, actually, maybe it's not as old as I thought.
14:50SPEAKERIt's around the time the pandemic started, right?
14:52SPEAKERI think, in fact, I think I remember an Index showed up
14:55SPEAKERin the office the week after we started working from home,
14:58SPEAKERso maybe it actually has not been that long.
14:59SPEAKER- So I got mine around the time Alex came out,
15:04SPEAKER'cause I'd had the Index controller.
15:06SPEAKERLike it came out, and like the Steam Deck,
15:08SPEAKERit came out and it was a little bit hard to get for a while.
15:10SPEAKERYou had to wait on a list for a while.
15:12SPEAKER- Yes, right, yes, I remember that now.
15:13SPEAKER- Even before the pandemic.
15:15SPEAKERAnd then, but then around the time Alex came out,
15:19SPEAKERthey were like, hey, we'll ship headsets,
15:20SPEAKERand you could get 'em more reliably.
15:22SPEAKER- Right, okay, here's a question for you.
15:24SPEAKERKnowing Valve as you do,
15:26SPEAKERyou're something of a Valve whisperer, right?
15:28SPEAKER- I mean, I worked with somebody who worked at Valve
15:31SPEAKERfor a long time, and I worked with Valve a lot, yeah.
15:35SPEAKER- Odd in your mind that they port Half-Life Alex
15:37SPEAKERto the PSVR2?
15:41SPEAKER- I don't, man, that's a Sony whispering question
15:44SPEAKERmore than a Valve whispering question.
15:46SPEAKERYeah, I don't know.
15:47SPEAKER- I mean, they did that portal thing, right,
15:50SPEAKERwhere Portal 2 came out on both the PlayStation 3
15:52SPEAKERand the PC, and then it became kind of fraught, I think.
15:56SPEAKERI don't know.
15:57SPEAKER- That was well over a decade ago.
15:58SPEAKERLike, yeah, for the latter part of the PS3,
16:01SPEAKERthere were like Steam ran on the PS3 for certain games.
16:05SPEAKERBut that's been over a decade ago now, I don't know.
16:08SPEAKER- I don't know, my guess is that if Valve wanted to port,
16:11SPEAKERif Sony was like, hey, we'd like you to bring Alex
16:13SPEAKERto the PSVR2, my guess is that Valve would want something
16:18SPEAKERlike, okay, well, we'll do that as long as the PSVR2
16:21SPEAKERplugs into a USB-C port on your PC and becomes a PC headset.
16:25SPEAKER- Well, so that is like a major bullet point
16:28SPEAKERin these notes I have made here, we'll get to that.
16:30SPEAKER- Okay.
16:32SPEAKER- Of course, if that was getting official support
16:33SPEAKERfrom the hardware maker, that would be dramatically easier
16:36SPEAKERand faster to implement.
16:37SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, so much of what makes Alex good
16:42SPEAKERis are the actual, the hand controls.
16:44SPEAKERAlso, how much, how good is the, like, I don't know,
16:47SPEAKERhow good is the PSVR2 in like a living,
16:49SPEAKERlike a full room situation?
16:51SPEAKER- So.
16:52SPEAKER- 'Cause Alex is a full room game.
16:53SPEAKER- Okay, so you know what I wish this thing did?
16:57SPEAKERSo it's got a pretty nice utility when you set it up
17:00SPEAKERfor mapping out the playable area.
17:02SPEAKER- Yeah.
17:03SPEAKER- I know that like the Quest has had this
17:04SPEAKERsince the first Quest and stuff, but you know.
17:06SPEAKERSo when you put this thing on, if you ever go out of bounds
17:09SPEAKERor there's a button you can hit to force it on the headset
17:11SPEAKERor when you're just setting stuff up
17:13SPEAKERand it can't show you game,
17:14SPEAKERit'll switch to the inside out cameras
17:16SPEAKERso you can see what's around you.
17:18SPEAKER- The view of the, is it gray or color?
17:20SPEAKER- It's gray.
17:21SPEAKER- Okay.
17:21SPEAKER- And it blew my mind the first time I saw it
17:24SPEAKER'cause you know, it's a 3D view of the room around you
17:27SPEAKERexcept the scale is really strange.
17:29SPEAKEREverything looks smaller and farther away, so.
17:32SPEAKER- Well, so if they do it right, then it should look
17:34SPEAKERjust like you're looking through your eyes.
17:36SPEAKERI mean, lower resolution.
17:38SPEAKER- It's not that different.
17:39SPEAKERIt's just, everything looks a tad bit farther away
17:42SPEAKERthan real life.
17:43SPEAKER- Yeah.
17:44SPEAKER- But so when you do that, it actually has you turn
17:48SPEAKERand it paints the environment.
17:50SPEAKERIt paints your room with a bunch of polygons
17:52SPEAKERwhich looks cool as it's kind of building a map
17:55SPEAKERand it'll just stop when it's satisfied
17:57SPEAKERit's got enough data.
17:58SPEAKERAnd then after that, it'll show you the boundary
18:01SPEAKERit decided you should have and you can paint the boundary
18:04SPEAKERbigger or smaller with the controller.
18:06SPEAKERVery elegantly, it works quite well,
18:08SPEAKERbut what was your question about?
18:10SPEAKEROh, the room scale.
18:11SPEAKER- Do you, well, do you have to do that every time
18:17SPEAKERyou turn it on?
18:17SPEAKERLike if you have like a foot rest or something
18:20SPEAKERand you move it, will it recognize the room still
18:22SPEAKERor do you have to redo it?
18:23SPEAKER- As somebody who has been playing it in the living room
18:25SPEAKERand also streaming it in this office,
18:28SPEAKERI can answer that question.
18:29SPEAKERAs long as it's in the same place every time,
18:31SPEAKERyou don't have to do that again.
18:32SPEAKERIt's only when it detects that you have moved it
18:36SPEAKERto a different space, it'll make you recalibrate.
18:39SPEAKER- Like the early quest stuff, when I had that,
18:41SPEAKERChloe would walk through the room
18:43SPEAKERand she would make it tr, she, like, she,
18:46SPEAKERher just presence in the room when she was laying there
18:49SPEAKERwould make it think that the room had changed enough
18:50SPEAKERand needed to do a retrigger.
18:52SPEAKER- Interesting.
18:53SPEAKER- And she's not, she wasn't like a big dog.
18:55SPEAKERShe weighed like 25 pounds.
18:56SPEAKERSo, but yeah, my question was, was,
19:01SPEAKERwas about the, the link scale.
19:03SPEAKER- Yeah, like, is, are you, are you walking, like, okay,
19:06SPEAKERjust to be clear, you can play Alex standing
19:08SPEAKERin the middle of a room and just bend down and pick up
19:11SPEAKERand use the turn controls and stuff like that,
19:13SPEAKERnot turn and not walk or anything.
19:14SPEAKER- Yeah, and the little bit of Alex I played,
19:16SPEAKERthat's basically how I did it.
19:17SPEAKERCause it was in this room where there's like,
19:19SPEAKERI don't know, three by five to move around maybe.
19:22SPEAKER- Yeah.
19:23SPEAKER- So, so the thing I was gonna say that I wish this did is
19:26SPEAKERwhen you build, when you build that playable area,
19:28SPEAKERit'll say at the end,
19:30SPEAKERhere's what you have room to do in this.
19:31SPEAKERAnd it's sitting, standing and room scale.
19:34SPEAKER- Okay.
19:35SPEAKER- And it defines room scale.
19:36SPEAKERI wish I had written it down.
19:37SPEAKERI think it's something like, this is weirdly specific,
19:40SPEAKER6.7 feet by seven or something like that.
19:43SPEAKER- Oh, it's probably two meters by, by two,
19:46SPEAKERmaybe it's two meters by something.
19:47SPEAKERYeah, it has to do with your arm span.
19:49SPEAKERSo if you're six feet tall, your arm span is six feet.
19:52SPEAKER- I see.
19:53SPEAKER- And you need to have a square that's at least six feet
19:55SPEAKERby six feet or else you're gonna do bad things.
19:57SPEAKER- The thing I was gonna say I wished it did is if it,
19:59SPEAKERif it can tell a size threshold like that,
20:03SPEAKERI assume it can basically approximate what the space is.
20:05SPEAKERI wish it, I wish it would tell you how big
20:07SPEAKERyour playable area actually is.
20:10SPEAKER- Oh, it should be, it has that information.
20:12SPEAKER- You know, that's what I mean.
20:13SPEAKER- It's in there.
20:14SPEAKER- I just don't think they expose it.
20:15SPEAKER- Yeah, that's a weird choice.
20:17SPEAKER- Basically what I'm saying is it would be nice to know
20:19SPEAKERhow far short I am falling of their definition of room scale.
20:23SPEAKER- Oh, it's like to see where the red is, yeah.
20:25SPEAKER- In fact, so there's an interesting issue.
20:27SPEAKERThere's a game called What the Bat,
20:29SPEAKERwhich let me check.
20:31SPEAKER- I think that's a PlayStation only game.
20:33SPEAKERI've not heard of that.
20:34SPEAKER- No, it's on Steam.
20:35SPEAKERIt came out in November, so it's not been out that long.
20:38SPEAKERThey had a bug actually,
20:39SPEAKERwhich I don't think they have fixed yet
20:40SPEAKERwhere the game was trying to force you to use room scale.
20:44SPEAKERIt was, it was basically saying,
20:45SPEAKERhey, if you are not hitting room scale dimensions,
20:46SPEAKERyou can't boot this thing, sorry.
20:49SPEAKERAnd so I fudged my playable area to be significantly bigger
20:53SPEAKERthan I had actual room for just to get it to boot.
20:56SPEAKERAgain, they're patching this, it's an issue, a known issue.
20:59SPEAKER- That's a classic VR trope.
21:02SPEAKERIs this from the What the Golf people?
21:04SPEAKER- Oh, I believe that might be right.
21:07SPEAKER- Yeah, from the creators of What the Golf, yeah.
21:08SPEAKER- Yes, this is the What the Golf did all.
21:10SPEAKERIt was cool, what I played of it,
21:12SPEAKERwhat I played of it seemed very clever and cool.
21:14SPEAKERIt's just that, again,
21:16SPEAKERmy boundary was like halfway into my coffee table
21:19SPEAKERand past my television.
21:22SPEAKERBut all I was gonna say is I wish you could see
21:25SPEAKERwhen you don't make room scale,
21:26SPEAKERI wish it would say like, hey, here's your actual size.
21:28SPEAKERHere's how much you're falling short of that.
21:31SPEAKERBut no other game that I've played on this thing
21:34SPEAKERhas required room scale or even anything close to it.
21:36SPEAKERSo it's not actually a huge deal.
21:38SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, the room scale for judge,
21:41SPEAKERlooking at the trailer for that game,
21:43SPEAKERthe reason they want you to have room scales
21:44SPEAKERso you don't break anything.
21:46SPEAKER- Right, yeah, sure, sure enough.
21:48SPEAKERThat was the one time I like smashed my hand into my TV,
21:51SPEAKERwhich was not great. - Oh, ouch.
21:53SPEAKER- But again, I was pushing it too far
21:55SPEAKERjust to get that thing to work.
21:57SPEAKER- Yeah, like I've walked into walls
21:59SPEAKERbefore doing the same thing.
22:00SPEAKERLike I cheated the, 'cause on Steam, of course,
22:03SPEAKERyou can just open up the config file
22:05SPEAKERand move your wall out a little bit further.
22:07SPEAKERAnd then you just have to remember which wall is which.
22:09SPEAKERAnd it's the moment you forget that,
22:11SPEAKERthen you walk into the wall like a dota.
22:13SPEAKER- Yeah, so this thing is pretty configurable.
22:15SPEAKERAnd I'm sure, again, this is a PC thing as well
22:18SPEAKERon newer headsets.
22:19SPEAKERBut if the headset or one of the controllers
22:21SPEAKERgets close to what it has defined as the boundary,
22:24SPEAKERyou know, it'll start popping the grid up around you
22:26SPEAKERand a big red highlight will appear.
22:28SPEAKERBut the thing that was new to me
22:30SPEAKERis kind of the second your headset crosses the boundary,
22:35SPEAKERit cuts you out of the game
22:36SPEAKERand drops straight to the cameras.
22:38SPEAKER- Oh, that's good.
22:39SPEAKER- So basically the instant that you go outside
22:41SPEAKERof what you've defined as the area,
22:43SPEAKERyou see what's around you again.
22:44SPEAKERAnd your brain immediately goes like,
22:46SPEAKER"Oh God, I have to stop," which is fantastic.
22:48SPEAKERAnd it's why I have started painting my area
22:51SPEAKERmaybe a little conservatively.
22:52SPEAKERLike I give myself like half a foot on each side.
22:55SPEAKER- I was gonna say, the thing that I found over the years
22:57SPEAKERis you don't wanna go all the way to the wall of your room.
23:00SPEAKERYou wanna give yourself a little bit of buffer.
23:03SPEAKERAnd like, if you have a place,
23:05SPEAKERlike the door in my office is often like two thirds open.
23:10SPEAKERSo that whole area became verboten for VR
23:12SPEAKER'cause I'd end up punching the edge of the door,
23:15SPEAKERwhich it turns out really, really hurts.
23:18SPEAKER- Yeah.
23:19SPEAKER- It's bad for controllers too, who knew?
23:21SPEAKER- Yeah, the only real issue I've had, I hope this is okay.
23:26SPEAKERI went a little too far for the cord once
23:28SPEAKERand it was a lighting issue.
23:30SPEAKERLighting is maybe a little picky.
23:31SPEAKERI'm sure you've experienced this with inside out.
23:34SPEAKERThey warn you during setup that overly bright light
23:37SPEAKERwill confuse the tracking.
23:39SPEAKERThey did not mention that too dim also is a problem.
23:42SPEAKERAnd you can't tell really how bright things are in there.
23:44SPEAKERThere's a weird kind of negative exposure effect in there.
23:47SPEAKERAnd it's hard to tell that it's too dark
23:49SPEAKERunless you take the headset off.
23:50SPEAKER- Well, if you think about it, when they turn the ISO up
23:52SPEAKERon the sensor to get more pixels, to get more light in,
23:57SPEAKERthen the graininess on the camera sensor goes way up.
24:01SPEAKER- Yeah, so I was born.
24:03SPEAKER- Yeah, your effective resolution
24:05SPEAKERfor the SLAM stuff goes down.
24:06SPEAKER- Yeah, so I was playing it around dusk
24:08SPEAKERand there was plenty of light when I put it on
24:10SPEAKERand then all of a sudden things started getting really grainy
24:13SPEAKERto the point, you actually grained out so hard
24:14SPEAKERI could not see anything around me.
24:15SPEAKERBut anyway, I was kind of like creeping around
24:18SPEAKERtrying to look down the hall and stuff with it.
24:19SPEAKERAnd I went a little too far for the cord
24:22SPEAKERand kind of yanked my PS5 on the USB-C ports
24:27SPEAKERat a little bit of an angle,
24:28SPEAKERwhich I'm a little concerned about.
24:30SPEAKER- Would it still work?
24:31SPEAKER- It works fine.
24:32SPEAKERIt has issues, the USB-C cable
24:34SPEAKERstill snaps in reasonably tightly.
24:37SPEAKER- I'm surprised they don't have a quick release on that.
24:38SPEAKERThat's kind of surprising.
24:39SPEAKER- Yeah, that would be nice.
24:41SPEAKERI was kind of thinking that.
24:43SPEAKER- I mean, you can probably get a short extender
24:44SPEAKERand make your own kind of quick release.
24:46SPEAKER- Yeah, this is a total aside,
24:48SPEAKERbut I was reading recently that the locking mechanism
24:51SPEAKERon a USB-C port is on the female end, not the male end,
24:56SPEAKERwhich is the opposite of a lightning cable.
24:58SPEAKEROn lightning, the locking part is on the,
25:00SPEAKERso if something breaks, you're just out of cable
25:03SPEAKERand not a port.
25:04SPEAKER- Oh, well, that's nice.
25:06SPEAKER- No, well, no, yeah, for lightning, it is.
25:07SPEAKERFor USB-C, it's not.
25:08SPEAKER- Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh.
25:10SPEAKER- Yes, so if you break a USB-C port, you're in trouble.
25:12SPEAKER- I mean, you're good at soldering, right?
25:14SPEAKER- Anyway, sure.
25:16SPEAKER- Well, so on the headset side, on the face,
25:20SPEAKERlike is the IPD the distance between pupils adjustable
25:24SPEAKERphysically, or are they doing it in software?
25:25SPEAKER- No, there's a mechanical dial on the top of the headset
25:29SPEAKERthat just moves the optics back and forth,
25:31SPEAKERand there's a nice little utility in there
25:33SPEAKERthat's just like, you see it moving,
25:35SPEAKERand you see your eyeballs.
25:36SPEAKERSo it's got eye tracking as well, have you used a lot of-
25:38SPEAKER- I've used headsets with eye tracking, but not much.
25:41SPEAKER- Okay, so it also uses the eye tracking
25:44SPEAKERas you're adjusting the IPD.
25:45SPEAKERYou can see, they're a little cartoonish eyeballs.
25:47SPEAKERThey're not, you know, they're nothing realistic,
25:50SPEAKERbut you see where your eyes are looking,
25:52SPEAKERand you see them blinking and stuff like that,
25:54SPEAKERand you see kind of the diameter of the lenses
25:57SPEAKERas you move the IPD. - So it's something,
25:58SPEAKERlike if you hand a headset to another person,
26:00SPEAKERthey just turn the knob until the little thing,
26:02SPEAKERthe thing pops up, they turn the knob,
26:04SPEAKERand it, yeah, it's easy to do?
26:07SPEAKER- It takes one minute to adjust.
26:08SPEAKER- Oh, that's awesome.
26:09SPEAKER- So you basically move the lens cutouts over the eyes,
26:12SPEAKERand then it'll pop up a little check mark or whatever
26:14SPEAKERwhen it thinks you're aligned nicely?
26:16SPEAKER- Honestly, that's one of the things
26:17SPEAKERthat I think Facebook has mucked up with the Quest,
26:20SPEAKERbecause those are all software IPD adjustment.
26:22SPEAKERThey don't, they move the screen,
26:25SPEAKERthe images on the screen,
26:26SPEAKERwhich means that the optics have to be a little bit muddier,
26:28SPEAKERand yeah, so that's really cool.
26:31SPEAKER- Let me just ask, since we're talking about optics,
26:33SPEAKERnow's the time.
26:34SPEAKERSo there are already outfits out there
26:36SPEAKERthat are doing prescription lenses for other headsets
26:38SPEAKERthat have already started taking pre-orders for PSVR2 ones.
26:42SPEAKERI'm kind of really tempted to get some.
26:43SPEAKER- You should absolutely do it, it's great.
26:45SPEAKER- Is that a good buy?
26:46SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, you can get,
26:47SPEAKERthere's a wide range all the way from like
26:51SPEAKERkind of fly-by-night Chinese optician
26:54SPEAKERwill grind your lenses for $15 places.
26:59SPEAKERGiven what I know about your vision,
27:00SPEAKERyou probably only want the distance vision.
27:02SPEAKERI don't think you want the up close for inside the,
27:05SPEAKERyou don't want to do bifocals inside the VR, I don't think,
27:09SPEAKERbut I'm not, I don't know,
27:11SPEAKERI don't know that it'll work right for you.
27:13SPEAKER- Okay, okay.
27:13SPEAKER- Because of the way the eye tracking works.
27:15SPEAKER- Sure, sure.
27:16SPEAKERSo I have not had too much trouble with glasses.
27:20SPEAKERI guess I should, I should mention like the,
27:22SPEAKERyou've used a PSVR1, like the comfort level,
27:25SPEAKERthe putting on process, all pretty similar.
27:27SPEAKER- Is it the same halo thing with the twisty knob
27:30SPEAKERat the back?
27:30SPEAKER- Same, yeah, same tightening mechanism on the headband,
27:32SPEAKERsame kind of release to move the scope in and out.
27:36SPEAKER- Yeah.
27:37SPEAKER- That feels a little flimsier to me than the first one did,
27:39SPEAKERwhich is a little concerning.
27:40SPEAKERAnd it also feels just, the headset feels a tad bit
27:44SPEAKERmore front heavy.
27:46SPEAKER- Is, do they have headphones built in this time or no?
27:48SPEAKERThey don't, right?
27:49SPEAKER- Same, same little earbuds that clip on,
27:52SPEAKERbut you don't have to use them.
27:53SPEAKERIt's also, they plug into a generic stereo port.
27:55SPEAKERSo I've just been using my Astro A40s with it
27:58SPEAKERfor the most part.
27:59SPEAKER- Yeah, but I mean, still,
28:00SPEAKERit's nice to have the headphones on the headset.
28:02SPEAKERWell, it's, it's relatively inexpensive though.
28:03SPEAKER- So these, these earbuds do essentially clip in.
28:07SPEAKER- Oh, okay.
28:07SPEAKER- They will permanently attach if that's,
28:09SPEAKERif that's all you want to use.
28:10SPEAKER- Yeah.
28:11SPEAKER- The, the earbuds will permanently attach.
28:13SPEAKER- I don't want to share earbuds with other people.
28:15SPEAKERThat's icky.
28:16SPEAKER- Oh, well, I can't help you there.
28:17SPEAKER- Yeah.
28:20SPEAKERThe, the, the, so, hold on,
28:22SPEAKERyou asked me a question there and I completely lost it.
28:24SPEAKERSorry.
28:25SPEAKER- Eye tracking? No.
28:27SPEAKER- Yeah, the eye tracking.
28:27SPEAKER- The lenses, the prescription lenses.
28:29SPEAKER- So the real, the prescription lenses are, if you,
28:31SPEAKERif you use the headset a lot,
28:32SPEAKERthe prescription lenses are a huge win.
28:36SPEAKERThere's, there's, I bought a set for the index.
28:41SPEAKERI can't, I'll,
28:42SPEAKERI'll see if I can find the link and put them in the show
28:44SPEAKERnotes because I'm never going to find it while we're on the,
28:47SPEAKERon the call here.
28:49SPEAKERBut it's a thing that I think Jeremy Williams recommended on
28:51SPEAKERthe Tested podcast. And when I asked him about it,
28:53SPEAKERhe was like, yes, absolutely do that.
28:55SPEAKER- Okay. Somebody, I think it was Luke on this board,
28:59SPEAKERlinked me to a place called Hans VR.
29:02SPEAKER- The one I think is, is, is VR lenses direct or something.
29:05SPEAKERI can't remember, but I'm sure a bunch of them are fine.
29:07SPEAKER- The other huge benefit is when you have glasses up close to
29:12SPEAKERthe lenses in the, in the headset,
29:14SPEAKERthose lenses are really delicate.
29:15SPEAKERSo there's a couple of things you never do.
29:16SPEAKERYou never have those lenses where they can catch outside
29:18SPEAKERsun, right? Cause yeah, cause they'll scorch the, the,
29:22SPEAKERscorch the, the screen.
29:24SPEAKER- I had no idea.
29:25SPEAKER- Yeah. Like I, I store headsets with a,
29:28SPEAKERI get big microfibers and store them with the,
29:31SPEAKERwith the big microfiber inside the, inside the headset part.
29:36SPEAKERYou, you like when you have your glasses,
29:39SPEAKERif your glasses are touching the lenses,
29:40SPEAKERsomething's going to get scratched.
29:41SPEAKERIt's either your glasses or the lenses.
29:44SPEAKERAnd neither of those are great outcomes because they're not
29:47SPEAKERgenerally replaceable. So, so yeah, using the clip in lenses,
29:52SPEAKERespecially if you're the only person who uses the headset is
29:55SPEAKERfantastic. If, if you're, if you share the headset,
29:58SPEAKERit's a little more complicated.
29:59SPEAKERYou have to take them in and out all the time.
30:00SPEAKERThere's potential for damage there.
30:02SPEAKERAnd often the,
30:03SPEAKERthe frames that you put the lenses into the headset,
30:06SPEAKERwhether you clip them into the headset with like,
30:09SPEAKERthey used to be all 3d printed.
30:10SPEAKERI think now people are actually manufacturing them out of
30:12SPEAKERlike machined plastic and stuff like that or cast plastic
30:15SPEAKEReven. But, but yeah. So, you know, your mileage may vary.
30:19SPEAKERI wouldn't spend like $300 on those,
30:21SPEAKERbut I would totally spend 50 or 60 on that.
30:24SPEAKER- 50, 50 is what these that were linked to me are getting,
30:29SPEAKERgetting the headset on over glasses has been pretty much
30:31SPEAKERfine.
30:32SPEAKER- The Sony one was the best of all of them on the last,
30:34SPEAKERon the, on the first wave of stuff,
30:35SPEAKERfirst few waves of stuff even.
30:37SPEAKER- My biggest problem with it honestly is that I'm just
30:39SPEAKERconstantly smudging my glasses in the process of putting the
30:42SPEAKERheadset on.
30:43SPEAKERAnd then you get in there and the glide,
30:44SPEAKERyour glasses are a smeary mess.
30:45SPEAKER- And they get mashed up closer to your eyes and you're
30:47SPEAKERnormally are. So your eyelashes wipe the inside of the
30:50SPEAKERlenses. It's like, there's a bunch of bad news there.
30:52SPEAKER- Yeah. So I, I probably will spring from those lenses
30:55SPEAKERbecause I see myself using this headset dramatically more
30:58SPEAKERthan the last one.
30:59SPEAKER- Yeah.
31:00SPEAKER- The experience generally, the tracking, the optics,
31:02SPEAKERthe quality of the screens, like the controllers,
31:05SPEAKERthe kind of whole kit and caboodle is better enough that if
31:08SPEAKERthey keep the games coming,
31:09SPEAKERI could see myself using this on a pretty frequent basis.
31:12SPEAKER- Well, yeah. And the fact that they did the eye tracking.
31:15SPEAKERSo there's two things that I'm really excited about with
31:16SPEAKERthis. One is the eye tracking, because that,
31:18SPEAKERthat allows them to use the entirety of the horsepower of
31:22SPEAKERthe PS5 in the place where your eye sees has the highest
31:26SPEAKERresolution.
31:27SPEAKER- Yes. Is that, is that, is that phoviated or foveated?
31:30SPEAKER- Foveated rendering. Yeah.
31:31SPEAKER- Is that how you pronounce it?
31:32SPEAKER- Yeah. Cause for the, they're talking about the fovea,
31:34SPEAKERwhich is that center part of your retina.
31:36SPEAKER- I see.
31:37SPEAKER- The, the other thing is the controller.
31:40SPEAKERI mean like the vibration of the headset's kind of
31:42SPEAKERinteresting. I don't, I'm curious what you think about that,
31:44SPEAKERbut like the controller design looked like it was actually
31:47SPEAKERreally good.
31:48SPEAKER- That's not bad. It's my really,
31:50SPEAKERmy only knock against it is that if, if you've,
31:53SPEAKERif you've got the strap on and it's dangling from your wrist
31:55SPEAKERand you can't see the controller, meaning you're in a game.
31:58SPEAKER- Yeah.
31:58SPEAKER- It's, it's hard to figure out how to maneuver your hand
32:00SPEAKERinto the controller to work it right.
32:02SPEAKER- Do they not show you your hands?
32:04SPEAKER- In some games they do, like in horizon,
32:06SPEAKERif you're sitting at the title screen, you see the,
32:08SPEAKERactually you don't see your hands,
32:09SPEAKERbut you see the controllers floating in front of you.
32:11SPEAKERAnd that's enough.
32:12SPEAKERBut if you can't see anything, cause there's multiple,
32:15SPEAKERthere's two or three different ways your hand could go into
32:17SPEAKERthat hole.
32:18SPEAKER- See, that's interesting. Cause that's, that's a,
32:20SPEAKERlike that's a platform choice or it was when I was still
32:24SPEAKERmaking VR software, like Oculus would require,
32:26SPEAKERyou show hands and steam let you show either controllers or
32:30SPEAKERhands or actually steam lets you do whatever the hell you
32:32SPEAKERwant. But.
32:34SPEAKER- I, I,
32:35SPEAKERthis seems like it's probably up to the developer so far.
32:38SPEAKER- Generally speaking,
32:39SPEAKERit's good to show something cause like a lot of players
32:42SPEAKERwon't know what the buttons, like you, you, if you're,
32:47SPEAKERif you're building games for normal people to play,
32:49SPEAKERyou have to have them give them something that they can look
32:51SPEAKERdown at and see what buttons or what, so they know where
32:54SPEAKERtheir fingers are. Are they doing, are they doing, are there,
32:56SPEAKERis there touch sensitivity on the top of the controller?
32:58SPEAKERSo you can see where your thumb is.
33:00SPEAKER- No, there's no, there are no touch pads of any kind.
33:03SPEAKERThere's, there's an analog stick on each side,
33:05SPEAKERtwo face buttons,
33:07SPEAKERlike the PS button for menu and like options and share like
33:10SPEAKERkind of standard dual sense stuff.
33:11SPEAKER- But the,
33:12SPEAKERbut the top doesn't have the capacitive touch stuff.
33:14SPEAKER- No, there is, there is, there's no touch.
33:16SPEAKER- Cause on the, well, but.
33:18SPEAKER- The finger tracking, if you want to count that.
33:20SPEAKER- Well, that counts, but on the, on the index
33:22SPEAKERand the Oculus controllers, all of the,
33:25SPEAKERlike the tops of all the buttons and the tops of all the
33:27SPEAKERsticks and all that stuff,
33:28SPEAKEReven the non touch area is still capacitive.
33:31SPEAKERSo it can tell that your finger is on, like you, you,
33:34SPEAKERyou get like, if you're,
33:37SPEAKERthis is how Oculus does all their hand presence stuff.
33:40SPEAKERSo you know where you,
33:41SPEAKERlike you could look down with the headset on and see where
33:43SPEAKERyour thumb is because the controller knows where your thumb
33:45SPEAKERis resting, even if you're not putting any input in.
33:48SPEAKER- Okay. This does not have that.
33:49SPEAKERThat sounds really nice.
33:51SPEAKER- Yeah. It's, it ends up being,
33:52SPEAKERit's one of those things that sounds really stupid,
33:54SPEAKERexcept if you're, if you can't see your hand
33:58SPEAKERand you need to know whether you're on the X or the A
34:00SPEAKERbutton, it turns out to be really important.
34:04SPEAKERSo, yeah.
34:07SPEAKERBut the, but the, the finger and hand tracking stuff is how
34:09SPEAKERdo, how are they doing the hand tracking with capacitive on
34:11SPEAKERthe, on the grips?
34:14SPEAKER- I don't know how they're doing the finger tracking
34:16SPEAKERactually all, all they, all they track,
34:18SPEAKERas far as I can tell, all their tracking is hand open,
34:20SPEAKERhand closed. There's no individual finger tracking.
34:24SPEAKERAnd so basically just moving your fingers in and out,
34:28SPEAKERit'll sense that.
34:29SPEAKERAnd then there's also the L1 and R1 are basically the grip
34:31SPEAKERbuttons. If you kind of squeeze a fist,
34:33SPEAKERyou'll be pushing L1 and R1 in and there are triggers as
34:37SPEAKERwell. It sounds like these controllers are maybe a little
34:40SPEAKERmore limited than what's on the PC, but.
34:43SPEAKER- So it says they do have finger touch detection on the
34:45SPEAKERbuttons. The games might just not be doing it.
34:47SPEAKER- Okay. So I guess I haven't seen anything.
34:49SPEAKERI'm trying to think.
34:50SPEAKER- Maybe you just haven't noticed. It's kind of,
34:52SPEAKERit's like, it's one of those things that if, like you,
34:54SPEAKERif they do it right, you shouldn't notice it.
34:56SPEAKER- Well, so there, like I said,
34:57SPEAKERthere have been very few instances where I see the actual
35:01SPEAKERsense controllers in, in virtual space.
35:04SPEAKERBy and large, if I see anything,
35:05SPEAKERit's like an end game hand models or like an end game gun.
35:09SPEAKERI think horizon, I want to say like horizon at the title
35:11SPEAKERscreen is the only time I remember seeing the literal,
35:14SPEAKERyou know, 3D versions of the literal controllers in front
35:17SPEAKERof my face.
35:17SPEAKER- Did they do like an Astros type game to showcase?
35:20SPEAKER- I think, I think they should have invested in a,
35:25SPEAKERan Astros playroom VR update.
35:27SPEAKER- Yeah. Like that, that was such a good showcase and it sets
35:30SPEAKERthe tone for all the developers come after this first wave.
35:33SPEAKERCause it teaches them the language of the platform,
35:35SPEAKERwhich is I think really important.
35:37SPEAKER- I mean, Astros playroom is kind of modeled after Astrobot
35:39SPEAKERrescue mission,
35:40SPEAKERwhich is the Astro game on the first PSVR that everybody
35:43SPEAKERloves so much. Cause it's awesome.
35:45SPEAKERAnd I wish they, and I've said this like five times now,
35:49SPEAKERthe hardware, all that PlayStation hardware,
35:51SPEAKERthat kind of history of PlayStation,
35:53SPEAKERthe Labo and Astros playroom were the coolest things I have
35:56SPEAKERever seen in a game because that hardware is so like
36:00SPEAKERexhaustively, exactingly detailed.
36:03SPEAKER- Oh yeah.
36:04SPEAKER- And, and operable in a lot of cases,
36:05SPEAKERyou can like inject discs and open lids and do all kinds of
36:08SPEAKERstuff.
36:09SPEAKERThose things are like begging to be picked up and like held
36:12SPEAKERright up to your face and played with in VR.
36:15SPEAKERAnd I'd, man, I would give anything that, you know,
36:18SPEAKERwhenever and everybody who has a PS5 has that game already,
36:21SPEAKERlike it just seems like a no brainer to me that they could
36:23SPEAKERhave just invested in.
36:24SPEAKERLike, here's a thing you will have if you buy this headset.
36:26SPEAKER- Or update the version that came with the PSV.
36:29SPEAKERI mean, look, yeah, yeah.
36:32SPEAKERWhat, how's these are USB-C internal batteries
36:36SPEAKERon the controllers charge charge last okay.
36:39SPEAKER- This seems fine-ish.
36:42SPEAKERI have people have been reporting like four or five hours.
36:44SPEAKERIt's kind of consistent more or less with what I've seen.
36:47SPEAKERI had an issue out of the box where my right one was dying a
36:50SPEAKERlot faster than the left one.
36:53SPEAKERI can't, it's been hard to tell if that's still the case.
36:55SPEAKERIt seems like it's kind of evening out now.
36:57SPEAKER- Okay.
36:58SPEAKER- I'm not quite clear what's going on there.
37:00SPEAKER- Does it have adaptive triggers?
37:02SPEAKER- Yes, it's got,
37:03SPEAKERit's got similar haptics and trigger resistance to the,
37:06SPEAKERthe dual sounds I should mention.
37:07SPEAKERI saw there's some articles going around.
37:09SPEAKERThere's like a ton of people on Reddit who are having a
37:12SPEAKERseparate issue with the right controller and like kind of
37:14SPEAKERnot being recognized at all.
37:17SPEAKER- That's bad.
37:18SPEAKER- But it seems like so many people that it might be a
37:20SPEAKERsoftware issue and not a, hopefully not a hardware defect.
37:22SPEAKERI don't know.
37:24SPEAKERTBD.
37:25SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah.
37:26SPEAKERThere you go.
37:28SPEAKERThe I'm trying to think what else, what else is,
37:32SPEAKERthe buttons are split on two on each side.
37:34SPEAKER- Yeah, two, two placement per, yeah.
37:37SPEAKER- Interesting.
37:39SPEAKER- Should we talk about games at all?
37:40SPEAKERDo you want to hear about games?
37:42SPEAKER- I mean, look, if the games aren't any good,
37:43SPEAKERthen there's no reason to buy anything ever.
37:45SPEAKERSo just to be, just to be clear,
37:46SPEAKERthe last thing we should talk about,
37:48SPEAKERthere's a microphone on the headset.
37:49SPEAKER- Yes.
37:50SPEAKER- The only way,
37:51SPEAKERthe only thing you plug in is into that USB-C that's on the
37:53SPEAKERfront of the PlayStation five, right?
37:55SPEAKER- Correct.
37:56SPEAKER- Does it work with the one on the back too?
37:58SPEAKER- I don't know.
38:01SPEAKER- I wonder if they're hot wired.
38:03SPEAKER- I could try it and get back to you.
38:05SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, you don't have to, but I'm, I'm,
38:07SPEAKERI'm curious if they have like a weird.
38:09SPEAKER- Now that I'm,
38:10SPEAKERnow that I'm worried about that port on the front,
38:12SPEAKERmaybe I should try that just so I can still use that thing
38:15SPEAKERif that port dies.
38:16SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, my experience with USB ports are generally
38:19SPEAKERpretty sturdy too.
38:20SPEAKER- Yeah.
38:22SPEAKER- Yeah, I'm, I'm curious.
38:23SPEAKERI am, is the head vibration like worth talking about?
38:28SPEAKER- I have never noticed it that I can remember,
38:31SPEAKERexcept when you turn the thing on.
38:32SPEAKERCause it vibrates in a pretty pronounced way
38:35SPEAKERwhen you turn it on.
38:36SPEAKERAnd I'm sure some games are using it.
38:38SPEAKERI'm just, it's just not leaping out at me.
38:40SPEAKER- Is the, is the,
38:41SPEAKERdoes it still do the thing where you can have like stuff
38:43SPEAKERon the TV and stuff in the headset
38:44SPEAKERand it's different stuff in the headset than on the TV?
38:47SPEAKER- I think that's going to be game dependent.
38:48SPEAKERI don't think there's anything at launch.
38:50SPEAKERAre you talking about like actual asymmetric multiplayer?
38:53SPEAKER- Play room thing where like one person could be the monster
38:55SPEAKERand the other four people sitting on the couch could,
38:57SPEAKERcould be the,
38:58SPEAKERcould drive the characters as you chase them or whatever.
39:01SPEAKER- I want to say there is nothing at launch that does that,
39:04SPEAKERbut obviously that could change.
39:06SPEAKERIt's totally possible.
39:07SPEAKERThey actually, one interesting thing they do,
39:10SPEAKERyou can add a giant border to the TV output,
39:13SPEAKERwhich allow, which it helps, helps tracking.
39:16SPEAKERIt's like, it's a giant fat border.
39:18SPEAKERThat's got all kinds of crazy, like.
39:19SPEAKER- Oh, cause it has the cameras so it can see the,
39:21SPEAKERit can see like it has weird fiducials in the border.
39:24SPEAKERThat's neat.
39:24SPEAKER- So, so if you were using it in front of your TV
39:27SPEAKERand you're having tracking issues,
39:28SPEAKERyou can turn that on and it should help it.
39:29SPEAKER- So here's a stupid question,
39:31SPEAKERbut could you like take that out in your backyard
39:33SPEAKERand run an extension cord to the PlayStation
39:36SPEAKERand not have to bring a TV and it'll still work?
39:39SPEAKER- I've been playing it with my TV and receiver turned off.
39:41SPEAKERSo I think the answer is yes.
39:43SPEAKER- That's cool.
39:44SPEAKER- You definitely don't have to have that on for tracking.
39:46SPEAKERThat's just an aid.
39:48SPEAKERSo I don't know what the max length on USB-C is.
39:53SPEAKER- Yeah.
39:54SPEAKER- For USB-A, I think, well for USB-2,
39:56SPEAKERit's like 15 feet and it might be shorter for USB-3.
39:59SPEAKERI'm not sure.
40:00SPEAKER- Yeah. It's hard.
40:01SPEAKERI will tell you it's hard to find,
40:03SPEAKERdepends on whether it's a 3.1 or 3.2.
40:07SPEAKERIt's hard to find cables longer than about 10 feet
40:09SPEAKERthat are USB-3, the faster versions of USB-3.
40:13SPEAKER- I think it is something like three meters
40:15SPEAKERis maybe the max for three.
40:17SPEAKER- Yeah. And that'll include
40:18SPEAKERwhat's already hanging out of the headset.
40:20SPEAKERHow long is the wire?
40:21SPEAKER- I would estimate maybe 10 feet or so.
40:23SPEAKERI'm not 100% sure, but it's decent.
40:26SPEAKER- Last thing is what's the FOV like?
40:28SPEAKERIs it like looking through a pair of swimming goggles?
40:30SPEAKERI know they say it's 110 degrees,
40:32SPEAKERbut that doesn't mean a whole lot to a lot of people.
40:35SPEAKER- You can definitely notice the edges of the screens
40:39SPEAKERif you're looking for it.
40:40SPEAKER- Okay.
40:42SPEAKER- But it's fine.
40:43SPEAKER- Okay.
40:44SPEAKER- I tend to just tune that out after a couple of minutes.
40:47SPEAKER- Yeah. You kind of don't know.
40:49SPEAKERYou just start moving your head
40:50SPEAKERinstead of using your eyes for stuff.
40:52SPEAKER- Yeah.
40:53SPEAKER- Cool.
40:54SPEAKER- So there's only one game that you can't play
40:56SPEAKERon a headset you already own and that's Horizon,
40:58SPEAKERCall of the Mountain.
40:59SPEAKER- Well, I mean, but I, so like I assume that people
41:02SPEAKERaren't buying three headsets for their house, right?
41:05SPEAKER- No, no, no.
41:06SPEAKERI meant you specifically.
41:07SPEAKER- Oh, that I specifically can't already play.
41:08SPEAKEROkay.
41:09SPEAKER- Not you, you the general audience, but you Will Smith.
41:12SPEAKERYou can play just about everything that I have been playing.
41:14SPEAKER- And as the only person who in the world
41:16SPEAKERwho doesn't really, isn't super into Horizon,
41:18SPEAKERlike I love the art in Horizon,
41:20SPEAKERbut I kind of am kind of male in the game.
41:23SPEAKERIt's like, what's the game?
41:25SPEAKER- I've been, so I've been really impressed with it.
41:28SPEAKERThere's absolutely budget behind it.
41:31SPEAKERLike it looks really nice.
41:32SPEAKERIt's one of the better looking games I've seen in VR.
41:34SPEAKERI mean, it's not, if you saw it on a TV, it looks fine.
41:37SPEAKERIt's not mind blowing, but it's like,
41:38SPEAKERit's just higher fidelity than what you expect
41:41SPEAKERin VR in particular.
41:43SPEAKER- Okay.
41:44SPEAKER- Like there are character interactions, you know,
41:45SPEAKERthere's story stuff and the character models
41:47SPEAKERlook quite good.
41:48SPEAKERYou know, they animate cables as well as they do
41:51SPEAKERin regular Horizon.
41:52SPEAKER- When you're talking to another character,
41:55SPEAKERcan you like walk through?
41:55SPEAKER- Oh, I don't want to spoil.
41:56SPEAKER- Did they react to that stuff?
41:57SPEAKER- I don't want to spoil this.
41:58SPEAKERI wanted to show it on the next lander streams
42:00SPEAKERwe did this week.
42:02SPEAKERThe way the saves work, I couldn't get back to a place
42:04SPEAKERwhere there were characters.
42:05SPEAKERAnd then I got back there and it was the middle of the night
42:07SPEAKERand everybody was gone.
42:08SPEAKERSo they react to it.
42:11SPEAKERI tried.
42:11SPEAKER- Okay.
42:12SPEAKERThey're like, hey, get out of my face or whatever.
42:14SPEAKER- Well, they lean away from you.
42:17SPEAKERSo the only place I've been able to do it,
42:19SPEAKERit has choice driven conversations,
42:22SPEAKERkind of similar to the real Horizon.
42:25SPEAKER- Do you use like a menu to navigate choice
42:26SPEAKERor do you yell at the TV?
42:27SPEAKER- It's menu driven, but you can use your eyes.
42:30SPEAKERLike the game uses eye tracking for all the menus.
42:32SPEAKER- How does that work?
42:34SPEAKERHow does that feel?
42:34SPEAKER- It's very responsive.
42:36SPEAKERIt's very, there's a little calibration utility
42:39SPEAKERwhen you do the setup initially that lets you test.
42:41SPEAKERThere's just a big radial bunch of dots
42:44SPEAKERyou can look around at.
42:45SPEAKERAnd also you can see your eyes in the middle
42:46SPEAKERand see them blinking and moving.
42:48SPEAKER- Is it like look and hold to select stuff
42:51SPEAKERor do you click a button when you've chosen
42:52SPEAKERthe thing you want?
42:53SPEAKER- It's just a soft select.
42:55SPEAKERBut like doing that little utility with all the dots,
42:58SPEAKERit's like basically real time,
42:59SPEAKERlike just about as fast as you can move your eyes around it.
43:02SPEAKER- Yeah, eye trackers are pretty cool.
43:03SPEAKER- It's very responsive.
43:05SPEAKERIt's actually cognitively been a big adjustment in games
43:09SPEAKERwhere I'm not expecting it to be there.
43:12SPEAKERAnd it's like, sometimes you'll like button over to a menu
43:15SPEAKERand hit the button without really looking at it,
43:18SPEAKERor like when you're looking at something else.
43:19SPEAKERAnd there've been times when I like glanced at another
43:21SPEAKERoption at the last second before I hit the button
43:24SPEAKERand accidentally picked the wrong menu thing.
43:26SPEAKERLike it's just something you have to get used to.
43:27SPEAKERIt's fine.
43:28SPEAKERIt works really well.
43:29SPEAKERBut what was the, oh.
43:32SPEAKER- Like what's the game?
43:34SPEAKER- You were asking about walking through people.
43:36SPEAKERSo when you do those dialogue scenes,
43:38SPEAKERit kind of like fades to black and back up
43:40SPEAKERto where you're rooted in place talking to them.
43:43SPEAKERBut of course you can kind of walk out
43:45SPEAKERof the place you're rooted.
43:48SPEAKER'Cause I think without the outside of those dialogue scenes,
43:50SPEAKERit won't let you get close to them.
43:52SPEAKERBut I could be right, anyway.
43:54SPEAKERThey'll like lean back away from you in a way
43:59SPEAKERit's like really socially awkward.
44:01SPEAKERLike you're getting too close to them
44:03SPEAKERand you're like the stereotypical close talker or whatever.
44:07SPEAKERLike it's like it's weirdly like realistic
44:12SPEAKERin a this video game character is annoyed
44:14SPEAKERwith me getting their face.
44:17SPEAKER- I like that.
44:18SPEAKERThat was the thing with the Star Wars ILMx lab stuff
44:23SPEAKERwhere like you're talking to Darth Vader
44:26SPEAKERand if you like walk up and get right up
44:27SPEAKERin Darth Vader's face, he doesn't react to him.
44:31SPEAKERYou gotta react 'cause like there's no,
44:33SPEAKERlike it immediately breaks it
44:35SPEAKERwhen you do something stupid like that.
44:36SPEAKER- I'm not suggesting they necessarily implemented
44:38SPEAKERlike reactive social behavior here.
44:40SPEAKERThat might just be some collision thing
44:42SPEAKERor something that's happening automatically.
44:44SPEAKER- It's still better than not having it.
44:45SPEAKER- The net effect, yeah.
44:46SPEAKERAnd I just didn't have enough room in my space
44:48SPEAKERto walk any closer.
44:49SPEAKERSo it's possible you could eventually
44:51SPEAKERlike see the inside of somebody's teeth or whatever.
44:56SPEAKERSo the game is first person, of course.
45:00SPEAKERIt's basically a lot of climbing and a lot of bow combat
45:04SPEAKERis primarily the game so far.
45:06SPEAKERThat's basically what I've seen.
45:07SPEAKER- Not the traps and stuff.
45:08SPEAKER- What's that?
45:09SPEAKER- Not setting the traps and lures
45:10SPEAKERand all those stuff that you did in the first game.
45:12SPEAKER- Well, so the combat is super simplified.
45:14SPEAKERLike you lose locomotion when you get into combat.
45:19SPEAKERAnd you can only strafe left and right
45:20SPEAKERand kind of an arch around the enemies.
45:23SPEAKERBut there's a possibility that they will roll out traps.
45:25SPEAKERLike I have arrow types,
45:27SPEAKERlike you've got shock and blaze arrows,
45:29SPEAKERlike the original game.
45:31SPEAKERThe combat has been pretty fast paced and snappy
45:33SPEAKERand like kind of having to draw and knock an arrow
45:37SPEAKERas I'm like strafing away to try to not get killed.
45:41SPEAKER- Is it like reach over your shoulder
45:42SPEAKERto grab the arrow and pull it?
45:43SPEAKERThat's really fun.
45:44SPEAKER- It feels pretty good.
45:45SPEAKERAnd it's like, it's fast enough
45:46SPEAKERthat it's kind of demanding and cool.
45:50SPEAKER- I mean, we talk about verbs a lot with VR development,
45:54SPEAKER'cause in like normal, in like Call of Duty,
45:55SPEAKERyour verbs are jump and run and open and shoot, right?
46:00SPEAKEROr maybe throw a grenade.
46:03SPEAKERAre games like Horizon using more verbs
46:06SPEAKERthan in like the normal flat game?
46:09SPEAKER- Oh, you mean like non-VR games?
46:12SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah.
46:13SPEAKER- Oh, I was gonna compare two other VR games I had played.
46:17SPEAKER- I mean, both are valid answers.
46:20SPEAKER- Horizon is mostly climb.
46:23SPEAKERThere's jump, which I had not seen in a VR game.
46:25SPEAKERThe thing I was gonna say earlier is
46:26SPEAKERI never played the climb.
46:28SPEAKERI don't know if you did.
46:29SPEAKER- Yeah, I played a lot of it.
46:30SPEAKERIt's really fun.
46:31SPEAKER- So I've seen some comparisons to the climb and this game.
46:35SPEAKERSo that-
46:36SPEAKER- There's a couple of really good kind of climbing games
46:38SPEAKERout there actually.
46:39SPEAKER- So that might be a point of reference
46:39SPEAKERfor people who have played those games.
46:41SPEAKERSo there are cases where you'll like jump a chasm
46:43SPEAKERand then it'll expect you to like pull out your pickaxe
46:46SPEAKERand like grab the cliffside before you fall.
46:49SPEAKERSo there's kind of jump, climb, shoot bow,
46:52SPEAKERpick up physics objects, like physically modeled objects
46:55SPEAKERand throw them around if you want.
46:56SPEAKERAnd that's kind of it.
46:58SPEAKER- How do they handle movement when you're not able,
47:01SPEAKERlike movement desync between the player character
47:05SPEAKERin the game and the,
47:06SPEAKERlike obviously you're not jumping across your living room.
47:08SPEAKERSo do you blink or is it like it just lurps?
47:12SPEAKERIt's like a real fast, smooth movement with no acceleration.
47:15SPEAKERAre you getting motion sick?
47:16SPEAKER- Not in that game.
47:17SPEAKERThe only games I've,
47:18SPEAKERthe only times I've had motion sickness issues
47:20SPEAKERare in Gran Turismo driving a car
47:23SPEAKERand Kayak VR Mirage, which I generally think is awesome.
47:28SPEAKER- Yeah, those games are really cool,
47:31SPEAKERbut some people immediately flip out
47:33SPEAKERwith motion sickness on them and I don't exactly.
47:36SPEAKERSo the rule on motion is generally
47:38SPEAKERthat if you do linear, like immediate acceleration,
47:41SPEAKERthere's no acceleration from stationary to moving.
47:45SPEAKERGenerally people are okay,
47:46SPEAKERespecially if there's like a cockpit
47:48SPEAKERor some frame around them that gives them an anchor point.
47:52SPEAKERBut if you do like gentle acceleration,
47:55SPEAKERthat's real bad for some people.
47:56SPEAKER- Yeah, and that's kind of exactly how a kayak works
47:58SPEAKER'cause you're kind of picking up speed as you paddle.
48:00SPEAKERThat game is awesome.
48:01SPEAKER- Same thing for the car.
48:02SPEAKER- Other than that though, because it's very physics-y.
48:07SPEAKER- Look, it's kind of stupid, right?
48:09SPEAKER'Cause it's like that Simpsons joke about Nightboat
48:12SPEAKERwhere all the crimes seem to happen next to canals.
48:14SPEAKER- Sure.
48:16SPEAKER- But also, you know, it's a video game, so who cares?
48:19SPEAKER- That game looks great.
48:20SPEAKERI guess actually that came out on Steam VR last summer.
48:23SPEAKERSo that's been out for a bit.
48:25SPEAKER- No, they did a quest version, at least a quest predecessor.
48:29SPEAKERI don't think it's that exact same game.
48:30SPEAKER- Okay, that's just a nice chill paddle around
48:33SPEAKERin some very pretty environments kind of thing.
48:36SPEAKER- But don't you also have to murk people, I think?
48:37SPEAKER- There are kayak races.
48:40SPEAKERBut those are, you might be thinking of it.
48:41SPEAKEROh no, you're thinking of it.
48:42SPEAKEROh, you're thinking of the Tackyak.
48:46SPEAKER- Yeah, I'm thinking of the Tackyak, exactly.
48:48SPEAKER- Man, I hope that game comes out on this.
48:50SPEAKERTackyak, what is the name of that game?
48:53SPEAKER- Oh God.
48:54SPEAKER- Kayak VR Mirage is a very chill, low-key,
48:57SPEAKERlike just hang out in-
48:59SPEAKER- Phantom Covert Ops is what it's called.
49:02SPEAKER- Please let that come out on.
49:03SPEAKER- It is basically Splinter Cell in a kayak.
49:08SPEAKER- Oh, that was, is that Oculus exclusive?
49:10SPEAKERIt looks like it might be.
49:12SPEAKER- It was from the people who made Shooty Free, I think,
49:14SPEAKERbut I'm not sure.
49:15SPEAKER- I think that might still be an Oculus-only game.
49:17SPEAKERActually, that's unfortunate.
49:19SPEAKER- Oh, boo.
49:21SPEAKERYeah, anytime I hear kayaks,
49:22SPEAKERI think I'm gonna get my giant rifle out and murk people.
49:26SPEAKER- Who would not think of the Tackyak at every opportunity?
49:29SPEAKER- Yeah, it's a genre just on the cusp
49:33SPEAKERof explosions. - Yeah.
49:34SPEAKERSo, I mean, generally, if you have a nice PC headset,
49:37SPEAKERyou probably don't need to get one of these things.
49:39SPEAKERLike, Horizon is cool, but it is by no means,
49:42SPEAKERgo spend $600 cool.
49:44SPEAKER- Yeah, and like,
49:45SPEAKERGran Turismo 7 obviously is a PlayStation exclusive,
49:48SPEAKERbut also there's a bunch,
49:50SPEAKERlike everything from iRacing to like Assetto Corso,
49:53SPEAKERand most of the racing games on PC support VR.
49:56SPEAKER- You're not starved for VR racing on PC.
49:58SPEAKERNo Man's Sky has gotten a very nice new VR update,
50:01SPEAKERbut that's also on PC.
50:03SPEAKER- Yeah, even Forza Horizon's,
50:05SPEAKERthe new Forza Horizon supports VR on PC.
50:07SPEAKER- Oh, wow, shit, that's crazy.
50:09SPEAKERResident Evil Village got a pretty nice VR update,
50:13SPEAKERwhich I don't think is on PC, or it might actually,
50:18SPEAKERit's hard to tell.
50:19SPEAKER- Yeah, the Resident Evil,
50:20SPEAKERthose Resident Evil VR games have been real up and down.
50:25SPEAKER- This one, so this one is a lot more elaborate
50:27SPEAKERthan 7 was, I played through all of 7 in VR.
50:30SPEAKERThis one is much more independent hand controls,
50:32SPEAKERlike flashlight and reloading your gun manually
50:35SPEAKERand stuff like that.
50:37SPEAKERSo it seems cool enough.
50:41SPEAKERThe Resident Evil 4 remake that's coming out next month
50:43SPEAKERjust announced there will be a VR mode for that,
50:45SPEAKERalthough not at launch.
50:47SPEAKER- Okay. - Some stats.
50:48SPEAKERLike there's games, there's probably,
50:51SPEAKERI'm just super ball-parking here, 20 to 25 things out now,
50:57SPEAKERmaybe 30 things or even more than that maybe to play.
51:00SPEAKER- And there's a lot of updates for PSVR 1 games
51:04SPEAKERthat people went back in and did the work
51:05SPEAKERto do the port over.
51:06SPEAKERSo like Vacation Sim and-
51:09SPEAKER- Yes, Chop Simulator.
51:10SPEAKER- I think, yeah, Tetris Effect gets a-
51:13SPEAKER- So Tetris Effect and Res Infinite are paid updates,
51:16SPEAKERso those are 10 bucks a piece.
51:18SPEAKER- I look, I don't, I feel-
51:21SPEAKER- So they're not, oh, go ahead, go ahead.
51:24SPEAKER- I was gonna say, they're just small studios.
51:25SPEAKER- They totally are, but also they did work on those.
51:27SPEAKERSo Res Infinite has eye tracking for aiming now,
51:29SPEAKERwhich is interesting.
51:30SPEAKER- Oh, oh man, that's dope.
51:32SPEAKER- It's cool, it took me by surprise
51:34SPEAKERand it very much was kind of hard to get used to.
51:36SPEAKERI think you might be, it'll be probably subject
51:39SPEAKERto your taste if you wanna keep using it or not,
51:41SPEAKERbut they did that.
51:42SPEAKERLike Tetris Effect is getting a bunch of new modes,
51:44SPEAKERso it's not just VR support that you're paying for there.
51:50SPEAKERLet's see, there are a decent number of updates here,
51:53SPEAKERlike Thumper, that stuff of that nature.
51:58SPEAKER- I'm kind of like bummed that like the last,
52:00SPEAKERlike some of the real bangers of the last year
52:03SPEAKERon Quest and Steam, like the Last Clockwinder
52:08SPEAKERand stuff like that aren't showing up here.
52:10SPEAKER- Oh no, Last Clockwinder is, oh actually,
52:13SPEAKERlet me check the release dates.
52:15SPEAKERLast Clockwinder is definitely coming.
52:18SPEAKER- Oh yeah, it is, I was looking under T
52:19SPEAKERand it's under L, sorry.
52:20SPEAKER- I'm not sure if it was at launch or not.
52:24SPEAKER- But like Moss and Moss 2,
52:26SPEAKERhow did the No Man's Sky, did you spend any time with that?
52:31SPEAKER- Yeah, it's so rad, like.
52:33SPEAKER- Is the perf good?
52:34SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah, it runs totally beautifully.
52:38SPEAKERBut like they integrated a lot of the UI
52:40SPEAKERinto just like cool, goofy sci-fi stuff,
52:42SPEAKERlike all the menus pop out of your wrist now.
52:46SPEAKERLike you hold your left wrist up and point at it
52:49SPEAKERwith your right hand and a big holographic menu
52:51SPEAKERjust pops out and it tracks to your hand movement.
52:54SPEAKERSo you're like-- - Everybody loves a good,
52:56SPEAKERdiegetic menu. - Oh, it's so awesome.
52:58SPEAKERLike the analysis visor is the same way.
53:00SPEAKERLike basically all the in-game computer stuff
53:02SPEAKERis now like kind of holographic stuff you can manipulate.
53:06SPEAKERAnd of course, you know, I think this was
53:08SPEAKERin the old VR mode, like all the stuff in the cockpit,
53:10SPEAKERyou know, you're grabbing the flight stick
53:12SPEAKERand like grabbing the release on the canopy
53:14SPEAKERto get out and stuff, like it's awesome.
53:18SPEAKER- That's really cool.
53:20SPEAKER- So yeah.
53:20SPEAKER- So how much is it?
53:22SPEAKERIt's like 400 bucks. - No, no, no, no,
53:23SPEAKER550 for just the headset, 600 for the Horizon bundle.
53:28SPEAKERYeah.
53:28SPEAKER- But the headset comes with the controllers.
53:30SPEAKER- Yes, controllers are thrown in there, so that's--
53:31SPEAKER- You can't buy it without the controllers this time.
53:34SPEAKERThank God. - Almost every,
53:35SPEAKERRez and Tetris were the only games I found
53:37SPEAKERthat did not require the new controllers.
53:39SPEAKERBecause my controllers were not charged enough
53:41SPEAKERto use out of the box.
53:43SPEAKERSo I finished set up and immediately it was like,
53:46SPEAKERwell, your controllers are too dead to use,
53:48SPEAKERcharge them please.
53:49SPEAKERAnd so I can only play Tetris and Rez, anyway.
53:52SPEAKER- Does it come with a stand for the controllers?
53:53SPEAKER- No, that's another 50 bucks, charging stand.
53:56SPEAKER- Of course.
53:59SPEAKERYeah, I mean, it sounds interesting.
54:01SPEAKERLike it sounds like they actually made a really compelling
54:04SPEAKERheadset this go round.
54:05SPEAKER- It's much better than the first one, much, much better.
54:08SPEAKERLike is it, it's comparable to the PC stuff.
54:10SPEAKERLike I was gonna say, is it better than the PC stuff?
54:12SPEAKERNot having used it myself, but looking at specs
54:14SPEAKERand reading people's experiences, absolutely not.
54:16SPEAKERLike it is, it's competitive with PC headsets,
54:19SPEAKERbut not superior.
54:21SPEAKER- Well, the eye tracking, the eye tracking is a big deal.
54:25SPEAKERThe other thing is like the, let's see the,
54:29SPEAKERthe current kind of like windows mixed reality preferred
54:33SPEAKERheadset is the, is the HP Reverb G2, which is 500.
54:39SPEAKERI think it lists for 600 bucks is usually around 500.
54:42SPEAKER- Yeah, those things are cheap.
54:44SPEAKERI got my, my, my mixed reality headset is much older,
54:47SPEAKERbut I got that thing for like 200 bucks.
54:48SPEAKERThose go on sale a lot and stuff.
54:51SPEAKER- That was also cause it was on close out.
54:52SPEAKERThose Lenovo's were, I bought one of those when
54:55SPEAKERit was really cheap too.
54:58SPEAKERThe, the, the big, the big thing for me is that they
55:01SPEAKERactually come with good controllers.
55:03SPEAKERAnd the only thing you're going to get comparable controllers
55:05SPEAKERon like the mixed reality controllers aren't great.
55:09SPEAKERThe valve index controllers are really nice.
55:11SPEAKERThe Oculus controller is pretty good too.
55:14SPEAKERSo it's, it's, I don't know.
55:15SPEAKERIt's, it's a weird, it's kind of a weird place
55:19SPEAKERfor this thing to be.
55:20SPEAKER- And just like VR in general is also still like
55:22SPEAKERin this weird in between where.
55:25SPEAKER- It's in the trough of despair, man.
55:27SPEAKER- It has not broken through and become mainstream
55:29SPEAKERto the point that they would fund a lot of big lavish games,
55:32SPEAKERwhich would be cool to see on hardware.
55:33SPEAKERThat's nice like this, but it's also,
55:36SPEAKERit's also still keeping on, you know, like it's,
55:41SPEAKERlike it didn't die.
55:42SPEAKERLike, you know, like there is, there is a VR market.
55:44SPEAKERIt's just not huge.
55:46SPEAKER- Well, okay.
55:47SPEAKERAnd they have like the fitness stuff they have,
55:49SPEAKERthey have some, they have pistol whip.
55:51SPEAKERDo they have, they have, they have beat saber, right?
55:54SPEAKER- The update, the beat saber's out on the first headset.
55:56SPEAKERI don't know when that update is coming out
55:59SPEAKERor if it's even.
56:00SPEAKER- It is not on the list that you sent of announced games,
56:02SPEAKERbut I think that was last updated.
56:04SPEAKER- I don't even know if actually the.
56:05SPEAKER- Oh, two days ago.
56:06SPEAKER- If the update has been announced or not.
56:09SPEAKER- I mean, Facebook owns them now, so they may not do it.
56:11SPEAKER- It is, okay, yeah.
56:12SPEAKERSo actually that did get announced last month.
56:14SPEAKER- Okay.
56:15SPEAKER- Excuse me, there will be an update for that.
56:19SPEAKERLike, I mean, that kind of stuff is really compelling.
56:24SPEAKERI'm, yeah, I don't know, this is, I'm excited about this.
56:27SPEAKERIt seems like a good, a good update
56:30SPEAKERto the venerable PlayStation VR platform.
56:33SPEAKER- I'll give them credit.
56:34SPEAKERI think this was the case in the first headset as well.
56:36SPEAKERThe entirety of the surface that contacts your face
56:39SPEAKERand head is rubber, rubberized.
56:42SPEAKERSo reasonably easy to wipe down.
56:44SPEAKERI sure did start sweating by the end
56:45SPEAKERof that launch day stream we did.
56:48SPEAKER- Well, I bet, yeah.
56:49SPEAKER- I've always been a little wary of doing fitness in VR
56:52SPEAKERjust 'cause it's such expensive hardware,
56:53SPEAKERbut this at least is fairly easy to clean.
56:56SPEAKER- Well, yeah, and I was gonna say that like the price,
56:58SPEAKER500 bucks is expensive for a console accessory.
57:00SPEAKERIt's cheap for a VR headset of this quality, right?
57:04SPEAKERLike you're in the, like better than a Quest,
57:10SPEAKERI think probably, or at least the money that you're spending
57:13SPEAKERis all going to the Quest,
57:14SPEAKERunlike the people that buy Quests to plug into a PC.
57:18SPEAKER- I guess that's kind of where I've landed with this
57:20SPEAKERin terms of like, is it worth the money?
57:22SPEAKER'Cause this plus a PS5 is a good $1,000 or more.
57:27SPEAKER- Yeah, easy.
57:28SPEAKER- Which obviously is more than a standalone Quest 2,
57:31SPEAKERbut if you're gonna use a Quest 2 with a PC
57:32SPEAKERto get the best graphics,
57:33SPEAKERthen that suddenly becomes way more than this.
57:37SPEAKER- Well, and the index is still like $1,400.
57:41SPEAKERI think it's expensive.
57:41SPEAKER- Yeah, like the index and the Vive Pro 2 and stuff
57:44SPEAKERare still quite expensive.
57:45SPEAKERSo the index is $999 with everything you need,
57:51SPEAKERnot carrying the PC.
57:52SPEAKER- Which could easily be way more than a PS5.
57:54SPEAKERSo it's still, you know, $1,000 is a lot of money,
57:58SPEAKERbut it's still on the low end
57:59SPEAKERof what a good VR experience is gonna run you.
58:02SPEAKERLet's just hope that the games keep coming.
58:05SPEAKERThey announced 15 new games for this thing this week
58:08SPEAKERon top of a good number that were already announced
58:10SPEAKERthat aren't out yet.
58:11SPEAKERSo I'm hopeful.
58:12SPEAKER- I mean, from like the whisper network tells me
58:15SPEAKERthat they're funding a lot of stuff.
58:17SPEAKER- That's perfect that you mean Sony, they meaning Sony.
58:19SPEAKER- Yeah, meaning Sony, they.
58:21SPEAKER- That's all you wanna hear.
58:22SPEAKERAnd I hope they're making stuff
58:23SPEAKERbecause again, like Astrobot Rescue Mission was amazing
58:25SPEAKERand they made that.
58:26SPEAKERLike Sony knows how to make good games
58:28SPEAKERand I really hope that they throw their resources
58:31SPEAKERinto doing so for this thing.
58:33SPEAKER- Yeah, I think they get it.
58:34SPEAKERLike, I'm kind of curious
58:36SPEAKERthat it's like some of the better content
58:37SPEAKERfrom the PSVR one that they made internally
58:39SPEAKERdidn't get ported over.
58:40SPEAKERBut I think I'd rather those teams work on new stuff
58:44SPEAKERthat maybe is coming to smooth out the...
58:47SPEAKER'Cause there's usually a lull after a new launch
58:49SPEAKERwhere like there's a lot of stuff in the launch window
58:51SPEAKERand then it's kind of quiet for a while.
58:54SPEAKERAnd like if an updated London heist
58:55SPEAKERor a new thing from that team hits in that lull,
58:59SPEAKERlike that's cool.
59:02SPEAKER- I don't know if you ever played the Until Dawn.
59:05SPEAKERWhat was that?
59:06SPEAKERUntil Dawn, Rush of Blood, I think was the name.
59:07SPEAKER- Yeah, that was too scary for me.
59:09SPEAKERThe Rush of Blood thing.
59:09SPEAKER- So they're doing that same type of game for Dark Pictures.
59:12SPEAKERIt's coming out next month, I wanna say.
59:14SPEAKERAnd that's using the eye tracking
59:16SPEAKERfor some fun horror stuff from what I've seen.
59:19SPEAKER- Great.
59:20SPEAKER- Which, okay, maybe you don't wanna play that one then.
59:22SPEAKER- No, thank you.
59:23SPEAKERThat doesn't sound good for me.
59:23SPEAKER- But anyway, it seems like
59:24SPEAKERthere is software development going on
59:26SPEAKERand that's exciting.
59:28SPEAKERLast thing real quick here before we go
59:30SPEAKERthat I wanna talk about is,
59:32SPEAKERfeels like a lot of people kind of,
59:34SPEAKERwell, okay, I totally understand why.
59:36SPEAKERLike the idea now that this thing is just USB-C
59:39SPEAKERof plugging it into a PC
59:40SPEAKERand being able to use it as a PC is very enticing.
59:44SPEAKER- That seems plausible.
59:47SPEAKER- So real quick, if you wanna know where that stuff is at.
59:51SPEAKERThe Verge, I had a bunch of people who tried this.
59:53SPEAKERThe Verge ran an article.
59:54SPEAKERThey tried plugging the USB-C port on this thing
59:58SPEAKERinto the port on an AMD card.
1:00:00SPEAKERI think it was a 6800 XT.
1:00:02SPEAKER- Yeah.
1:00:03SPEAKER- Windows saw it as a kind of generic 1080p monitor.
1:00:06SPEAKER- That's just 'cause it doesn't recognize it.
1:00:08SPEAKERSo it does what it thinks is the MVP.
1:00:10SPEAKER- Yeah.
1:00:11SPEAKER- So you tell me what the implications are there.
1:00:14SPEAKERI don't know if that.
1:00:15SPEAKER- The display is never,
1:00:16SPEAKERthe display is not gonna be the problem.
1:00:17SPEAKERThe problem is gonna be talking to the IMU
1:00:19SPEAKERand the tracking and all that stuff.
1:00:19SPEAKER- So we'll get to that.
1:00:20SPEAKERI mean, they speculated that means
1:00:22SPEAKERthat it's at least not encrypting the video signal.
1:00:24SPEAKERYou tell me if that's plausible or not.
1:00:26SPEAKER- I mean, yeah, but that's not,
1:00:28SPEAKERthey were not gonna encrypt the video.
1:00:30SPEAKERThe thing they'll encrypt is the data off of the thing.
1:00:32SPEAKERThere's no real reason for them to do that.
1:00:35SPEAKER- So the developer of, do you know how to pronounce this?
1:00:38SPEAKERIt's the driver that let you use the PSVR1 on PC.
1:00:41SPEAKER- I would call that ivory.
1:00:42SPEAKER- Ivory.
1:00:43SPEAKER- I think.
1:00:44SPEAKER- It's lowercase I, capital VR, lowercase Y.
1:00:46SPEAKERI guess ivory.
1:00:47SPEAKER- Ivory.
1:00:47SPEAKER- For sure.
1:00:48SPEAKERThe developer of that thing chimed in on Reddit
1:00:51SPEAKERnot long ago about this.
1:00:53SPEAKER- Yeah.
1:00:53SPEAKER- And he also actually just tweeted to somebody
1:00:56SPEAKERon like two days ago saying he's going to start working soon
1:01:00SPEAKERon seeing if he can get this thing working.
1:01:02SPEAKERBut this Reddit post is a whole lot of
1:01:04SPEAKERdo not get your hopes up on this.
1:01:06SPEAKERIt's going to be years, if ever,
1:01:08SPEAKERbefore this works on a PC.
1:01:09SPEAKER- I mean, unless Sony decides that they're gonna,
1:01:12SPEAKERlike, here's the thing.
1:01:14SPEAKERIt depends on how much Sony's subsidizing this thing, right?
1:01:17SPEAKERIf they're making money on this,
1:01:19SPEAKERthen they should put it out.
1:01:20SPEAKERAnd as soon as they reach the saturation
1:01:23SPEAKERwhere it's not in high demand on the console side
1:01:26SPEAKERfor console users, there's no downside to them releasing this
1:01:29SPEAKER'cause they just keep making more money
1:01:31SPEAKERif they sell it as a PC headset.
1:01:32SPEAKERThey're selling PC games.
1:01:33SPEAKER- Totally.
1:01:34SPEAKER- So DualSense 5 works as a PC controller.
1:01:37SPEAKER- If they're making money on the headset,
1:01:38SPEAKERbut that seems like a big, I mean, you tell me,
1:01:39SPEAKERI have no idea what the bill of materials
1:01:42SPEAKERfor something like this is these days,
1:01:43SPEAKERbut it seems like it can't be a high...
1:01:46SPEAKER- I mean, they're not using a cheap panel
1:01:48SPEAKERand they had to build custom controllers.
1:01:50SPEAKERSo I don't know.
1:01:51SPEAKER- This cannot be a high margin device right now, right?
1:01:53SPEAKER- I would assume not, but also they're not Microsoft
1:01:56SPEAKERand don't tend to, like,
1:01:58SPEAKERthey don't tend to subsidize stuff too much
1:02:00SPEAKERis my understanding.
1:02:01SPEAKER- Yeah, that's true.
1:02:01SPEAKER- Which is, yeah.
1:02:02SPEAKERI think everybody kind of stopped eating a loss on hardware
1:02:05SPEAKERexcept for Microsoft a while ago, right?
1:02:07SPEAKERSo they probably are making some money on it.
1:02:11SPEAKER- Yeah, like I'm really curious.
1:02:15SPEAKERLike it's an interesting,
1:02:17SPEAKERit's a really interesting position
1:02:18SPEAKER'cause like I have a fast USB-C port
1:02:20SPEAKERon the front of my computer.
1:02:22SPEAKERThis is better than most of the headsets I could buy.
1:02:27SPEAKERAnd it's half the price of the ones
1:02:28SPEAKERthat it's most competitive with.
1:02:30SPEAKER- So actually something I was gonna ask you
1:02:31SPEAKERbecause you mentioned the port on the front of your computer.
1:02:33SPEAKERDo you know if in the future where this guy
1:02:37SPEAKERgets a driver working that makes this thing work on a PC,
1:02:40SPEAKERwould it have to go into a USB-C out on a graphics card
1:02:42SPEAKERfor like latency reasons or not?
1:02:44SPEAKER- No, that's the whole point of,
1:02:46SPEAKERit depends, it has to go into a port that's wired right.
1:02:49SPEAKERBut if it's wired into the PCI express bus right,
1:02:53SPEAKERshould be fine.
1:02:53SPEAKERWhich means it has to be USB 3.2 or three,
1:02:57SPEAKERlike remember they renamed how USB-C works,
1:02:59SPEAKERthree works a few years ago and it's stupid now,
1:03:01SPEAKERbut it has to be the gen two ones I think
1:03:04SPEAKERin order for the video stuff to work at the right speed.
1:03:06SPEAKER- 3.2 gen two.
1:03:07SPEAKER- 3.2 gen two or 3.1 gen C here.
1:03:11SPEAKERLook man, I don't know.
1:03:13SPEAKERIt has to be the good port and it can't just be
1:03:15SPEAKERa physical port.
1:03:21SPEAKERAt 500 bucks it's the same price as a reverb, right?
1:03:26SPEAKERBut it works on your PlayStation five.
1:03:28SPEAKERI don't know, I'm into it.
1:03:29SPEAKERI think I'm glad they, it seems like they did a good job.
1:03:31SPEAKER- Yeah.
1:03:32SPEAKER- And the controllers being good will make a big,
1:03:34SPEAKERthe controller is being good at being required
1:03:35SPEAKERto make a big difference.
1:03:36SPEAKERCause it means people actually build games for them
1:03:38SPEAKERwhere the move controllers were kind of at best.
1:03:41SPEAKERAnd like, you couldn't expect anybody to have them.
1:03:43SPEAKER- Right, and so that's why I think like, for example,
1:03:45SPEAKERthe Resident Evil eight mode is way better than the seven
1:03:47SPEAKERone because those controllers are there
1:03:49SPEAKERand they can build a good motion control experience
1:03:53SPEAKERaround them.
1:03:54SPEAKER- There's a lot to be said about being able to pick
1:03:56SPEAKERsomething up and throwing it at something.
1:03:57SPEAKER- That's for sure, man, that's still my favorite thing
1:04:00SPEAKERin VR, either picking something up and throwing it
1:04:01SPEAKERor breaking it or both.
1:04:03SPEAKER- Yeah, exactly.
1:04:04SPEAKERI like poking my head through the wall.
1:04:05SPEAKER- That's fun too.
1:04:06SPEAKEROr, you know, like stepping outside of a vehicle
1:04:08SPEAKERyou shouldn't be stepping outside of.
1:04:10SPEAKERThere's always a good time.
1:04:11SPEAKERI said this on the stream,
1:04:14SPEAKERsomebody just make a rage room in VR.
1:04:16SPEAKERLike, you know, those places you can go rent time
1:04:18SPEAKERto just break shit.
1:04:20SPEAKER- Do you, despite all your rage,
1:04:22SPEAKERyou're still just a brad in a cage?
1:04:23SPEAKER- Just make a thing that is nothing
1:04:25SPEAKERbut very physically accurate breaking of stuff.
1:04:29SPEAKER- Wow, that's dark, Brad.
1:04:30SPEAKERI didn't expect this of you.
1:04:31SPEAKER- It would be fun as hell.
1:04:33SPEAKERLike get some fire going in there.
1:04:35SPEAKERA lot of glass, ceramics.
1:04:36SPEAKER- Wow.
1:04:37SPEAKER- Look, there's a lot of compute out there now.
1:04:38SPEAKERYou can do the physics.
1:04:40SPEAKER- You know, you know what else you can do?
1:04:42SPEAKER- What's that?
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1:06:09SPEAKER- Ooh.
1:06:11SPEAKER- You know how deep down the VIM rabbit hole I am?
1:06:14SPEAKER- Oh no.
1:06:15SPEAKER- Oh, oh no. - It's awesome.
1:06:17SPEAKER- Oh no.
1:06:18SPEAKER- I've never been this excited about a text editor.
1:06:20SPEAKERI can't believe this is becoming one of those podcasts now.
1:06:24SPEAKER- I was looking up the glob man page last night.
1:06:28SPEAKER- You can go glob yourself.
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1:06:38SPEAKER(upbeat music)