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097

96: National Ground Beef Day

2021-07-18 · 1:23:35

00:00SPEAKER- Hey Brad.

00:01SPEAKER- Hello.

00:02SPEAKER- I'm about to blow your mind.

00:03SPEAKER- Okay, I love to have my mind blown.

00:05SPEAKERThat's why I do this podcast, as a matter of fact.

00:07SPEAKER- We should have called this mind blowers.

00:08SPEAKERI feel like that might've gotten a different audience though.

00:11SPEAKER- It's too early on a Saturday for that.

00:13SPEAKER- So did you know that the Switch Pro Controller

00:15SPEAKERhas a blue light on it?

00:17SPEAKER- What?

00:18SPEAKER- On the home button.

00:19SPEAKER- Wait, no.

00:20SPEAKER- Yeah.

00:21SPEAKER- You modded that in.

00:21SPEAKER- Nope, that's a factory standard.

00:23SPEAKER- What, can I, hang on, can you just monologue?

00:25SPEAKERI'm gonna go get mine, I'll be right back.

00:26SPEAKER- Yeah, so I plugged in my Switch Pro Controller

00:28SPEAKERthe other day to charge it on my PC,

00:30SPEAKER'cause I was playing Mario Golf in here on a stream.

00:33SPEAKERAnd when I went to pick up the Switch Controller,

00:36SPEAKERI was shocked, shocked, I tell you.

00:40SPEAKERBecause I looked over at it,

00:41SPEAKERand there was a blue ring of light around the home button

00:45SPEAKERon the right side of the Switch Pro Controller.

00:47SPEAKERApparently, so I did a little research.

00:50SPEAKERI'll have to do this again when Brad gets,

00:51SPEAKERoh, he's back, thank goodness.

00:53SPEAKERI had to do a little bit of research

00:56SPEAKERto find out what's going on,

00:57SPEAKERbut it's been there forever.

00:59SPEAKER- I'm back.

01:00SPEAKER- I told everybody.

01:02SPEAKER- What's been there forever, the blue light?

01:03SPEAKER- The light has been there forever.

01:05SPEAKERApparently, Ring Fit uses it on the Joy-Cons

01:10SPEAKERif you set an alarm.

01:12SPEAKERSo if you set an alarm,

01:13SPEAKERthere'll be a little blinky blue light

01:14SPEAKERon the front of your Switch.

01:15SPEAKER- Wait, an alarm in Ring Fit

01:17SPEAKERor an alarm on the Switch itself?

01:18SPEAKER'Cause I didn't know the Switch could do alarms.

01:20SPEAKER- If you do an alarm in Ring Fit that's like,

01:22SPEAKERI wanna work out at nine o'clock every day.

01:23SPEAKER- Okay, okay.

01:25SPEAKER- And then when you go and look at the Switch

01:26SPEAKERon your entertainment console,

01:29SPEAKERthe little blue light will be on on the Joy-Con.

01:31SPEAKER- Oh, wait, the Joy-Cons have it too?

01:32SPEAKER- The Joy-Cons have it too.

01:33SPEAKER- What, hang on, I gotta get my Switch.

01:35SPEAKER- Are you kidding me?

01:36SPEAKER- No, okay, fine, I'll resist,

01:37SPEAKERbut the battery's dead in my Pro Controller.

01:40SPEAKER- Well, I mean, so that's how I,

01:42SPEAKERI literally played Mario Golf

01:44SPEAKERwith some friends the other day on a stream,

01:46SPEAKERand they were like, hey, you need,

01:49SPEAKERI was like, I'm gonna play with the Pro Controller.

01:51SPEAKERSo I plugged it into my PC,

01:52SPEAKERand as it was charging, nothing.

01:54SPEAKERAnd then when it got to the end of the charge,

01:55SPEAKERthe blue light came on.

01:56SPEAKERI was like, what the hell is this?

01:58SPEAKER- Wait, but I've never,

01:59SPEAKERI've charged this Pro Controller many times

02:01SPEAKERand then never used it.

02:02SPEAKERI've never seen that blue light, what?

02:04SPEAKER- Apparently the 9.0 firmware for the Switch enabled it.

02:07SPEAKER- Oh.

02:08SPEAKER- You can turn it on, maybe at some point,

02:10SPEAKERSteam Controller support switched it on.

02:13SPEAKERThat's all I can figure.

02:14SPEAKER- Well, I was just about to say,

02:16SPEAKERwhat do you think's gonna happen

02:17SPEAKERwhen I plug this thing into my PC?

02:18SPEAKER- It's gonna not turn on for a second,

02:20SPEAKERand it's gonna turn on for like one second,

02:22SPEAKERand it's gonna turn off until it's fully charged.

02:24SPEAKER- Well, that's underwhelming.

02:26SPEAKER- I mean, I didn't tell you,

02:27SPEAKERI didn't say this was a good cold open.

02:28SPEAKERI just said I had a cold open.

02:30SPEAKER- Wait, hang on.

02:31SPEAKERWe're setting up Pro Controller.

02:33SPEAKERWindows apparently knows what a Pro Controller is.

02:36SPEAKER- Yeah.

02:37SPEAKERIt's so weird that everybody talks to everybody now.

02:40SPEAKERLike, hey, I hooked my PS5 DualSense

02:43SPEAKERup to my phone the other day,

02:46SPEAKERand everything works.

02:47SPEAKERThe touchpad works, the click buttons,

02:49SPEAKERall the stuff that normally didn't work

02:50SPEAKERon iOS Controller support now works.

02:53SPEAKERAnd like it just, I was like, this is cool.

02:55SPEAKERThis is very useful.

02:56SPEAKER- I can't say that everybody talks to everybody

02:59SPEAKERbecause I don't know if you saw

03:00SPEAKERthat Sony put out a Linux driver

03:02SPEAKERfor all of their controllers,

03:04SPEAKERbut still has yet to release a Windows one.

03:06SPEAKER- Wait, no, there's a Windows one

03:08SPEAKERthat comes when you install the remote connection utility.

03:11SPEAKERThat remote play from the PS4 app only works

03:15SPEAKERif you have a DualShock or DualSense, I believe.

03:18SPEAKER- Right, but I don't know that they,

03:19SPEAKERI don't think they, but it's not a full driver.

03:21SPEAKERI don't think it fully enables everything.

03:22SPEAKER- No, that's what I'm saying, is that like the...

03:25SPEAKER- They don't need to, because Steam does that.

03:27SPEAKERLike that's the whole point.

03:28SPEAKERLike the Steam Controller mapping stuff

03:30SPEAKERthat they did for the Steam Controller,

03:31SPEAKERwhich we don't need to talk about the Steam Controller.

03:34SPEAKER- Look, it's not about what they need to do.

03:36SPEAKERIt's about what's polite to do.

03:38SPEAKERThey wrote a Linux driver,

03:39SPEAKERbut they didn't write a Windows driver.

03:40SPEAKERThis is just...

03:41SPEAKER- You're saying it's a pointed decision.

03:42SPEAKER- Look, if there is any podcast

03:44SPEAKERon which we can discuss passive-aggressive

03:47SPEAKERdriver release strategies, it's this one.

03:50SPEAKER(upbeat music)

04:20SPEAKER- Welcome to Brad and Will Made at TechPod, I'm Will.

04:22SPEAKER- I'm Brad, and I am happy to report

04:24SPEAKERthat this pro controller is still doing nothing.

04:27SPEAKER- Mission accomplished.

04:28SPEAKER- Yep.

04:30SPEAKER- So, hey, big news.

04:32SPEAKER- Uh-huh, what's that?

04:33SPEAKER- This is your birthday week.

04:34SPEAKER- Oh man, is that big?

04:35SPEAKERDoes that qualify, is that what qualifies

04:37SPEAKERas big news these days? - I think it's big news.

04:38SPEAKER- I don't know.

04:39SPEAKER- The festival of Brad starts now.

04:41SPEAKER- I mean, you're older than me, so maybe you know better,

04:44SPEAKERbut I feel like I've passed that point

04:46SPEAKERwhere you stop getting excited about your birthday

04:49SPEAKERand you start to dread it, or you just didn't.

04:50SPEAKERMark's another step on the path to--

04:53SPEAKER- Wow, wow.

04:56SPEAKER- I'm sorry.

04:57SPEAKER- It's Saturday morning, man.

04:58SPEAKER- I'm sorry.

05:00SPEAKER- How do you pour coffee for this?

05:01SPEAKERNo, it's--

05:02SPEAKER- Look, here's the thing.

05:04SPEAKERI was on your path for a long time,

05:06SPEAKERand then I had a young child enter my life,

05:08SPEAKERand I'm gonna go ahead and tell you,

05:10SPEAKERbirthdays, Mother's Day, Mother's Days.

05:13SPEAKER- They're fun again.

05:14SPEAKER- Valentine's Day, St. Patrick's Day.

05:18SPEAKER- And Flag Day.

05:19SPEAKER- Mm-hmm.

05:20SPEAKER- Like, we celebrate 'em all.

05:21SPEAKER- Yeah.

05:22SPEAKER- We just get in there.

05:23SPEAKERWe get up in there.

05:24SPEAKERLike, sometimes we'll be like,

05:25SPEAKER"Hey, you want some Flag Day cupcakes?"

05:26SPEAKERI'm like, "Hell yeah, I want some Flag Day cupcakes."

05:29SPEAKER- I mean, if you think about it,

05:30SPEAKERevery day can be a holiday if you want it bad enough.

05:33SPEAKER- Yes.

05:34SPEAKERSo anyway. - Let me see.

05:35SPEAKERHold on, hang on.

05:36SPEAKERWell, we're doing it.

05:37SPEAKER- Uh-huh.

05:38SPEAKER- Okay.

05:38SPEAKER- Are you gonna look up and see what the days are?

05:40SPEAKER- Oh, wow, are there not actually enough

05:42SPEAKERto fill every single day on the calendar?

05:43SPEAKERI'm looking at, this is according to timeanddate.com,

05:47SPEAKERholidays and observances in the United States of 2021.

05:51SPEAKER- Yeah, I'm gonna guess.

05:51SPEAKER- There are gaps.

05:52SPEAKER- National Funnel Cake Day?

05:53SPEAKER- There are gaps.

05:54SPEAKERThat's the thing.

05:55SPEAKERYou always hear about National Funnel Cake Day

05:56SPEAKERor, you know, there's something going on.

05:58SPEAKERIt's like, "Ah, it's National Ground Beef Day."

06:00SPEAKER- Okay.

06:01SPEAKER- Like, something is always, also,

06:03SPEAKERplease let me know when it's National Ground Beef Day.

06:06SPEAKERThat is one that I will happily celebrate.

06:08SPEAKER- Wait, I have an idea, Brad.

06:10SPEAKERThis is a good idea.

06:11SPEAKERLike, I've been studying some podcast history

06:13SPEAKERand I realized that other, like,

06:16SPEAKERI'm not gonna say which podcast,

06:17SPEAKERbut other famous podcast made some big nationwide moves,

06:21SPEAKERcampaigns, if you will, to get placed in films

06:25SPEAKERsuch as DreamWorks' "Trolls 2."

06:27SPEAKER- Oh, yes, I've heard such whisperings.

06:30SPEAKER- And it, like, I think it got them noticed

06:32SPEAKERin really big places because they swung big.

06:34SPEAKERThey went for the fences.

06:35SPEAKERThey were like, "We wanna be in 'Trolls 2.'"

06:37SPEAKER- That's right, you gotta take your swing.

06:39SPEAKERYou gotta shoot your shot.

06:40SPEAKER- Yeah, so, like, my first thought was,

06:43SPEAKER"Brad, we should try to get in 'Trolls 2' too."

06:45SPEAKER(chuckles)

06:47SPEAKER- Does that, is also known as "Trolls 3"?

06:49SPEAKERIs that what you're saying?

06:49SPEAKER- No, I meant "Trolls 2" also, I guess.

06:53SPEAKERLike, we should try to get into "Trolls 2."

06:54SPEAKER- Suggesting we time travel to appear in a movie

06:57SPEAKERthat already released years ago?

07:00SPEAKER- No, okay, you're thinking,

07:01SPEAKERyou're thinking in a 20th century way

07:03SPEAKERwhen people released movies and then they never changed.

07:06SPEAKER- This is like a linear fashion.

07:09SPEAKER- Yeah, I think we need to engage

07:10SPEAKERwith the director of "Trolls 2"

07:14SPEAKERand establish that they need to do a director's cut

07:17SPEAKERthat features those other guys,

07:19SPEAKERbut then also you, and this, I think this might be,

07:22SPEAKERI've moved beyond this idea now.

07:24SPEAKER- When "Trolls World Tour Special Edition" comes out

07:26SPEAKERis what you're saying.

07:27SPEAKERAre you saying we should replace existing actors

07:30SPEAKERor they should create new scenes with new characters

07:32SPEAKERfor us to appear in?

07:33SPEAKER- I don't wanna create strife.

07:35SPEAKERLike I said, I've moved beyond this idea now

07:36SPEAKER'cause I think that, I think, like,

07:38SPEAKERbecause of the time travel aspect

07:40SPEAKERand/or the probably not gonna be a director's cut

07:42SPEAKERof "Trolls 2 World Tour", I think I have a better idea.

07:47SPEAKERI think we should try to get a day.

07:49SPEAKER- Okay.

07:50SPEAKER- I think we should try to get Brad and Will

07:51SPEAKERmade a tech pod day or maybe just sweatpants day.

07:54SPEAKER- Okay, oh, now we're talking.

07:55SPEAKERI think that's got universal appeal.

07:57SPEAKERI mean, maybe, I do think that sweatpants

08:00SPEAKERhas a bit of an image problem.

08:02SPEAKER- Yeah, right?

08:03SPEAKER- I think that sweatpants imply a certain kind of,

08:06SPEAKERno offense to any sweatpants wearers

08:08SPEAKERand we have a Twitter account that has the word sweatpants.

08:10SPEAKER- I'm wearing it right now.

08:11SPEAKER- Well, I never wear sweatpants.

08:12SPEAKERI'm just gonna say, I think that that particular garment

08:15SPEAKERhas a certain slovenly quality associated with it.

08:17SPEAKER- What?

08:18SPEAKER- I'm sorry to say that.

08:19SPEAKER- I have some that are fitted.

08:21SPEAKERThey have pockets, they have a back pocket.

08:23SPEAKER- I am not passing judgment here.

08:25SPEAKERI'm just talking about what I think

08:26SPEAKERthe cultural perception is.

08:28SPEAKER- So I do agree with you.

08:31SPEAKERI think there is a cultural perception problem

08:33SPEAKERwith sweatpants in America today.

08:34SPEAKER- I think if you drop the pants,

08:35SPEAKERI think like national sweats day.

08:38SPEAKERHow about, what about this?

08:39SPEAKER- I don't wanna, no, nobody wants sweats day, man.

08:41SPEAKER- I should have been in marketing.

08:42SPEAKERLet's do a little marketing exercise here.

08:45SPEAKERHow about national comfy clothes day?

08:49SPEAKER- No, that's, look,

08:50SPEAKERI think we have to make a definitive stand.

08:52SPEAKER- Who doesn't like the word comfy?

08:53SPEAKERDoesn't that just like, I'm getting a double thumbs up

08:56SPEAKERfrom the doorway here at the suggestion of comfy clothes.

09:00SPEAKER- I do, but here's the thing.

09:02SPEAKERWomen's sweatpants went through this already.

09:05SPEAKERThey rebranded it as yoga pants

09:07SPEAKERand suddenly they're socially acceptable everywhere.

09:09SPEAKERPants are worn.

09:10SPEAKER- Or like leggings, that's such a, that's a classy term.

09:13SPEAKER- Yeah, men don't have that.

09:14SPEAKERWe like, we have track pants, but they're not warm.

09:17SPEAKERThey're not cozy.

09:18SPEAKERThey're functional and they help you run faster, I think.

09:22SPEAKER- It's true.

09:23SPEAKER- Wear them to the track.

09:24SPEAKER- For all the running on the track that we do.

09:25SPEAKER- I mean, look, I'm all about the track pants,

09:27SPEAKERbut I think we should like write a letter to the president,

09:32SPEAKERget a campaign, maybe get a change.org petition going

09:35SPEAKERto find and find an empty day,

09:36SPEAKERmaybe around the week of your birth.

09:39SPEAKERI don't know.

09:40SPEAKER- Yeah, all right.

09:41SPEAKERWe'll keep that in mind.

09:41SPEAKER- And see if we can get a national designation

09:43SPEAKERof national sweatpants day.

09:48SPEAKER- All right, I like where you're going with this.

09:50SPEAKER- All right.

09:51SPEAKER- Yeah, before we get to the business at hand,

09:52SPEAKERI will just say that in Googling for Trolls 2,

09:57SPEAKERI accidentally ended up on the Wikipedia page

09:58SPEAKERfor the 1990 horror comedy film Troll 2.

10:02SPEAKERAnd if we can't get into Trolls 2,

10:04SPEAKERI would absolutely settle for Troll 2

10:07SPEAKERas a consolation prize.

10:08SPEAKER- So the funny thing about this is that the director

10:10SPEAKERof Troll 2, the horror movie, not World Tour.

10:14SPEAKER- Claudio Fergasso.

10:16SPEAKER- Claudio Fergasso, he'd fit right in here.

10:18SPEAKERI feel like that.

10:19SPEAKERI don't think Walt Dorn who directed Trolls World Tour

10:22SPEAKERis gonna take our calls.

10:23SPEAKERI'm afraid, Brad.

10:24SPEAKER- Do you think Claudio Fergasso might though?

10:27SPEAKER- If he's still alive, probably.

10:28SPEAKER- Is he still alive?

10:29SPEAKERHe's not that old.

10:30SPEAKER- Perfect.

10:31SPEAKER- He's, well, he's 70.

10:33SPEAKER- That's older than I was expecting.

10:35SPEAKER- Anyway, I'll just real quick,

10:36SPEAKERI will say, according to timeandday.com,

10:38SPEAKERthere are a lot of openings.

10:40SPEAKER- Well, there we go.

10:41SPEAKER- I genuinely thought there had to be some goofy holiday

10:44SPEAKERfor every single day on the calendar.

10:47SPEAKER- Well, that's--

10:48SPEAKER- Well, this one, actually, looking at this,

10:50SPEAKERthis is pretty widely observed ones.

10:53SPEAKERThese are all the serious ones.

10:55SPEAKER- Well, I think all we have to do

10:56SPEAKERis get a proclamation, right?

10:57SPEAKER- Yeah, I'm not seeing Funnel Cake Day.

10:58SPEAKERLet me just see.

11:00SPEAKER- What do you think the process is for this?

11:02SPEAKERWe call our representatives?

11:04SPEAKER- They're not tracking food days here, I believe, so.

11:07SPEAKER- Oh.

11:08SPEAKER- There might be actually more competition than I thought.

11:09SPEAKER- That's a list of lies.

11:11SPEAKERWell, look, we can double up.

11:12SPEAKERI'll share with Funnel Cake Day.

11:13SPEAKERI don't care.

11:14SPEAKER- Okay, okay.

11:15SPEAKER- Sweatpants day.

11:16SPEAKER- Beef Day stands alone, though.

11:21SPEAKER- Wait, there's something cold open.

11:22SPEAKERI don't have to pause.

11:23SPEAKER(laughing)

11:24SPEAKER- Just finish the, let's do the episode.

11:27SPEAKER- Yeah, we should do the episode.

11:28SPEAKERI was gonna say we should,

11:30SPEAKERI wanna talk about the Steam Deck a little bit,

11:31SPEAKER'cause I think it's a really weird, good, neat,

11:34SPEAKERI don't know if it's good,

11:35SPEAKERbut I think it's weird and interesting,

11:36SPEAKERand the choices they made are very interesting,

11:38SPEAKERand it's cool.

11:39SPEAKERBasically, a little PC in a $400 box.

11:42SPEAKER- That's the reason it's cool.

11:43SPEAKERI have zero interest in playing handheld PC games,

11:46SPEAKERbut as a reasonably well-specced PC

11:50SPEAKERthat can just hook up to a keyboard and a mouse

11:52SPEAKERand a monitor, it's pretty neat.

11:53SPEAKER- As somebody who has a desktop PC set up

11:55SPEAKERin the living room for my daughter to play games on right now

11:58SPEAKERI'm very excited about it.

11:59SPEAKER- Okay, I can see the appeal there.

12:00SPEAKER- Yeah.

12:02SPEAKER- But yeah, it seems like a neat, weird thing.

12:04SPEAKERI don't know, we'll see.

12:06SPEAKER- Yeah, maybe we should dig into it in the future.

12:08SPEAKER- Yes.

12:09SPEAKERI'm curious what people think.

12:10SPEAKERSo if you have thoughts,

12:12SPEAKERpeople were talking about it in the Discord some.

12:14SPEAKER- It really has dominated discussion on our Discord,

12:17SPEAKERon the Nextlander Discord, on forums, Twitter.

12:21SPEAKERIt sure is a hot topic, it seems.

12:23SPEAKERI'm kind of surprised.

12:24SPEAKERPeople really like playing handheld video games.

12:26SPEAKER- So I love laying in bed playing video games.

12:29SPEAKERThat's why I'm excited.

12:30SPEAKERLike that's why this is an exciting product for me.

12:32SPEAKER- Okay.

12:33SPEAKER- But like I do that with streaming right now in the house

12:35SPEAKERand that works well like 99% of the time.

12:37SPEAKERIt's only stuff like Hades

12:39SPEAKERand stuff that requires really precise timing

12:42SPEAKERthat I can't play with the five milliseconds of lag.

12:45SPEAKER- Interesting, I have a lot of nerve issues.

12:47SPEAKERI don't know if like I'm using very poorly

12:50SPEAKERergonomicized devices, is that a word?

12:52SPEAKER- You gotta get grips for your Switch, yeah.

12:54SPEAKER- Yeah, like I've tried playing Switch in bed

12:56SPEAKERand my hands end up going numb after 10 minutes.

12:59SPEAKER- Yeah, I bought a thing at Target that was like $12

13:04SPEAKERthat clips onto the back of the Switch

13:05SPEAKERand gives it like big knobbly Wii U console style

13:10SPEAKERgrippy things.

13:11SPEAKERIt's almost like having like controller prongs

13:13SPEAKERto grab onto.

13:14SPEAKER- Now hang on, are you laying fully prone

13:17SPEAKERand holding it kind of above your head

13:18SPEAKERor are you propping up on pillows

13:19SPEAKERand like holding it in your lap?

13:21SPEAKER- I prop up on a pillow.

13:22SPEAKER- Okay.

13:23SPEAKER- I kind of like, look, if I'm being honest,

13:24SPEAKERI'm laying with it resting on my belly

13:28SPEAKERand then I'm just looking down.

13:29SPEAKER- It's like a built-in.

13:31SPEAKER- It's like I have a shelf.

13:31SPEAKER- TV tray.

13:32SPEAKER- Yeah, exactly.

13:33SPEAKER- Okay.

13:34SPEAKER- But what's the real topic for today, Brad?

13:36SPEAKER- My birth, no, not my birthday.

13:38SPEAKER- But we did this year.

13:41SPEAKER- Yeah, when is your birthday?

13:42SPEAKERWas it May?

13:43SPEAKER- It's May, yeah.

13:44SPEAKER- Was it May?

13:47SPEAKER- You wanna know my kindergarten teacher

13:48SPEAKERand my first pet's name now?

13:51SPEAKER- Yeah, what is it?

13:52SPEAKER- I'm not telling you that.

13:53SPEAKER- Wait, do you actually use those?

13:54SPEAKER- No.

13:56SPEAKER- I mean, I probably did at some point, but anyway.

13:59SPEAKERSo, but we're celebrating the year of your birth today.

14:01SPEAKER- Yeah, yes, we did this for the week of your birthday.

14:05SPEAKERWe went and looked at a bunch of the tech and science

14:08SPEAKERand similar topics of the year you were born,

14:11SPEAKERwhich was 1975.

14:12SPEAKER- Yes.

14:13SPEAKER- And we thought we would do the same thing for me.

14:16SPEAKER- I think this is a grand idea.

14:17SPEAKER- Which is 1979, people seem to like that episode.

14:19SPEAKERI hope that my perception is correct

14:21SPEAKERthat people were into that 'cause it's really just a way

14:24SPEAKERto talk about a fun grab bag of historical stuff.

14:26SPEAKER- Well, yeah, I was gonna say, if people like this,

14:28SPEAKERplease let us know, either tweet at us

14:30SPEAKERor post on the Discord or whatever,

14:32SPEAKERbecause, look, it's not an infinite well

14:35SPEAKER'cause there's only a finite number of years.

14:37SPEAKER- Well, it depends on how broad you want

14:39SPEAKERto make the term tech, because I would say

14:42SPEAKERthat there were probably periods in the 1600s

14:44SPEAKERthat had a lot of very interesting technology of the time.

14:47SPEAKER- We could do, I think we could do half centuries.

14:49SPEAKER- Okay.

14:50SPEAKER- Centuries maybe.

14:51SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah, I mean, I think it's pretty inarguable

14:55SPEAKERthat the pace of technological progress

14:57SPEAKERhas increased exponentially in the last century, right?

15:00SPEAKER- So that means as we go back in time further,

15:03SPEAKERthe amount of time that we lump in with each other

15:06SPEAKERwill increase at a reverse exponential scale?

15:08SPEAKER- Yes, the tech innovation density falls off commensurate

15:13SPEAKERwith your movement backwards through time.

15:16SPEAKER- So what, so if you missed that episode,

15:18SPEAKERwhat we're gonna do is kind of do quick hits

15:21SPEAKERon the things that we thought were interesting

15:24SPEAKERfrom a technology or culture standpoint?

15:27SPEAKER- Yeah, anything that kind of fits

15:28SPEAKERin the wheelhouse in the past.

15:29SPEAKER- Like tech culture fits, I think.

15:31SPEAKER- Yeah.

15:31SPEAKER- From 1979, the year of Brad's birth, happy birthday, Brad.

15:33SPEAKER- Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.

15:37SPEAKER- Celebrate.

15:38SPEAKER- Yay.

15:39SPEAKER- Look, we should celebrate.

15:41SPEAKERI, look, I used to be one of, I used to be one of you guys,

15:44SPEAKERbut celebrate the small days.

15:45SPEAKERIt's good, it's like sweat pants tech day.

15:47SPEAKER- I have, at the urging of,

15:50SPEAKERat the urging of my lovely partner,

15:51SPEAKERI've gotten in the habit of taking my birthday off

15:53SPEAKERevery year, which is good, 'cause I don't,

15:55SPEAKERI never take enough time off.

15:57SPEAKERI took like almost zero time off last year,

15:59SPEAKERbut I did do that.

16:00SPEAKER- Look, you don't want to be one of those grumpy,

16:02SPEAKERlike I have, I had two grandfathers, as many people do.

16:05SPEAKERSome people have more.

16:07SPEAKEROne was a grumpy guy who worked every day

16:10SPEAKERuntil he was no longer able to work his entire life.

16:13SPEAKER- Okay.

16:14SPEAKER- The other was real fun.

16:15SPEAKERWe did like, he like had a bazillion hobbies.

16:18SPEAKERWe went to flea markets together.

16:19SPEAKERHe taught me how to bowl, all sorts of good stuff.

16:21SPEAKERWe had good times.

16:22SPEAKER- Oh, that's a grandpa.

16:23SPEAKER- I don't remember the work grandpa very much,

16:25SPEAKERexcept for him yelling at me for being,

16:27SPEAKERyou know, like a weird nineties kid.

16:30SPEAKERThe other one, spent a lot of good time with.

16:31SPEAKERSo, you know, be like the good grandpa, Brad.

16:34SPEAKER- Can I ask, I don't, I don't want to.

16:37SPEAKER- You want their mother's maiden names?

16:38SPEAKER- No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

16:39SPEAKERI don't want to delve too much into your family history,

16:41SPEAKERbut which one was married to the computer?

16:45SPEAKER- The fun one.

16:46SPEAKER- Okay, that checks out.

16:46SPEAKERThat's what I, that's what I would have assumed.

16:48SPEAKER- Yeah.

16:49SPEAKER- Okay.

16:50SPEAKER- So, okay, so our first topic,

16:52SPEAKERspeaking of computers and things that are now

16:54SPEAKERcomputer related and weren't at the time.

16:56SPEAKER- Yeah.

16:57SPEAKER- Brad, tell me about the Walkman.

16:58SPEAKER- Yeah, the reason it's at the top of this list

17:01SPEAKERis because it's the first thing that came up

17:02SPEAKERwhen I started searching for like,

17:04SPEAKERwhat was big in tech in 1979?

17:06SPEAKERIt turns out that the release,

17:07SPEAKERthe first release of the Sony Walkman is right up there.

17:10SPEAKER- You can't look, you can't say this,

17:12SPEAKERwe just put this in the order in which we found him.

17:14SPEAKERYou gotta say, well, we thought about this.

17:15SPEAKERWe thought this one was really

17:16SPEAKERa more important, interesting way to start.

17:17SPEAKER- Sorry, I didn't fully fill that in,

17:19SPEAKERis that that's the order it naturally landed on here.

17:21SPEAKERBut then we looked at this list again

17:22SPEAKERand we're like, you know what?

17:23SPEAKERWe should start with that.

17:24SPEAKER- Yes.

17:25SPEAKER- There's a reason that that is at the top of this list.

17:27SPEAKER- Yeah, it was, so prior to that time there were,

17:30SPEAKERso transistor radios were a thing in the '60s,

17:33SPEAKERwhich, you know, transistor radios made the radio portable.

17:35SPEAKERSo it was like a little pocket size thing

17:37SPEAKERthat usually had a strap and an antenna that poked out.

17:40SPEAKER- By portable, you mean battery operated

17:41SPEAKEReven at that time? - Battery operated

17:42SPEAKERand you could carry it around, yeah.

17:44SPEAKER- Gosh, I mean, I don't wanna go off on a million tangents,

17:46SPEAKERbut like what were batteries like in the '60s,

17:48SPEAKERlike disposable batteries?

17:49SPEAKERLike were they not too different?

17:52SPEAKER- Same sizes, they just,

17:54SPEAKERsometimes I think they were wrapped in paper or cellulose

17:57SPEAKERor something instead of metal.

17:58SPEAKER- Same chemical composition generally.

18:00SPEAKER- Probably not, 'cause they held dramatically less energy

18:02SPEAKERthan the modern batteries.

18:04SPEAKERSo there's probably a whole episode there

18:07SPEAKERin the history of batteries,

18:08SPEAKER'cause I mean, that's an interesting, but yeah.

18:11SPEAKERSo the Walkman added the cassette player, right?

18:14SPEAKER- But as far as I could tell,

18:15SPEAKERI tried to, 'cause I didn't wanna just crash in here

18:18SPEAKERand be like, it was the first portable tape player ever,

18:21SPEAKER'cause inevitably then you could find something else.

18:22SPEAKERBut as far as I could tell,

18:23SPEAKERthere was not a portable music device prior to this

18:26SPEAKERthat lets you play recorded music.

18:28SPEAKERIt was just portable radios.

18:30SPEAKER- There may have been, I feel like every time,

18:33SPEAKERI feel like with this conversation

18:34SPEAKERwhen "Guardians of the Galaxy,"

18:34SPEAKERor when "X-Men First Class" came out,

18:38SPEAKERbecause the character in there,

18:41SPEAKERwhat was it, "X-Men First Class?"

18:43SPEAKERThere's a movie that's set in the '60s.

18:44SPEAKER- It was "Days of Future Past."

18:46SPEAKER- "Days of Future Past," probably.

18:46SPEAKER- The one with the time, not time travel,

18:49SPEAKERbut the time, the flashbacks.

18:50SPEAKERI haven't seen a lot of the X-Men, the recent X-Men movies.

18:54SPEAKER- Yeah, that's the right choice.

18:56SPEAKER- I might've seen that one though.

18:57SPEAKERYeah, what are you getting at?

18:58SPEAKERI think there's a character that listens to it.

19:00SPEAKER- Yeah, to a Walkman and the movie is set

19:02SPEAKERa few years before the Walkman exists.

19:05SPEAKERIn the conversation around that,

19:06SPEAKERI believe that there was a German electronics company

19:11SPEAKERthat made a portable cassette player.

19:13SPEAKER- Yeah, it's possible.

19:14SPEAKER- But it wasn't a mass market product.

19:15SPEAKERIt was really expensive.

19:17SPEAKER- Right, so one of the things I found

19:18SPEAKERin reading about the Walkman is that the prototype for it

19:20SPEAKERwas derived from the Sony Pressman.

19:23SPEAKER- Oh yeah, the Pressman.

19:24SPEAKER- Which was for somebody's previous favorite portable,

19:27SPEAKERno, the Pressman was for journalists.

19:29SPEAKERIt was a portable tape player meant for recording

19:31SPEAKERinterviews and stuff like that.

19:32SPEAKER- Oh, that's cool.

19:34SPEAKER- And they kind of adapted that into...

19:37SPEAKERI mean, obviously the Walkman was huge

19:38SPEAKERfrom a technological standpoint

19:39SPEAKERand from a lifestyle standpoint,

19:40SPEAKERbut I feel like the kind of marketing blitz,

19:43SPEAKERthe cultural institution that it became,

19:45SPEAKERWalkman became like, I mean, you tell me, I had one.

19:50SPEAKER- It was the desired brand.

19:51SPEAKERAll the other things were garbage.

19:52SPEAKER- The thing I was gonna ask though,

19:53SPEAKERand this is where my memory gets a little fuzzy,

19:55SPEAKERis did the term Walkman get into Xerox and Kleenex territory

20:00SPEAKERof just like, that's what people called

20:01SPEAKERtheir portable tape player, right?

20:02SPEAKERLike it was close, right?

20:03SPEAKER- I think they were careful about it.

20:05SPEAKERSony was.

20:06SPEAKER- Not Sony, I mean, culturally, right?

20:08SPEAKER- Yeah, it depended.

20:10SPEAKER- It was very well known, at least.

20:12SPEAKER- It was like your mom calling your Sega Master System

20:15SPEAKERa Nintendo, right?

20:16SPEAKER- Yeah, kind of.

20:17SPEAKER- The thing for me, there were two things for me

20:19SPEAKERthat were notable.

20:20SPEAKEROne was that it was the first time

20:22SPEAKERthat wearing headphones out in public,

20:25SPEAKERlike wearing headphones in public was weird.

20:27SPEAKER- Okay, sure, I could see it.

20:29SPEAKER- Like when I got a Walkman and I didn't get one

20:33SPEAKERuntil they came out with the waterproof ones,

20:34SPEAKERages, like years in the future.

20:38SPEAKERAnd I had to like literally save money

20:40SPEAKER'cause my parents were like,

20:41SPEAKER"We're not buying one of those damn things."

20:43SPEAKERAnd it was absolutely fascinating

20:46SPEAKERbecause like I could listen to whatever music I wanted,

20:48SPEAKERlisten to the radio when I went backpacking,

20:50SPEAKERI took it with me 'cause it was waterproof

20:52SPEAKERand I could listen to music at night.

20:53SPEAKERLike it was cool, but it was also like an isolating,

20:58SPEAKERit was one of the first times

20:59SPEAKERI remember feeling alone in public.

21:01SPEAKER- Sure.

21:03SPEAKER- So.

21:03SPEAKER- Yeah, which is always a strange feeling.

21:06SPEAKER- They were banned from my school

21:07SPEAKERfor a long time from my high school.

21:08SPEAKER- Yeah, I could see that, I could see that.

21:09SPEAKERSo wait, did you have one of the sport ones

21:11SPEAKERif you had a waterproof one?

21:11SPEAKEROr was it one of the like day glow yellow and orange?

21:15SPEAKER- And note pads.

21:16SPEAKER- Wacky looking ones.

21:17SPEAKERWalkman Sport was like a big brand into itself.

21:19SPEAKER- Oh, well, so it was walk, yeah.

21:21SPEAKERThen they were bright, like fire engine yellow.

21:24SPEAKER- Right.

21:26SPEAKER- And they had different kinds of headphones.

21:30SPEAKERSo they had like prototype earbuds, but they were still,

21:32SPEAKERthere was an arch that went over the top of your head,

21:35SPEAKERlike a normal pair of headphones, but they collapsed.

21:37SPEAKERThey folded up into four.

21:39SPEAKER- Oh, I remember those, yeah.

21:40SPEAKER- And they would get really small.

21:41SPEAKERBut instead of having speakers that sat on top of your ears,

21:44SPEAKERthey just had these things that went into yours.

21:46SPEAKERWe didn't have a name for them at the point.

21:47SPEAKERLike we didn't call them earbuds

21:50SPEAKERbecause nobody had thought about that.

21:51SPEAKER- But also probably terrible for your hearing.

21:53SPEAKERWell, not that I guess current earbuds are not much better.

21:55SPEAKER- I was, I mean, that was the other thing.

21:58SPEAKERThis is gonna ruin your hearing.

21:59SPEAKERI mean, I do have constant tinnitus now

22:01SPEAKERand I've lost mid range hearing, but yikes, yikes.

22:03SPEAKERProbably not connected.

22:05SPEAKER- I had one of the classy kind of standard black ones

22:07SPEAKERand I think it might've had a little LCD on the front.

22:09SPEAKERI forget, but it was my first tape player, I think.

22:12SPEAKERI'm pretty sure, like my own.

22:14SPEAKER- Did you record music off the radio?

22:17SPEAKERYou remember doing that?

22:18SPEAKER- Not so much off the radio.

22:20SPEAKERI'm trying to, I did do that some,

22:21SPEAKERbut I think it was more from like,

22:24SPEAKERI might've duped some stuff

22:25SPEAKERfrom like a friend's CD player or something.

22:28SPEAKERI don't, you know, I think I caught some stuff

22:30SPEAKERoff the radio here and there, but like-

22:32SPEAKER- We would, we got really, my mom was like,

22:33SPEAKER"Here's how you do this.

22:34SPEAKERLook, you call the radio station and you're like,

22:37SPEAKER"Hey, when are you gonna play the song that you wanna hear?"

22:39SPEAKERAnd they say, "We're gonna play it at the three o'clock hour

22:41SPEAKERsometime between three and 3.30."

22:43SPEAKERLike, "Okay, thanks."

22:44SPEAKERAnd then you just sit there in front of the thing

22:46SPEAKERfor 30 minutes and every time the song ended,

22:48SPEAKERyou'd press record and then you'd roll back

22:51SPEAKER'cause there was a foot counter on the tape recorder.

22:54SPEAKER- Okay.

22:55SPEAKER- Then you'd roll back to know where to rewind

22:56SPEAKERif you didn't get the right song.

22:58SPEAKER- Oh, okay, I was gonna ask what you do with all the chaff,

22:59SPEAKERbut if you were-

23:00SPEAKER- You just keep rewinding over and over the same spot

23:02SPEAKERso it makes the tape real bad.

23:04SPEAKER- I was gonna say that wore out the tape pretty fast, right?

23:06SPEAKERLook, longevity wasn't really a concern in this case.

23:10SPEAKER- Sure, sure, sure.

23:12SPEAKERYeah, that was something I read about

23:15SPEAKERor that was pointed out in my reading about this

23:17SPEAKERwas that it was also kind of,

23:19SPEAKERobviously the Walkman was not the only thing

23:21SPEAKERthat brought this on,

23:21SPEAKERbut it did kind of give rise to mixtape culture.

23:23SPEAKERLike it was the first time people could really,

23:26SPEAKERI mean, maybe eight tracks had that to a degree,

23:27SPEAKERI'm not sure.

23:29SPEAKER- I think you could record eight tracks,

23:30SPEAKERbut I don't know that anybody did

23:31SPEAKER'cause I don't know that they sold blank eight tracks.

23:33SPEAKER- Right, 'cause that's the thing,

23:34SPEAKERlike cassettes were so much more mass market

23:36SPEAKERthat this was really the beginning

23:37SPEAKERof like people making their own mixes

23:39SPEAKERand kind of cobbling stuff together that way.

23:41SPEAKERIt was just a huge thing.

23:43SPEAKERHave you ever, I had never seen the original,

23:46SPEAKERthe very first Walkman before.

23:48SPEAKER- Is it the one with the orange puffs?

23:50SPEAKER- No, it's like, it's mostly blue and gray.

23:53SPEAKERI got it, the specific picture on Wikipedia is my favorite

23:57SPEAKERbecause it's so weathered.

23:59SPEAKERLike whichever one they got ahold of is extremely used,

24:02SPEAKERwhich really just, do you see it?

24:04SPEAKER- I'm looking right now.

24:05SPEAKER- It is so, first of all, it looks like that sharp X68K

24:10SPEAKERfrom Metal Gear Solid 5,

24:11SPEAKERlike just that era of late '70s, early '80s,

24:15SPEAKERJapanese industrial design in consumer products,

24:18SPEAKERconsumer electronics.

24:19SPEAKERIt's like, it's so rugged and like faux industrial.

24:24SPEAKERAnd again, this one in particular is very beat up looking.

24:28SPEAKERIt just looks so awesome.

24:29SPEAKERI kind of want one, zero use for it.

24:33SPEAKER- This is the design that the cassette player transformer

24:37SPEAKERwas based on too.

24:39SPEAKER- Oh God, no, that's probably-

24:40SPEAKER- It's sound screen, or sound wave.

24:42SPEAKER- Sound wave, hang on, I gotta look up sound wave now.

24:44SPEAKERIt's not exact, but I think it's like-

24:46SPEAKER- It definitely, like the buttons, where they are

24:48SPEAKERon the side.

24:49SPEAKER- Let me compare.

24:50SPEAKERThere's definitely commonalities.

24:51SPEAKER- Like the color scheme.

24:53SPEAKER- All the sound wave pictures you find are him as a robot.

24:56SPEAKERI need to find-

24:57SPEAKER- Oh man, I can't believe I never realized that.

24:59SPEAKER- Sound wave as a tape deck, I need to compare.

25:02SPEAKERWell, let's see.

25:03SPEAKER- I think I got sound wave before I got a Walkman, probably.

25:06SPEAKER- They're not, oh, yeah, definitely, absolutely.

25:10SPEAKERWell, they're similar.

25:11SPEAKERThey're definitely similar, like the color scheme for sure.

25:14SPEAKERThe color scheme is exactly the same.

25:16SPEAKER- That weird slidey button on the bottom

25:17SPEAKERfor the volume in the base.

25:18SPEAKER- Yes, that slidey button is there,

25:20SPEAKERbut it's specifically the mostly blue, somewhat gray

25:23SPEAKERlittle accents in yellow.

25:24SPEAKERThat is exactly the design of the first Walkman.

25:26SPEAKEROh, it looks so awesome.

25:29SPEAKERI wonder, I wonder, hang on, I shouldn't do this.

25:32SPEAKER- Don't do it.

25:33SPEAKERYou have to decide before the episode goes up

25:36SPEAKERif you're gonna do this, is the thing.

25:38SPEAKER- What?

25:38SPEAKER- Like if the moment the episode goes up,

25:40SPEAKERthe eBay situation will get dire.

25:43SPEAKER- Well, I typed original Walkman into eBay

25:45SPEAKERand I'm not seeing anything.

25:47SPEAKERSo it may not be a thing you can get.

25:50SPEAKER- It's entirely possible.

25:51SPEAKERIt would be the TPS-L2 is what you're looking for.

25:54SPEAKER- What is it?

25:55SPEAKER- TPS-L2.

25:57SPEAKER- Let's see.

25:58SPEAKERWell, that is a common Google search, TPS-L2 for sale.

26:02SPEAKER- Uh-huh.

26:02SPEAKER- Let's see, here we go.

26:04SPEAKERI should really just...

26:09SPEAKERThat looks counterfeit, I'm not sure about this.

26:13SPEAKER- Look, you don't wanna get a bootleg Walkman.

26:15SPEAKERThat's the kind of the Iowa stuff.

26:18SPEAKER- eBay listing for 1995.

26:22SPEAKER- Yeah.

26:23SPEAKER- I don't know about this.

26:24SPEAKER- You might have to go to a collector.

26:25SPEAKER- I don't know about this.

26:26SPEAKER- You might have to go, you might have to know somebody.

26:28SPEAKER- There's a lot of service manuals online.

26:32SPEAKER- It's a pretty serviceable piece of equipment,

26:35SPEAKERI would guess.

26:38SPEAKERSo the next thing, speaking of music.

26:42SPEAKER- Yes.

26:43SPEAKEROh, sorry, real quick.

26:44SPEAKERI mean, we will transition into this,

26:45SPEAKERbut the last thing I wanted to mention here

26:48SPEAKERwith the Walkman was the Wikipedia page

26:52SPEAKERfor it cites a marketing, I'm not sure if it's a textbook.

26:56SPEAKERIt definitely, it's kind of a marketing

26:59SPEAKERand academic study in marketing.

27:01SPEAKERLike, I don't know if it's actually out of curricula or not,

27:03SPEAKERbut it very much reads as a like deep dive

27:06SPEAKERthat argues that the Walkman was instrumental

27:08SPEAKERin introducing Japanese culture into the US in the 80s.

27:12SPEAKER- Oh, I can see that.

27:13SPEAKER- Which like, you know, like the 80s

27:16SPEAKERwere when the enormous economic boom in Japan occurred.

27:20SPEAKERLike we talked about this a little bit before the episode,

27:22SPEAKERI think like you were a little older than me,

27:23SPEAKERbut I think the 80s is probably

27:25SPEAKERwhen like Japanese consumer electronics

27:26SPEAKERbecame like the thing to get in the US.

27:28SPEAKER- It's when, so prior to the 80s,

27:31SPEAKERthere were some American manufacturers,

27:33SPEAKERbut it was mostly like European

27:34SPEAKERwas the kind of premier brands for electronic stuff

27:37SPEAKERis my understanding.

27:38SPEAKERAnd then the rise of Sony in the 80s ushered in

27:42SPEAKERand the idea that stuff made in Japan was good, right?

27:46SPEAKER'Cause prior to that, it was kind of like,

27:48SPEAKERyou'd get an inexpensive Japanese calculators

27:50SPEAKERand stuff like that, but transistor radios

27:52SPEAKERand calculators pretty much.

27:54SPEAKER- Yeah, like by the time I was old enough in the late 80s

27:56SPEAKERto care about brands of television,

27:57SPEAKERlike Sony was the thing to get,

27:59SPEAKERlike it was inarguable that you wanted Sony.

28:02SPEAKER- Yeah, I mean, and they, the thing that they did

28:04SPEAKERis the thing that Apple has actually lifted,

28:09SPEAKERwhich is they never, like there were never deals

28:13SPEAKERon Sony stuff.

28:14SPEAKER- Sure, sure.

28:15SPEAKER- Sony was always a premium brand.

28:16SPEAKER- That continues to this day with their TVs and stuff,

28:19SPEAKERfor sure, I mean, you know, it's well documented

28:20SPEAKERhow much Steve Jobs idolized the founder of Sony.

28:25SPEAKERBut anyway, like, and then the last thing I'll say

28:27SPEAKERis there's an ad for the original Walkman

28:30SPEAKERon the Wikipedia page that like the design of that ad

28:33SPEAKERlooks like it's like straight out of Blade Runner

28:34SPEAKERor something.

28:35SPEAKER- Yeah, those triangles are amazing.

28:38SPEAKER- So it feels like a lot of things were informing

28:40SPEAKERa lot of other things design-wise at that time, for sure.

28:43SPEAKER- I mean, it was an interesting, yeah, interesting period.

28:47SPEAKER- Yeah, so yeah, Philips demonstrated the compact disc

28:52SPEAKERto the press for the first time in 1979.

28:55SPEAKER- I feel like if you're less than like 30 years old,

28:58SPEAKERyou're going, what's a cassette tape at this point?

29:00SPEAKER- Sure.

29:01SPEAKER- And then--

29:02SPEAKER- If you're less than, what, 18?

29:04SPEAKER- I mean, I feel like my daughter knows what a CD is,

29:07SPEAKERbut only like theoretically she's ever seen one.

29:11SPEAKER- 18 is probably a little old, yeah,

29:12SPEAKERit's probably like very young children.

29:15SPEAKER- I mean, I don't know, anyway, compact discs,

29:18SPEAKERyou know, it's a disc that held 72 minutes of digital.

29:22SPEAKER74, thank you, Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, please.

29:26SPEAKER- Oh, okay.

29:27SPEAKER- I put that in the notes here.

29:29SPEAKER- It's in the notes.

29:30SPEAKER- I knew that.

29:30SPEAKERNo, I mean, I knew this little factoid before

29:33SPEAKERand I had forgotten it,

29:33SPEAKERthat that's literally how they arrived

29:35SPEAKERat the 74-minute length of the CD,

29:37SPEAKERwas they wanted something that could accommodate

29:39SPEAKERthe entirety of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony.

29:41SPEAKER- So do you think that they changed the bit rate

29:43SPEAKERof the audio, the Redbook standard to fit that?

29:47SPEAKER- I don't know.

29:48SPEAKER- Like they wouldn't have changed the disc size, would they?

29:50SPEAKER- I don't know, who knows what they started with first.

29:53SPEAKER- I mean, probably the legacy of the CD

29:55SPEAKERis that it established the disc size going forward.

29:58SPEAKER- Well, that's probably, that's for sure

29:59SPEAKER'cause DVDs are the same size, right?

30:00SPEAKER- Yeah, everything's, game discs, DVDs, Blu-rays.

30:03SPEAKER- I would bet that the size of the disc

30:05SPEAKERwas a lot more variable

30:07SPEAKERthan the density of the information on the disc.

30:09SPEAKERI bet that like how the information was stored on the disc

30:12SPEAKERwas a lot more subject

30:13SPEAKERto what they were capable of at the time,

30:16SPEAKERif that makes sense.

30:16SPEAKERLike I bet they knew how much density they could fit

30:19SPEAKERand the size was something that they could fiddle with.

30:21SPEAKEREspecially because I found in looking into this

30:25SPEAKERthat apparently the laser disc had existed since 1972?

30:29SPEAKER- Yeah, laser disc has been around for a really long time.

30:32SPEAKER- That's crazy to me because in my mind,

30:34SPEAKERlaser disc came along in like the mid nineties or something

30:36SPEAKERas like, oh wow, look at these giant CDs

30:38SPEAKERthat hold movies now.

30:40SPEAKERI had no idea the laser disc design

30:42SPEAKERactually predated the CD by like a lot.

30:45SPEAKER- Oh, well yeah, 'cause most of the laser discs are analog.

30:47SPEAKER- Right, so that's the whole thing I've never quite

30:49SPEAKERunderstood is the analog digital split.

30:51SPEAKERLike I guess maybe it was just like coming to CDs first

30:55SPEAKERin my mind as a child.

30:56SPEAKERLike if it was on an optical disc, it was digital.

30:59SPEAKERAnd I never understood how analog video was being stored

31:02SPEAKERon a disc that used lasers.

31:04SPEAKER- It basically uses light

31:06SPEAKERinstead of to do record groove type thing, I think.

31:08SPEAKERI can't remember.

31:09SPEAKER- I mean, that makes sense.

31:10SPEAKERLike obviously records are analog.

31:12SPEAKERLike, you know, light can be measured

31:16SPEAKERin an analog fashion, like it makes sense.

31:18SPEAKER- But I think there's also digital laser disc formats

31:20SPEAKERthat came on later.

31:21SPEAKERLike there's like laser disc is complicated.

31:23SPEAKER- And that's what DVD was.

31:24SPEAKERLike obviously DVD was digital video.

31:26SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah, yeah.

31:27SPEAKER- 'Cause it's literally what it stands for, but.

31:28SPEAKER- Digital versatile disc, Brad.

31:30SPEAKER- Is that actually a scene?

31:32SPEAKER- I don't know that they ever actually confirmed

31:33SPEAKERone way or the other.

31:34SPEAKER- I've seen, okay, Wikipedia says both for DVD.

31:37SPEAKER- Yeah.

31:38SPEAKER- But I actually wrote a little question here

31:40SPEAKERin the reverse, which was, could CDs have been analog?

31:45SPEAKERLike, why did they have to be digital?

31:48SPEAKER- I think that they digital was a.

31:50SPEAKER- Did it store more?

31:51SPEAKERMaybe it stored more.

31:53SPEAKER- Well, huh.

31:55SPEAKERI would assume that you could fit more data

31:57SPEAKERinto the same tracks with digital.

31:59SPEAKER- That's my question, because if analog video

32:03SPEAKERon optical disc technology already existed,

32:05SPEAKERI don't see why it couldn't have just been analog audio.

32:07SPEAKERThe reason I ask is because like,

32:09SPEAKERyou don't hear about it so much these days,

32:10SPEAKER'cause everything is digital now.

32:11SPEAKERLike they lost that fight.

32:12SPEAKERBut do you remember back in the day,

32:14SPEAKERlike a lot of audio files, like music connoisseurs

32:17SPEAKERwere very up in arms about the rise of digital music?

32:20SPEAKER- Records just sound better, man.

32:21SPEAKER- I mean, it's beyond that.

32:22SPEAKERI mean, like just the analog digital argument, you know?

32:24SPEAKERIt's just like the argument was like digital,

32:26SPEAKERand I guess it's true, like digital recording

32:28SPEAKERis losing information, right?

32:30SPEAKER- Well, I mean, yeah.

32:31SPEAKER- Because of the way it samples discretely

32:34SPEAKERfrom the moment to moment.

32:35SPEAKERLike you are technically losing information

32:37SPEAKEReven if the average person can't hear,

32:38SPEAKERbut you would see people say like,

32:40SPEAKERoh, it sounds colder, it's not the real thing.

32:43SPEAKERI mean, I feel like some of that's probably people,

32:45SPEAKERperson to person bias,

32:46SPEAKER'cause I don't think most people have hardware

32:47SPEAKERthat'll let them hear the difference in that.

32:49SPEAKER- Right, this seems very much like an audio file argument.

32:51SPEAKER- Yeah, but I mean,

32:53SPEAKERthat was the conversation for a lot of the time.

32:56SPEAKERYou never heard that with tape though,

32:57SPEAKER'cause it turns out the resolution of tape's pretty low.

32:59SPEAKER- Yeah. - The cassette tapes.

33:01SPEAKER- Right, it was analog,

33:02SPEAKERbut it was so crappy that who cares?

33:03SPEAKER- Yeah, and had a lot of noise for some reason.

33:06SPEAKERI don't understand that exact case.

33:08SPEAKER- Yes, yes.

33:09SPEAKERThe last thing I'll say about CDs is that in my mind,

33:11SPEAKERthey still feel like magic, even though they're basically

33:13SPEAKERobsolete technology now, because part of it,

33:16SPEAKERpart of that is like, it's a thing I grew up with, right?

33:18SPEAKERLike CDs became big when I was, let's say,

33:24SPEAKER10, 11 years old when they-

33:25SPEAKER- Only 10, yeah, that's why I started to remember.

33:26SPEAKER- About 10, 11 years old when music CDs started getting big

33:28SPEAKERand then CD-ROMs and game consoles that use CDs

33:30SPEAKERcame along like a handful of years later.

33:31SPEAKERSo I was right in that nostalgic sweet spot

33:33SPEAKERfor them to feel cool.

33:35SPEAKERBut also the other thing is they were so vastly superior

33:39SPEAKERto all of the things they replaced.

33:41SPEAKER- You could skip.

33:43SPEAKER- Like dude, skipping,

33:46SPEAKERanybody who did not grow up with records and cassette tapes

33:50SPEAKERand then experience that transition to CD players,

33:53SPEAKERlike the idea of hitting a button and going straight

33:55SPEAKERto the song instantly that you want, fucking mind-blowing.

33:58SPEAKER- Shuffle.

33:59SPEAKER- Shuffle, like what?

34:02SPEAKER- You can just say, artist's intent doesn't matter,

34:04SPEAKERjust listen to it however the random algorithm says.

34:07SPEAKER- But also just like quality and storage capacity, right?

34:09SPEAKERLike the quality of the music that it sounded

34:11SPEAKERso much better than tapes, like when you got games on CDs

34:14SPEAKERor even when like writable CDs came along,

34:16SPEAKERlike you could store so much more than your avatar drive

34:19SPEAKERor floppy disk or whatever, like obviously there were

34:22SPEAKERproblems with like, you know, they were pretty slow.

34:24SPEAKER- Scratches were a problem.

34:26SPEAKERYeah, it was like 120 kilobits a second, it's real slow.

34:28SPEAKER- Trying to like loading times were a big deal,

34:30SPEAKERthat kind of sucked, but like the storage capacity

34:32SPEAKERand quality and stuff like that, like it was such a leap.

34:35SPEAKER- Well, and the other big thing is that listening to it

34:38SPEAKERdidn't degrade in its quality.

34:40SPEAKERLike listening to a record, listening to a cassette,

34:42SPEAKERyou'd eventually wear them out, they'd start sounding worse

34:45SPEAKERand worse and worse, but it didn't happen with a CD.

34:47SPEAKER- Yeah.

34:50SPEAKERThe McDonald's Happy Meal debuted in 1979

34:53SPEAKERfor the price of $1.

34:56SPEAKER- $1.

34:57SPEAKER- $1, I debated whether we should try to get

34:59SPEAKERinto like food supply chain stuff around this

35:02SPEAKERand how they could sell a child's meal for a dollar,

35:05SPEAKERet cetera, et cetera.

35:06SPEAKER- It's a big subject.

35:07SPEAKER- That's a big subject, that's like a whole episode.

35:08SPEAKER- Yeah, and also a dollar was worth a lot more in 1979,

35:11SPEAKERit turns out.

35:13SPEAKERBut yeah, the Happy Meal when I was a kid,

35:15SPEAKERI remember when Happy Meals came out,

35:16SPEAKER'cause at first we were suspect of it,

35:18SPEAKERand then we went on a road trip

35:19SPEAKERand my parents were very excited at that point.

35:22SPEAKERBut you got a hamburger or a cheeseburger,

35:25SPEAKERa handful of fries, and I think a small Coke,

35:29SPEAKERor they had the orange high seed that's not fizzy

35:32SPEAKERat McDonald's back then.

35:33SPEAKER- I see, sir.

35:35SPEAKER- Orange drink, you just asked for orange.

35:37SPEAKER- I want to see, doo, doo, doo, doo.

35:40SPEAKERI'm trying to find.

35:41SPEAKER- I don't know if they had toys in them

35:42SPEAKERat the beginning either.

35:43SPEAKER- That's what I'm looking for.

35:43SPEAKERI had that in front of me and I lost it.

35:46SPEAKERI don't know if the original one sold with a toy.

35:51SPEAKER- So around that time, collectible glasses

35:54SPEAKERwere very popular for good for movies.

35:56SPEAKERLike when Star Wars or Empire Strikes Back came out,

35:58SPEAKERyou would get glasses.

35:59SPEAKERBatman, McDonald's had these amazing embossed Batman,

36:05SPEAKERwhichever one had Jim Carrey and Arnold.

36:08SPEAKEROr, no, it was the Arnold and--

36:12SPEAKER- Mr. Freeze, was that Forever?

36:14SPEAKERNo, that was-- - Freeze and Uma Thurman.

36:16SPEAKER- Was that the George Clooney one?

36:17SPEAKER- That was Forever, yeah.

36:18SPEAKER- George Clooney one was, I think that was Batman and Robin.

36:22SPEAKER- Anyway, it was the one with Arnold and Uma Thurman.

36:25SPEAKERThat one had amazing embossed glasses.

36:27SPEAKER- They were great.

36:28SPEAKERI think I used to have some Return of the Jedi

36:31SPEAKERprinted glasses that were amazing that are all gone.

36:35SPEAKER- Yeah.

36:36SPEAKER- You know what?

36:38SPEAKERInflation calculator says a dollar in 1979

36:40SPEAKERis equal to 374 today.

36:43SPEAKER- It's about what a Happy Meal is like, 450, four bucks.

36:46SPEAKER- Let's see.

36:48SPEAKERMcDonald's menu prices as of July, 2021, Happy Meal.

36:53SPEAKERWow, no, they're undercutting it.

36:57SPEAKERA four-piece chicken nuggets hack,

36:59SPEAKERexcuse me, chicken McNuggets Happy Meal.

37:01SPEAKER- Yeah. - 329.

37:03SPEAKER- Huh, it's more than that here.

37:04SPEAKER- Ham, oh, sure, I guess it's by,

37:06SPEAKERI don't know what region this is by.

37:07SPEAKERThis says 249 for the Hammered Meal.

37:09SPEAKER- That's probably like average

37:10SPEAKERacross the entire state of the country

37:11SPEAKERor wherever this person lives.

37:12SPEAKER- Sure.

37:17SPEAKER- Like other weird things

37:19SPEAKERthat ended up having some real deep repercussions,

37:22SPEAKERthe US and China established full diplomatic relations.

37:25SPEAKERApparently up until this point,

37:28SPEAKEReverybody was still P.O.ed after the Korean War.

37:32SPEAKERAnd we had limited diplomatic relations

37:36SPEAKERand basically, Nixon went to China.

37:42SPEAKER- Yes, only Nixon could go to China.

37:43SPEAKER- Only Nixon could go to China, apparently.

37:46SPEAKERI still only vaguely understand what that means.

37:48SPEAKERBut the point is, that opened up trade

37:52SPEAKERand all of the things that have driven

37:54SPEAKERthe massive explosion of the Chinese economy

37:58SPEAKERand the proliferation of Chinese manufacturing

38:01SPEAKERover the last 40, 50 years.

38:04SPEAKER- That event arguably, I'm sure, led in large part

38:06SPEAKERto the current kind of import-export dynamics

38:08SPEAKERthat we have today, right?

38:10SPEAKER- Without that, that wouldn't have happened, yes.

38:12SPEAKERIt also has to do with the one China policy in the US,

38:16SPEAKERwhich is a whole other thing

38:18SPEAKERthat we probably don't need to get into.

38:20SPEAKER- Multiple cans of worms.

38:21SPEAKER- This decision left Taiwan, the Republic of China,

38:25SPEAKERin a weird,

38:28SPEAKERRepublic of China?

38:30SPEAKERROC?

38:31SPEAKER- I don't know a ton about 20th century Chinese history,

38:33SPEAKERbut yes, I believe that's where the Nationalists

38:35SPEAKERkind of fled to Taiwan after the Civil War.

38:39SPEAKER- Yeah, so, but basically,

38:42SPEAKERwe don't recognize Taiwan as a country.

38:44SPEAKERThe choice we made was,

38:45SPEAKERwe're not going to recognize Taiwan as a country,

38:48SPEAKERand the choice China made was,

38:49SPEAKERwe're gonna allow them to continue working with them.

38:52SPEAKERThey just can't recognize them as a country.

38:53SPEAKER- Yeah, do you have any insight into why Taiwan

38:56SPEAKERis such an epicenter of semiconductor fabrication?

39:01SPEAKER- I think it's just where people were doing that.

39:03SPEAKERThey were doing a lot of manufacturing of electronic stuff,

39:05SPEAKERand therefore, somebody there was like,

39:08SPEAKER"Hey, we should build some fabs.

39:10SPEAKERThis stuff's gonna be important."

39:12SPEAKERAnd it's 'cause it's where TSMC is.

39:14SPEAKER- Right, that's why I ask primarily,

39:15SPEAKERbut also like a ton of most,

39:18SPEAKERif not all of the motherboards, I think.

39:20SPEAKERMotherboard companies and designers and so forth

39:22SPEAKERare based there.

39:23SPEAKERLike, it's a real hub for PC building.

39:26SPEAKERI mean, like, I'm sure it's just like,

39:29SPEAKERrandom circumstance, the way that Silicon Valley came about,

39:31SPEAKERand any like hub for a specific industry.

39:34SPEAKER- I mean, that would be my guess.

39:35SPEAKERI don't know.

39:36SPEAKERI would be interested in digging into that

39:37SPEAKERin a future episode.

39:38SPEAKERI think that'd be a cool thing to find out about.

39:40SPEAKER- I mean, this is the stupid shit that I spend my time

39:43SPEAKERlooking into on the weekends,

39:44SPEAKERbut like, I've gone down the rabbit holes

39:46SPEAKERof looking into what happened to like ABIT and DFI,

39:48SPEAKERand some of those like-

39:49SPEAKER- And they got bought, didn't they?

39:51SPEAKER- No, I think they kind of dissolved.

39:53SPEAKERSome of the like, DFI still exists,

39:55SPEAKERbut they only make like industrial grade stuff now.

39:57SPEAKERThey got out of the consumer market, like,

39:59SPEAKERbut some of those legendary old

40:00SPEAKERmotherboard designers, manufacturers,

40:03SPEAKERand like, you can, I found,

40:06SPEAKERI found an old blog from like 10 plus years ago

40:09SPEAKERof some person who went to the DFI office

40:11SPEAKERto try to figure out why

40:12SPEAKERthey weren't making gaming motherboards anymore.

40:14SPEAKER- Wow.

40:15SPEAKER- And like, interrogated the receptionist.

40:17SPEAKER- That's not okay.

40:19SPEAKER- Asking, or wanted to see a company representative

40:21SPEAKERto find out what had happened.

40:22SPEAKERAnd like, they concluded that most of the gaming board

40:25SPEAKERdesigners had jumped ship or gotten poached

40:28SPEAKERby other companies.

40:29SPEAKER- Well, when Acer started, they poached a ton of people,

40:32SPEAKERis my understanding.

40:33SPEAKER- Yeah.

40:34SPEAKER- Scene drama.

40:35SPEAKER- Yes.

40:37SPEAKER- We got some nuclear, nuclear business.

40:40SPEAKER- Good.

40:44SPEAKER- 1979 was the year that the Three Mile Island incident,

40:47SPEAKERthe most, most dangerous, most released,

40:52SPEAKERmost serious nuclear accident

40:54SPEAKERon the United States territory happened.

40:56SPEAKER- I didn't know it was that early.

40:57SPEAKERI thought that was more mid 80s around the Chernobyl time.

41:00SPEAKER- No, Chernobyl was like 86.

41:01SPEAKERThis was, so this was, you know,

41:05SPEAKERrelatively minor as these things go.

41:08SPEAKERThere was a valve that got, that basically got stuck open

41:11SPEAKERand drained a lot of coolant from the reactor

41:14SPEAKERand released, you know, nuclear reactors.

41:18SPEAKERThe Three Mile Island design is a high pressure

41:20SPEAKERnuclear reactor, which we don't really make any,

41:23SPEAKERwe don't really make nuclear reactors anymore,

41:24SPEAKERbut we really stopped making pressurized vessels

41:27SPEAKERafter Chernobyl and Three Mile Island.

41:31SPEAKERAnd what happened was the closed loop

41:33SPEAKERwhere the irradiated water that actually touches the,

41:37SPEAKERyou know, the uranium in the reactor,

41:41SPEAKERthe water mixed in with the open loop

41:43SPEAKERwhere the water goes, you know,

41:44SPEAKERthrough the steam turbines and all that stuff

41:46SPEAKERand then gets sent out into the atmosphere.

41:49SPEAKERAnd as a result, there was a fair amount

41:51SPEAKERof radiation released.

41:52SPEAKERThere was, it's the normal,

41:54SPEAKERif you've watched the Chernobyl show on HBO, thank you.

42:00SPEAKERIt's less, it was a less serious chain of human errors

42:06SPEAKERthat led to a less serious effect

42:09SPEAKERbecause at some point somebody was like,

42:11SPEAKER"Hey, this doesn't, something's not right here."

42:12SPEAKERAnd they were like, "Oh, there's no water."

42:13SPEAKERShit, half the reactor core has melted.

42:16SPEAKERWe've got to turn this off.

42:17SPEAKER- Great, did anybody die?

42:19SPEAKER- No one died.

42:20SPEAKER- Okay.

42:21SPEAKER- Yes, no, the ongoing, the state of Pennsylvania

42:26SPEAKERdid a multi-year, like 20 year study

42:29SPEAKERto see if there was an increase in cancer deaths.

42:32SPEAKERNothing like that was found.

42:33SPEAKER- Really, I didn't know it was that benign.

42:36SPEAKER- Yeah, it was a relative, like, look,

42:39SPEAKERthere's no such thing as a good nuclear disaster.

42:40SPEAKER- No, no, of course not.

42:41SPEAKER- But it was pretty much the best case.

42:43SPEAKER- Yeah.

42:44SPEAKER- And as a result, it led to a bunch of reform.

42:46SPEAKERSo it was important in that regard.

42:51SPEAKER- The next nuclear incident is the Vela incident.

42:54SPEAKERI just learned about this one the other day.

42:55SPEAKER- Yeah, and then I had never heard of it

42:57SPEAKERuntil you brought it up for this.

42:58SPEAKER- So, you know, we had this nuclear nonproliferation treaty,

43:01SPEAKERwhich is basically everybody who had nukes at the time said,

43:03SPEAKER"Yo, nobody else can have nukes, it's a bad idea."

43:06SPEAKER- Right, also say it.

43:06SPEAKER- We're good, we got this.

43:08SPEAKER- Say it three times fast.

43:09SPEAKERNuclear proliferation, nuclear proliferation,

43:11SPEAKERnuclear proliferation.

43:12SPEAKER- Nuclear proliferation, it's a lot.

43:14SPEAKER- Yeah, it's a lot of syllables, shit.

43:18SPEAKERBut there were countries that wanted to have nukes

43:20SPEAKERthat didn't have nukes and they started working together.

43:22SPEAKERSo South Africa and Israel, allegedly, I guess.

43:28SPEAKER- It's never been verified.

43:30SPEAKER- Okay, well, let's tell the story the other way.

43:33SPEAKERWe had satellites on orbit called,

43:39SPEAKERwhere is it, here we go.

43:41SPEAKERCalled the, it's called the Vela satellite actually.

43:43SPEAKERSo, and it was set up to detect,

43:46SPEAKERthere's nuclear explosions release two distinct flashes,

43:48SPEAKERone's very short and then several milliseconds later,

43:51SPEAKERthere's another longer flash.

43:53SPEAKERAnd it's like, there's no other source of this flash

43:56SPEAKERin the natural world.

43:57SPEAKERSo if you see, if you have a satellite

43:59SPEAKERthat's pointed at half of the earth

44:00SPEAKERand they see a flash like this, then you're like, okay.

44:03SPEAKER- Pretty safe bet.

44:04SPEAKER- Probably the nuclear explosion just happened above ground.

44:09SPEAKERSo the Vela satellite detected one of these flashes

44:12SPEAKERin the Prince Edward Island between South Africa

44:16SPEAKERand Antarctica and then the official U.S. policy

44:22SPEAKERwas basically, yeah, nothing happened,

44:26SPEAKERjust a weird, something weird happened there, I don't know.

44:29SPEAKER- It's just unexplainable.

44:31SPEAKER- Can't answer all these questions.

44:32SPEAKERYeah, it's unsolved mysteries.

44:36SPEAKERProbably based on data from seismologists

44:39SPEAKERand like undersea hydrophones and all that stuff,

44:43SPEAKERprobably was South Africa and Israel

44:46SPEAKERdetonating a nuclear bomb above ground,

44:49SPEAKERdoing a bomb test, it looked like a three kiloton bomb.

44:53SPEAKERBut because we had just signed

44:55SPEAKERthe Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty

44:57SPEAKERand we didn't want to have,

44:59SPEAKERwhich included automatic sanctions for anybody

45:02SPEAKERthat violated it who didn't already have a bomb,

45:05SPEAKERwe didn't, we just acted like nothing happened.

45:08SPEAKER- Just trying to look the other way

45:09SPEAKERfor strategic geopolitical reasons.

45:12SPEAKERThat's very consistent in our principles.

45:15SPEAKER- Yeah, how would this ever bite us in the ass

45:18SPEAKER40 years later, anyway.

45:21SPEAKER- Somebody wrote in,

45:21SPEAKERwe were talking about the ARPANET recently.

45:25SPEAKER- Yeah.

45:25SPEAKER- DARPA, government classification, stuff like that.

45:27SPEAKERI wish I had written this down.

45:29SPEAKERSomebody wrote in talking about

45:30SPEAKERkind of standard declassification protocols

45:32SPEAKERand I want to say it's 50 years

45:34SPEAKERunless there's a good reason otherwise.

45:36SPEAKER- Are you just gonna say we're gonna find out

45:38SPEAKERthe true story behind the, maybe it was aliens.

45:40SPEAKER- That's right, you never know.

45:42SPEAKER- You know, if it turns out that it's aliens,

45:44SPEAKERI want the day that they discovered that to be sweatpants.

45:48SPEAKER- Can you say it was not aliens wearing sweatpants?

45:50SPEAKERNo.

45:51SPEAKER- You can't prove a negative, Brad.

45:52SPEAKEREverybody knows that.

45:53SPEAKER- I know that.

45:54SPEAKERThat was the joke.

45:55SPEAKER- I know.

45:57SPEAKER- Okay.

45:57SPEAKER- I just didn't want people to think

45:58SPEAKERthat we didn't know that.

45:59SPEAKER- Okay.

46:01SPEAKERSometimes I assume a lot about what people--

46:04SPEAKER- I trust our audience a lot.

46:04SPEAKER- I think we, our audience, yes.

46:06SPEAKER- Yes.

46:07SPEAKER- But sometimes--

46:08SPEAKER- We're past the 30 minute mark,

46:10SPEAKERso nobody outside of the audience will listen this far.

46:12SPEAKERWe can say anything we want at this point.

46:14SPEAKER- That's a good point.

46:15SPEAKERSometimes you can't assume too much

46:16SPEAKERabout what people think you do and don't know, though.

46:19SPEAKERWhen you, let's say, are joking about something

46:21SPEAKERand they take you seriously.

46:22SPEAKERAll right, a couple of extremely,

46:25SPEAKERlet's see, we talked about the Altair 8080.

46:28SPEAKER- Yeah.

46:28SPEAKER- I'm sorry, it was the Altair 8800.

46:30SPEAKER- 8800.

46:31SPEAKER- I got that back, I'm staring at--

46:33SPEAKER- You got 18 numbers in front of you right here.

46:35SPEAKER- Way too many products.

46:36SPEAKERYou know, back when microprocessors and integrated circuits

46:39SPEAKERwere just named after numbers and not--

46:41SPEAKER- They hadn't hired a marketing agency yet.

46:43SPEAKER- Not catchy terms like Pentium and Core.

46:47SPEAKER- Pentium means five.

46:48SPEAKER- I like Core, I think Core is a good name.

46:50SPEAKER- Core means center.

46:51SPEAKER- Pentium, I always thought was a little cheesy.

46:54SPEAKER- I like Pentium.

46:55SPEAKER- Not only did I not like the name very much,

46:57SPEAKERbut I was also just incensed when they did it

46:59SPEAKERbecause I loved calling things 486 and stuff,

47:02SPEAKERlike it's so tech.

47:04SPEAKER- And also the socket change after,

47:06SPEAKERjust after the Pentium was a bummer.

47:08SPEAKER- That's actually, that is a,

47:10SPEAKERI think that is a legitimate point

47:12SPEAKERthat it got harder to keep track of what was what

47:15SPEAKERafter they started branding arbitrarily.

47:17SPEAKER- Well, yeah, and like they,

47:19SPEAKERso for a while on the Pentium series,

47:21SPEAKERthey stuck with the open socket seven architecture

47:25SPEAKERand then they moved to the slots,

47:26SPEAKERwhich they didn't let anybody else use, so.

47:30SPEAKER- Anyway, we won't dwell on these too much

47:32SPEAKER'cause we're not computer engineers,

47:33SPEAKERbut the Intel 8088 debuted in 1979,

47:37SPEAKERwhich became the basis for the very first IBM PC,

47:40SPEAKERwhich, you know.

47:42SPEAKER- Became the basis for literally every PC ever.

47:44SPEAKER- Goes without saying how influential that was.

47:47SPEAKERAnd the Motorola 68000 also in 1979,

47:51SPEAKERwhich like right up there was the basis of the Macintosh,

47:56SPEAKERthe Sega Genesis slash Mega Drive, Ooh, Amiga, Atari ST,

48:00SPEAKERlike the 60, like a bunch of Japanese computers

48:02SPEAKERthat didn't come like the, again, the Sharp.

48:04SPEAKER- Sharp, yeah.

48:05SPEAKER- X68K as you might imagine, use a 68K European computers,

48:10SPEAKERlike I said, I mean like the 68,000,

48:12SPEAKERespecially if you keep up with things like the Mr. Scene,

48:13SPEAKERlike it's everywhere, like it's right up there

48:17SPEAKERwith these early Intel chips and like the Xilog Z80

48:20SPEAKERand stuff as like one of the main microprocessors

48:23SPEAKERthat you see being recreated or emulated

48:24SPEAKERall over the place these days, it was huge.

48:27SPEAKER- Well, and this is also interesting

48:30SPEAKER'cause it's from the time before DOS for the most,

48:35SPEAKERlike IBM PC ran DOS, but it was before DOS

48:38SPEAKERwas the monolithic, you know, it was the way you computed.

48:42SPEAKER- It's ridiculous how much all this stuff overlaps

48:44SPEAKERbecause I, in reading about the CD yesterday,

48:47SPEAKERI saw Gary Kildall referenced.

48:49SPEAKER- Oh, really?

48:50SPEAKER- Because later in life, he started a company

48:52SPEAKERtrying to put things like encyclopedias

48:54SPEAKERand government documents onto CD.

48:56SPEAKERGary Kildall. - Is he the discarded guy?

48:58SPEAKER- No, 'cause he actually died in 1994.

49:00SPEAKER- Oh, bummer.

49:01SPEAKER- Of an accident, but you might know him

49:04SPEAKERas the bearded cohost of the computer chronicles.

49:07SPEAKER- What?

49:08SPEAKER- You might also know him as the guy

49:11SPEAKERwho was writing the operating system that IBM was using.

49:15SPEAKER- Before DOS?

49:16SPEAKER- Yes. - Before MS-DOS, wow.

49:17SPEAKER- If you go on his Wikipedia page,

49:18SPEAKERthere was like a very fateful meeting that he missed

49:22SPEAKERwhere IBM wanted to license his operating system for the PC.

49:27SPEAKERAnd like- - Crap, wow.

49:29SPEAKER- And like the deal didn't come together.

49:31SPEAKERHe was not present for the meeting that day.

49:33SPEAKERAnd so then they went and met with Microsoft instead.

49:36SPEAKER- Man, that would haunt you.

49:37SPEAKER- And like the Wikipedia page says

49:40SPEAKERthat he literally, he sold like two companies,

49:42SPEAKERlike he was wealthy.

49:44SPEAKERIt's not like he wasn't successful,

49:46SPEAKERbut his Wikipedia page literally says

49:47SPEAKERlike he flaked descended into alcoholism later in life,

49:51SPEAKERlargely because of what happened with Microsoft.

49:54SPEAKER- I like, I can't imagine missing something, wow.

50:00SPEAKERYeah, that would haunt you.

50:02SPEAKER- Also, apparently from what I was reading,

50:04SPEAKERlike Bill Gates was not particularly kind

50:07SPEAKERabout that whole situation at the time.

50:11SPEAKERAnd like in the press, in his statements to the press,

50:14SPEAKERlike apparently like according to what I read,

50:18SPEAKERlike he was off handling other business stuff that day.

50:21SPEAKERAnd so he was not there for that meeting.

50:23SPEAKEROther company representatives were,

50:25SPEAKERbut Bill Gates like went around in the press later saying

50:27SPEAKERlike, oh yeah, he missed that meeting

50:28SPEAKER'cause he was on vacation or something.

50:29SPEAKERLike he was just like kind of an ass about it.

50:33SPEAKER- And the thing is like IBM was a big deal

50:35SPEAKER'cause they did servers and mainframes and stuff like,

50:37SPEAKERI mean, mainframes and shared terminals and stuff like that.

50:42SPEAKERBut like in the PC space, IBM before the PC wasn't huge.

50:48SPEAKER- No, of course not.

50:49SPEAKER- Right, like there was no PC space.

50:51SPEAKER- I think that it was also implied

50:53SPEAKERthat Kildall thought that the PC,

50:55SPEAKERthe IBM PC was not gonna be that big a deal

50:57SPEAKERbecause they were not big in that market.

50:58SPEAKER- Well, and they were gonna be overpriced.

51:00SPEAKERIt was the other thing.

51:01SPEAKEREverybody knew, like, yeah, anyway.

51:03SPEAKER- Anyway, that was a huge tangent,

51:04SPEAKERbut like you see the same names, the same concepts,

51:07SPEAKERthe same tech popping up in overlapping spaces

51:09SPEAKERall over the place here.

51:10SPEAKER- Small, small world.

51:12SPEAKERSpeaking of small worlds, CompuServe launched

51:15SPEAKERin the year of your birth, Brad.

51:16SPEAKER- So yes, as a consumer service, yes.

51:20SPEAKERBut I was shocked to find out that CompuServe

51:22SPEAKERwas actually founded in 1969.

51:25SPEAKER- People probably know CompuServe now

51:26SPEAKERbecause it was one of the early like nationwide ISPs

51:29SPEAKERor at least larger than local ISPs.

51:31SPEAKER- Yeah, like I know our audience skews older,

51:33SPEAKERbut I do wonder, are we in a spot

51:35SPEAKERwhere we'd actually just need to like define

51:36SPEAKERwhat CompuServe was?

51:37SPEAKERLike it was basically, I even saw references to this

51:40SPEAKERfrom press at the time that it was kind of described

51:42SPEAKERas one of the other big three besides America Online

51:45SPEAKERand Prodigy. - Delphi or Prodigy, yeah.

51:48SPEAKERThe thing about CompuServe, the thing about these,

51:51SPEAKERso at this point, these in the late '80s, early '90s,

51:56SPEAKERI guess, these services would kind of connect people

52:00SPEAKERto what were kind of like big BBSs.

52:03SPEAKERThey were like large scale BBSs

52:04SPEAKERthat then you could also access the internet on later.

52:08SPEAKERNot obviously in 1979, but I didn't understand this.

52:12SPEAKERWhat did people use this for?

52:14SPEAKER- So CompuServe was founded as a subsidiary

52:17SPEAKERof a company called Golden United Life Insurance.

52:20SPEAKER- Oh yeah, G-U-L-I, of course.

52:22SPEAKER- Of course, like this is such a weird origin.

52:24SPEAKERLike apparently they founded it partially

52:26SPEAKERto be kind of like to provide computing services

52:28SPEAKERto their own company, the life insurance business.

52:32SPEAKERBut then they also started expanding it

52:33SPEAKERinto renting out computing time.

52:35SPEAKERThis was back when computing like time sharing was a thing

52:39SPEAKER'cause you were just signing into mainframes or whatever.

52:43SPEAKERThey built that up as a business as kind of a B2B service

52:46SPEAKERto rent out computer time to other businesses.

52:50SPEAKERAnd then from what I gathered reading about this,

52:52SPEAKERthat network built up slowly across the country

52:54SPEAKERto the point that they then decided to roll out

52:57SPEAKERa consumer service in the evenings

52:59SPEAKERbecause all those computers were sitting there idle

53:00SPEAKERin the evening, not being used by businesses

53:03SPEAKERwho were not operating at night.

53:04SPEAKER- So you could get like a dumb terminal and hook it up

53:06SPEAKERto a modem and get timeshare on one of these machines?

53:09SPEAKER- That's basically what I gathered from this.

53:12SPEAKERLike I didn't read too much into,

53:13SPEAKERthey're talking about a lot of PDP-10s

53:15SPEAKERand teletype terminals and like that kind of old shit.

53:17SPEAKER- Wow.

53:19SPEAKER- But I guess they, I wanna say they called

53:22SPEAKERthe consumer service micro net originally

53:24SPEAKERand they marketed it at Radio Shack,

53:26SPEAKERbut it was so successful they decided to just rebrand it

53:28SPEAKERas the actual name CompuServe

53:29SPEAKERand then it kind of grew from there.

53:31SPEAKER- There you go.

53:32SPEAKER- And then they apparently were also the first one

53:36SPEAKERof those big national services to offer any kind

53:40SPEAKERof internet access in the form of email in 1989,

53:43SPEAKERwhich is like pretty early.

53:45SPEAKER- Yeah, that's why your CompuServe email address

53:47SPEAKERwas always a big long string of numbers

53:48SPEAKER'cause it was just your user ID.

53:50SPEAKER- I always thought of CompuServe, I never used it,

53:51SPEAKERbut from what I read about it, I always thought of it

53:53SPEAKERas the like very techie, like not very user-friendly one

53:55SPEAKERbecause of things like that.

53:57SPEAKER- That was my read as well.

53:58SPEAKERI just want to straight to dial up shell accounts, yeah.

54:01SPEAKER- Man, I'm very jealous.

54:04SPEAKERI wish I had been into that back then, but let's see.

54:09SPEAKERI copied one thing from the Wikipedia page

54:11SPEAKERI wanna mention here.

54:12SPEAKER- Yeah.

54:13SPEAKER- They were talking about as they were building up

54:14SPEAKERthat national network, they were headhunting executives

54:17SPEAKERto the recruiting to build that up.

54:21SPEAKERThey're talking about an executive they headhunted

54:23SPEAKERwho left a company called Service Bureau Corporation.

54:27SPEAKER- Oh yeah, the SBC.

54:28SPEAKER- Which was a subsidiary of Control Data Corporation.

54:32SPEAKERLike computing company names from the '70s, '80s

54:36SPEAKERare such nonsense mashups of words.

54:38SPEAKERLike you literally just pick two words.

54:40SPEAKER- Well, but like if you named it today,

54:42SPEAKERControl Data Corporation would be named Slavonis

54:46SPEAKERor something like that, right?

54:47SPEAKER- That's fair, that's fair.

54:48SPEAKERI just, I love how bulky and awkward and nonsensical

54:51SPEAKERthese the Control Data Corporation.

54:53SPEAKER- I wish that this was like a '60s mashup,

54:55SPEAKERlike a Kondaka, Kondako or something like that.

54:59SPEAKER- Oh, don't forget our friends from 1975, Kromemko.

55:02SPEAKER- Yeah, Kromemko, never forget.

55:04SPEAKER- You know, the hottest mixtape of 1975

55:06SPEAKERthat graced the album or the show art of your episode.

55:09SPEAKER- Kromemko.

55:12SPEAKER- Yeah.

55:13SPEAKER- Bjarne Stroustrup, Stroustrup.

55:16SPEAKER- Sure.

55:17SPEAKER- Bjarne Stroustrup.

55:18SPEAKER- Yes.

55:19SPEAKER- That's okay.

55:20SPEAKER- Yeah.

55:21SPEAKER- Started working on C++.

55:22SPEAKER- Yeah, in 1979.

55:24SPEAKER- I don't wanna say it was the first

55:25SPEAKERobject-oriented programming language,

55:27SPEAKER'cause it wasn't, there was other stuff before,

55:29SPEAKERbut it was probably the first one

55:30SPEAKERthat was like widely used and is still used today.

55:35SPEAKER- Yeah, it became kind of standard.

55:36SPEAKER- Yeah.

55:37SPEAKERAnd what that means is basically that prior to this,

55:42SPEAKERyou didn't have the ability to inject other code

55:45SPEAKERinto your applications.

55:46SPEAKERSo there was no way to like include a header file

55:50SPEAKERand stuff like that in some cases

55:51SPEAKERwith just normal C as my understanding.

55:54SPEAKER- You were just replicating every function,

55:56SPEAKERevery function, piece of functionality

55:58SPEAKERevery single time you wrote a program?

55:59SPEAKER- I assume there's a lot of copying and pasting,

56:01SPEAKERbut I don't know for sure.

56:02SPEAKER- I don't even know if, could you copy and paste

56:03SPEAKERthat functionality even exist?

56:04SPEAKER- Copy and paste existed in 1979, Brad.

56:06SPEAKER- Okay, I meant before that.

56:09SPEAKER- I don't know, maybe.

56:10SPEAKER- Well before that. - That's a good question.

56:11SPEAKER- When you're on a teletype terminal,

56:12SPEAKERI don't know if that's actually a thing.

56:14SPEAKER- It's, this is, we put this in A,

56:17SPEAKERbecause both of us bombed out of CS classes in college,

56:21SPEAKERbut it's like, this is one of the things that probably,

56:28SPEAKERthis is why we still teach C in college,

56:30SPEAKERin schools, in CS programs and stuff like that.

56:32SPEAKER- Right. - That would be my guess.

56:33SPEAKER- Yeah, I didn't, I liked the programming.

56:36SPEAKERIt was the math that washed me out of the CS degree.

56:40SPEAKER- I didn't really like the programming or the math,

56:42SPEAKERso it was easy. - Really?

56:43SPEAKER- I mean, I'm good at, I like physics math,

56:46SPEAKERbut the computer math was inscrutable to me,

56:49SPEAKER'cause I didn't understand what was going,

56:50SPEAKERlike in order for me to understand the math,

56:52SPEAKERI have to kind of understand what's going on

56:53SPEAKERon the other side. - Sure, sure.

56:56SPEAKERI didn't love pointers when we got to pointers.

56:58SPEAKERI was like dealing with memory management manually.

57:01SPEAKER- Ooh, wow. - Was not my favorite thing.

57:04SPEAKER- You don't really do that anymore, it turns out.

57:05SPEAKER- No, I know, like I think most high level languages

57:07SPEAKERcompletely, well, especially interpreted languages

57:09SPEAKERhave zero concept of that, right?

57:11SPEAKER- Yeah, you just, you have an infant state machine,

57:13SPEAKERbasically you can do whatever you want, right?

57:15SPEAKERI don't know what, like, we've got a ton of very skilled

57:18SPEAKERsoftware developers on our Discord,

57:20SPEAKERlike I should just go in there and ask them,

57:22SPEAKERbut I wonder how much manual memory management

57:25SPEAKERyou're doing with like Rust and Go

57:27SPEAKERand stuff like that these days.

57:29SPEAKER- My guess is it depends on what your,

57:31SPEAKERif you have really specific workloads,

57:33SPEAKERusually you have to do stuff that's more manual.

57:36SPEAKERAnyway, Pixar started as the graphics group at Lucasfilm.

57:41SPEAKER- Yes, or yeah, I guess the group, well, let's see,

57:43SPEAKERI got this straight off of Pixar's, like our story page,

57:48SPEAKERwhich goes into some history.

57:52SPEAKERI guess the graphics group was a division

57:54SPEAKERof the computer division at Lucasfilm.

57:56SPEAKER- Of course, the computer division.

57:58SPEAKER- I guess they say that George Lucas himself

58:01SPEAKERrecruited Ed Catmull, I'm sure a lot of people know his name.

58:05SPEAKER- He's one of the three founders of Pixar.

58:06SPEAKER- Right, to run the computer division at Lucasfilm.

58:11SPEAKERAnd then the graphics group came out of that.

58:13SPEAKERThis is so George Lucas though, on the Pixar page,

58:16SPEAKERthey list George Lucas's wishlist for the computer division.

58:20SPEAKERWhat he wanted was non-linear editing systems for,

58:23SPEAKERI'm sorry, digital non-linear editing systems

58:25SPEAKERfor film and sound, a laser film printer,

58:30SPEAKERexplorations of computer graphics,

58:32SPEAKERlike he just wanted shit for what he was doing.

58:34SPEAKERThat's like-

58:35SPEAKER- Well, I mean, yeah, that's why you do R&D, right?

58:37SPEAKERIn this case.

58:38SPEAKER- Well, of course, but it's just like, I don't know,

58:40SPEAKERLucas is such a weird figure with a strange

58:42SPEAKERand interesting body of work,

58:43SPEAKERbut like all he has ever done really is just execute R&D

58:48SPEAKERfor the weird ideas he wants to implement in his films.

58:51SPEAKER- I mean, that's, but that's-

58:52SPEAKER- I mean, I know that's everybody,

58:53SPEAKERbut it's like, it's more, he is just such on,

58:55SPEAKERon such an extreme tech end of that.

58:58SPEAKER- So I, my question, my question is,

59:02SPEAKERwell, first off, that's the way film works.

59:05SPEAKER- Well, I know that.

59:06SPEAKER- That's the way film has always worked.

59:07SPEAKER- I don't think I'm, well,

59:08SPEAKERI'm not explaining myself very well here.

59:09SPEAKERIt's more like, a lot of people would argue

59:14SPEAKERthat he kind of lost the soul of filmmaking

59:15SPEAKERin the pursuit of like technical ability.

59:18SPEAKERLike this is kind of exemplified in the,

59:20SPEAKERin the Phantom Menace era,

59:22SPEAKERlike news reports about like, look what he can do now.

59:24SPEAKERHe can take two different actors performances

59:26SPEAKERfrom two different takes and mash them together

59:27SPEAKERand just edit it exactly like he wants.

59:30SPEAKERAnd like a lot of people saw that sort of like the death

59:32SPEAKERof, of, of like, you know, artistic filmmaking or-

59:38SPEAKER- You know what I mean?

59:38SPEAKERUsing machine learning to generate a sample of a dead, yeah.

59:43SPEAKER- That's what I'm trying to get at is like sometimes the,

59:45SPEAKERthe technical abilities get out in front

59:47SPEAKERof the artistic process.

59:50SPEAKER- As Steven Spielberg, or I guess Michael Crichton

59:55SPEAKERfamously said, sometimes we're too busy wondering

59:58SPEAKERif we can to stop and think about whether we should.

1:00:00SPEAKER- Yes, yes, that's the thing.

1:00:02SPEAKERAnyway, the graphics group was conceived

1:00:06SPEAKERto do all that stuff,

1:00:07SPEAKERbut then they started getting more and more

1:00:08SPEAKERinto digital animation, recruited a bunch more animators

1:00:14SPEAKERand so forth, so on and so forth.

1:00:16SPEAKERI didn't know the stained glass light sequence

1:00:19SPEAKERfrom young Sherlock Holmes was made in 1985.

1:00:22SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:00:23SPEAKER- I had no idea.

1:00:24SPEAKERI thought that was way later than that.

1:00:25SPEAKERLike that's super famous as like-

1:00:28SPEAKER- Well, it's their first thing, right?

1:00:29SPEAKER- I don't know if it, was it the first?

1:00:32SPEAKERIt was not the first computer graphics in anything, but-

1:00:35SPEAKER- It was Pixar's first though, I believe.

1:00:37SPEAKER- I guess so.

1:00:39SPEAKER- Or the thing that would become Pixar.

1:00:40SPEAKER- Like that sequence is, okay.

1:00:45SPEAKERThis article defines it as the first all CG character,

1:00:50SPEAKERwhich I guess is true.

1:00:51SPEAKERLike that is a full CG character in-

1:00:54SPEAKER- It's a CG, I don't know that I remember that, but-

1:00:57SPEAKER- Composited into, composited into film.

1:01:04SPEAKEREat a charger, beings.

1:01:05SPEAKER- Yeah, go to hell, charger.

1:01:06SPEAKER- Anyway, that's a very famous effects sequence.

1:01:08SPEAKERAnyway, Steve Jobs bought that group in 1986,

1:01:12SPEAKERrenamed it to Pixar.

1:01:14SPEAKERThen it became-

1:01:15SPEAKER- Set them free.

1:01:16SPEAKER- Yes, then it became what it became.

1:01:17SPEAKER- Interesting.

1:01:18SPEAKER- Lots of weird stuff came out of Lucasfilm Photoshop.

1:01:21SPEAKER- And John Knoll, John Knoll did some weird science

1:01:24SPEAKERat Photoshop at Lucasfilm that became Photoshop.

1:01:27SPEAKER- Yes.

1:01:28SPEAKER- I feel like, and this is a thing that I've always heard

1:01:31SPEAKERpeople in effects industry say,

1:01:32SPEAKERbut I don't know if it's actually true,

1:01:34SPEAKERthat the Death Star, like the little dot graphic

1:01:38SPEAKERof the Death Star in Star Wars,

1:01:41SPEAKERwhere they're talking about how they're gonna attack it

1:01:43SPEAKERand it zooms in and shows the trench.

1:01:45SPEAKERI think that's the first computer generated graphic

1:01:47SPEAKERthat was used in a film.

1:01:48SPEAKER- I've heard similar things.

1:01:53SPEAKER- It's here online.

1:01:53SPEAKER- Hang on, I'm just gonna throw this out there.

1:01:55SPEAKERIf anybody at Lucasfilm listens to this podcast,

1:01:57SPEAKERJohn Knoll is like a top 10 fantasy guest wishlist

1:02:03SPEAKERfor this podcast.

1:02:05SPEAKERI would kill to talk to that guy for an hour.

1:02:09SPEAKER- Okay, yeah, that would be good.

1:02:12SPEAKER- Is it shameless to say that on this podcast?

1:02:14SPEAKER- No, this is the place to get it out there.

1:02:16SPEAKER- He seems like an incredibly smart and interesting guy.

1:02:19SPEAKER- Jim Cameron said that he has the mind of a child

1:02:22SPEAKERand the brain of a scientist.

1:02:23SPEAKER- That's a very James Cameron thing to say.

1:02:26SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:02:27SPEAKER- I saw Kathleen Kennedy say something about Knoll

1:02:30SPEAKERthat was much more kind, I would say,

1:02:31SPEAKERlike a much kinder version of that.

1:02:34SPEAKER- Oh, I don't think Jim Cameron meant that unkindly.

1:02:37SPEAKERI think that's a high compliment in his world.

1:02:39SPEAKER- James Cameron, yes, exactly.

1:02:40SPEAKERThat's what I mean.

1:02:41SPEAKERThat's what passes for a compliment from Cameron.

1:02:44SPEAKER- Well, yeah, I mean, so if you don't know,

1:02:46SPEAKERJohn Knoll is a visual effects director

1:02:48SPEAKERwho also has done a ton of other stuff

1:02:49SPEAKERand there's a reason he's credited on Photoshop

1:02:53SPEAKERand it's because he did a ton of work on it

1:02:54SPEAKERin the early, early, early days at Lucas.

1:02:56SPEAKER- But also one of the top people at ILM

1:02:58SPEAKERfor a very long time.

1:03:00SPEAKERSo like he's done enormous amounts of visual effects work

1:03:03SPEAKERand innovation over the years.

1:03:05SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:03:07SPEAKERYeah, anyway.

1:03:08SPEAKER- I've watched a lot of behind the scenes featurettes.

1:03:12SPEAKERThat's all I'm trying to say.

1:03:14SPEAKER- Sierra Online?

1:03:15SPEAKER- Sierra Online was founded as Online Systems.

1:03:18SPEAKER- It's a bad name.

1:03:19SPEAKER- In 1979.

1:03:20SPEAKERI mean, dude, we just talked about

1:03:21SPEAKER70s computer company names are all ridiculous.

1:03:26SPEAKER- Did they hyphenate online at that point too?

1:03:29SPEAKERWhat the heck?

1:03:30SPEAKER- Online-line systems.

1:03:31SPEAKERWell, I mean, what did the term online mean back then?

1:03:33SPEAKERLike that sounded fancy and futuristic, right?

1:03:35SPEAKER- Well, with the hyphen though, it seems bad.

1:03:37SPEAKERIt seems like you have to get in line

1:03:38SPEAKERto go do something fun.

1:03:39SPEAKER- It took some time for the hyphen to fall out.

1:03:41SPEAKERAnyway, I don't know if people know

1:03:44SPEAKERlike the kind of basic story of Ken and Roberta Williams

1:03:46SPEAKERwere a husband and wife team that started Sierra,

1:03:49SPEAKERthe company that's kind of credited

1:03:51SPEAKERwith inventing the graphical adventure on PC.

1:03:55SPEAKER- Ken was kind of the business guy

1:03:56SPEAKERand Roberta was the writer.

1:03:58SPEAKER- Everything I've read about this

1:03:59SPEAKERand I was actually just reading this big long vice feature

1:04:02SPEAKERon Sierra recently.

1:04:03SPEAKERSo I got some of this from there,

1:04:04SPEAKERbut like Ken Williams very much comes off

1:04:07SPEAKERas just mostly a businessman who was also a programmer

1:04:09SPEAKERwho wanted to run a successful profitable business

1:04:13SPEAKERand wasn't really thinking about video games.

1:04:16SPEAKER- Okay.

1:04:17SPEAKER- Like he wanted to, he left IBM

1:04:19SPEAKERand wanted to just write business software

1:04:22SPEAKERunder his company.

1:04:23SPEAKERBut his wife, Roberta played some text adventures

1:04:27SPEAKERat the time and like fell in love with them

1:04:29SPEAKERand then started kind of getting him to help her out

1:04:32SPEAKERin trying to make a game.

1:04:33SPEAKER- Wow.

1:04:34SPEAKER- And then they figured out that they could use

1:04:35SPEAKERvery rudimentary graphics in their first game Mystery House,

1:04:38SPEAKERwhich I tried to figure this out.

1:04:42SPEAKERSeems to be the first graphical adventure ever.

1:04:45SPEAKER- Oh, wow.

1:04:45SPEAKER- Like, did you tell me there might've been something?

1:04:48SPEAKER- I don't know anything before.

1:04:49SPEAKERSo this was just like flat images with text underneath?

1:04:53SPEAKER- Yeah, so I had spent too much time reading about it

1:04:54SPEAKERas I always do, but she drew, they bought some package

1:04:59SPEAKERthat could like overlay line computer line art

1:05:02SPEAKERon like scanned images.

1:05:04SPEAKERSo she drew, hand drew all the scenes from the game.

1:05:07SPEAKERAnd then he used that software to convert those

1:05:09SPEAKERinto like very simple line art images.

1:05:12SPEAKER- Wow.

1:05:12SPEAKER- But they were too big to fit on the floppy disk,

1:05:15SPEAKERthe five and a quarter disks

1:05:16SPEAKERthey were gonna sell the game on.

1:05:18SPEAKERSo he wrote basically into her like a coordinate interpreter

1:05:23SPEAKERso they could store the images just as coordinates

1:05:26SPEAKERthat would draw the lines in on the fly

1:05:27SPEAKERas they were rendered on the Apple II.

1:05:29SPEAKER- As vectors?

1:05:30SPEAKER- Yes, as vectors.

1:05:31SPEAKER- That's a trip.

1:05:32SPEAKER- And to fit them all on the floppy disk.

1:05:34SPEAKER- Holy cow.

1:05:35SPEAKER- And they, yeah, and then they sold enough copies

1:05:36SPEAKERthat they became a real company.

1:05:38SPEAKERAnd then Sierra became one of the biggest deals

1:05:41SPEAKERon the PC for a very long time.

1:05:44SPEAKER- Wow, that's funny.

1:05:45SPEAKER- I love Sierra games.

1:05:46SPEAKER- I was a Sierra game guy.

1:05:47SPEAKER- Were you?

1:05:48SPEAKER- Yeah, I was a--

1:05:49SPEAKER- How interesting.

1:05:50SPEAKER- Chris Murphy and Faz Magoria and Gabriel Knight, maybe?

1:05:54SPEAKER- Gabriel Knight.

1:05:55SPEAKER- I was a Sierra one.

1:05:56SPEAKER- King's Quest VI was the first graphical adventure I played

1:05:59SPEAKERand then I worked backwards

1:06:00SPEAKERand played a bunch of the older ones.

1:06:01SPEAKER- Oh, so I didn't play any of the King's Quest.

1:06:02SPEAKERSo I didn't know,

1:06:04SPEAKERI was almost completely unaware

1:06:06SPEAKERthat different people made video games when I was a kid.

1:06:09SPEAKER- Okay.

1:06:10SPEAKER- You know what I mean?

1:06:11SPEAKERLike I, it wasn't until like "Plan Files" and "Quake"

1:06:14SPEAKERand all that stuff that I was like conceptually became aware

1:06:18SPEAKERthat there wasn't just some factory someplace

1:06:19SPEAKERwhere everybody was churning out video,

1:06:21SPEAKERlike working together to churn out video games.

1:06:23SPEAKER- Sure.

1:06:25SPEAKER- So like the Sierra Lucas divide was very confusing to me,

1:06:31SPEAKEReven in like when I was 18.

1:06:34SPEAKER- Sure.

1:06:35SPEAKER- Because I didn't understand why the Lucas games

1:06:39SPEAKERwere always inscrutable and the Sierra games seemed to,

1:06:43SPEAKERthe puzzle seemed to be at least based in some reality.

1:06:46SPEAKER- Oh, dude, I don't know about that.

1:06:47SPEAKERI mean, so maybe you were better at them than I was,

1:06:50SPEAKERbut as somebody who got in trouble for running up

1:06:53SPEAKERa phone bill to the toll line Sierra hint thing,

1:06:57SPEAKERtrying to get through the end of King's Quest six,

1:07:00SPEAKERI think it was like 30 bucks to be fair,

1:07:02SPEAKERI think of course in the early nineties,

1:07:04SPEAKER30 dollar phone bill was definitely something

1:07:07SPEAKERto get in trouble for.

1:07:10SPEAKER- Well, so I don't think it was, I was in after that.

1:07:14SPEAKERIt would have been like the under a killing moon

1:07:16SPEAKERand that kind of stuff when they started doing all that.

1:07:20SPEAKER- The Tex Murphy was a different company.

1:07:22SPEAKER- That was dynamics, but it was published by Sierra.

1:07:25SPEAKERWasn't it?

1:07:26SPEAKER- So no, that was access.

1:07:28SPEAKER- Oh.

1:07:29SPEAKER- That was, that was a separate thing.

1:07:30SPEAKERDynamics, dynamics did, dynamics was the kind of like edgy,

1:07:34SPEAKERadult imprint of Sierra though.

1:07:36SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:07:37SPEAKER- I mean, to be fair, like Sierra proper put out

1:07:38SPEAKERLeisure Suit Larry and Police Quest and some stuff like

1:07:41SPEAKERthat, but yeah, they were a little more family friendly.

1:07:43SPEAKERAnd then dynamics was doing a lot of like hard-boiled

1:07:45SPEAKERdetective shit and stuff like that.

1:07:47SPEAKER- Yeah, more horror, like horror-y stuff.

1:07:51SPEAKER- But.

1:07:52SPEAKER- What happened? What happened?

1:07:54SPEAKERDid they stop? Did they just retire?

1:07:55SPEAKER- Well, real quick, I was going to say,

1:07:57SPEAKERbefore we move on to that,

1:07:58SPEAKERI wonder if there's like a geographical component to that,

1:08:00SPEAKERbecause when I moved out here,

1:08:03SPEAKERlike everybody I know that I've worked with in games from

1:08:06SPEAKERhere from California was like full on Lucas, LucasArts

1:08:10SPEAKERin the LucasArts Sierra kind of.

1:08:13SPEAKER- Well, I mean, it was the home, you're on home turf.

1:08:15SPEAKER- Exactly, well, they're both in California though.

1:08:17SPEAKERLike graded, Lucas was up in the North Bay.

1:08:23SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:08:24SPEAKER- And I forget Sierra was down South somewhere.

1:08:25SPEAKER- Like all the stuff that came out of Lucas,

1:08:27SPEAKERI like all the, I assume,

1:08:29SPEAKERI've never actually bothered to look at this,

1:08:30SPEAKERbut I assume that there's a through line from Lucas

1:08:32SPEAKERto like Telltale and.

1:08:33SPEAKER- Oh, definitely.

1:08:34SPEAKER- Yeah, Telltale was.

1:08:35SPEAKER- Definitely to Double Fine and like.

1:08:37SPEAKER- Telltale was literally founded by people who worked on

1:08:39SPEAKERLucasArts adventure maps.

1:08:41SPEAKER- That's what I assumed.

1:08:42SPEAKERBut I wonder, like, I wonder if Sierra had better

1:08:43SPEAKERdistribution on the East coast, because like,

1:08:46SPEAKERI got a copy of, I got a cheap copy of Kings Quest six

1:08:49SPEAKERat Sam's Club when I was a kid.

1:08:51SPEAKER- So that's the thing is all of those things,

1:08:53SPEAKERthose games were available in the game store in my mall.

1:08:56SPEAKER- Right.

1:08:58SPEAKERYeah, that's probably why.

1:08:59SPEAKERAnyway, I'll put the vice feature I mentioned in the show

1:09:03SPEAKERnotes here, because it's all about how they sold the company

1:09:07SPEAKERto a giant corporation that apparently was being run by scam

1:09:10SPEAKERartists.

1:09:11SPEAKER- Oh no.

1:09:11SPEAKER- Which like, I did not know this history about Sierra.

1:09:14SPEAKERAll I knew was that they sold and they're, you know,

1:09:16SPEAKERthe brand is owned by Activision now.

1:09:19SPEAKER- Yeah, it went through like Activision and Vivendi.

1:09:22SPEAKER- It was part of Vivendi, it was part of a company called

1:09:26SPEAKERSendent, like I didn't know that lineage other than that

1:09:28SPEAKERthey got bought by a big company and then got passed around

1:09:30SPEAKERlike that, but.

1:09:32SPEAKER- It's always trippy, but you forget that like Half-Life

1:09:35SPEAKERwas a Sierra game.

1:09:36SPEAKER- Totally, yes.

1:09:36SPEAKERHalf-Life was published by Sierra, but that was after they

1:09:38SPEAKERsold it, that was when it was part of.

1:09:41SPEAKERBut the thing I didn't know is that the original corporation

1:09:44SPEAKERthey sold Sierra to was apparently cooking its books.

1:09:50SPEAKERThis was in the late nineties.

1:09:51SPEAKERThis was like right, this was running up to the Bernie

1:09:54SPEAKERMadoff Enron era.

1:09:56SPEAKERRemember that?

1:09:57SPEAKER- Oh yeah.

1:09:58SPEAKER- So apparently the corporation that bought them

1:10:03SPEAKERwas cooking its books.

1:10:04SPEAKERThe two people who ran that corporation ended up spending

1:10:06SPEAKERlike a decade in prison for securities fraud.

1:10:09SPEAKER- Jesus. - They mishandled Sierra badly.

1:10:13SPEAKERAnd yeah, it's a really interesting article.

1:10:17SPEAKERAlso a lot of the people at Sierra lost a lot of money.

1:10:21SPEAKER- I'm sure.

1:10:22SPEAKER- Because they all own shares in the company.

1:10:23SPEAKERAnd then the company went completely to shit once it was

1:10:25SPEAKERbought by this company.

1:10:26SPEAKERAnd they all like, like people were banking on that being

1:10:29SPEAKERtheir retirement or, you know.

1:10:32SPEAKER- That sucks, that's awful.

1:10:33SPEAKER- People lost their houses, stuff like that.

1:10:37SPEAKERIt's pretty rough.

1:10:40SPEAKERWell, on that happy note, let's talk about space.

1:10:42SPEAKER- I like space.

1:10:45SPEAKER- In 1979, the Voyager 1 probe made its closest approach

1:10:50SPEAKERto Jupiter, a couple of hundred, 100,000 kilometers away,

1:10:53SPEAKER177,000 kilometers away.

1:10:55SPEAKER- Okay.

1:10:57SPEAKER- Found out that Jupiter had rings, had a ring, has a ring.

1:11:00SPEAKERSo it's ringed.

1:11:02SPEAKER- Maybe this has changed, but I guess those could not

1:11:04SPEAKERbe observed through telescopes at the time.

1:11:06SPEAKER- We can't see them here.

1:11:07SPEAKER- Still to this day.

1:11:08SPEAKERI don't know, maybe with like the space telescopes

1:11:10SPEAKERor the big giant arrays or something, but it's a very faint,

1:11:13SPEAKERlike right around the equator, as my understanding,

1:11:15SPEAKERpretty close.

1:11:16SPEAKER- Okay.

1:11:18SPEAKER- Pioneer 1 also cruised 13,000 miles away from Saturn.

1:11:22SPEAKER- Yeah, that was the first spacecraft to visit Saturn.

1:11:24SPEAKER13,000 miles, pretty close.

1:11:26SPEAKER- 13,000 miles in terms of space, real close, I would say.

1:11:29SPEAKER- I was reading randomly, I didn't realize this,

1:11:31SPEAKERthat Saturn's, this probably goes for every ring system,

1:11:34SPEAKERbut Saturn's ring system has a shelf life.

1:11:37SPEAKER- Yeah, why is that, Brad?

1:11:39SPEAKER- It's only just decay.

1:11:40SPEAKERLike I think the material just, you know,

1:11:43SPEAKERI don't know if it's pulled into,

1:11:45SPEAKERpulled down to the planet or what.

1:11:46SPEAKERI just, it's due to the material dispersing in some way.

1:11:49SPEAKER- My understanding is you need a fair amount of moons,

1:11:54SPEAKERof satellites in order to keep them stable at all.

1:11:56SPEAKER- Oh, interesting.

1:11:58SPEAKER- Because they, like there's a push and pull

1:11:59SPEAKERand like those little moons on Saturn

1:12:02SPEAKERthat live inside the rings basically

1:12:04SPEAKERare what makes the rings have variation,

1:12:06SPEAKERis the current theory.

1:12:07SPEAKER- Interesting.

1:12:08SPEAKERYeah, the thing I read said that they expect the rings,

1:12:11SPEAKERSaturn's rings will be gone within a hundred million years.

1:12:13SPEAKER- Oh crap, I better go see them now then.

1:12:16SPEAKER- I think that's very interesting.

1:12:17SPEAKER- I think like that.

1:12:20SPEAKER- Like that's a blink in cosmological time, that is nothing.

1:12:23SPEAKER- Yes, the permanence of our world is small, is low.

1:12:28SPEAKER- Yep.

1:12:29SPEAKER- I lost my show notes here, there we go.

1:12:30SPEAKERI have too many tabs open, Brad.

1:12:33SPEAKERPluto crossed Neptune's orbit for the first time

1:12:36SPEAKERsince it's a discovery.

1:12:38SPEAKERSo it was discovered in the 20s or 30s, I can't remember.

1:12:43SPEAKERIt was discovered earlier in the 20th century.

1:12:46SPEAKEROn February 7th, it became the eighth planet.

1:12:49SPEAKERFebruary 11th, February 7th, 1979, for the next 20 years,

1:12:53SPEAKERit was the eighth planet for most of, yeah.

1:12:55SPEAKER- Oh, I thought that was just like a brief crossing.

1:12:57SPEAKERI didn't realize they just straight up swapped places

1:12:59SPEAKERfor two decades. - Well, it is a brief crossing.

1:13:01SPEAKER- Well, yes, Pluto takes a long time to orbit, it turns out.

1:13:04SPEAKER- Yes.

1:13:05SPEAKER- So yeah, it'll be that for like another 200 years

1:13:08SPEAKERor something at this point.

1:13:09SPEAKERWe won't see Pluto be the eighth planet ever again, actually,

1:13:11SPEAKERbecause, well, because it's not a planet anymore, Brad.

1:13:14SPEAKER- I got bad news for people, Pluto's not a planet.

1:13:18SPEAKER- Oh, crap.

1:13:19SPEAKERAlso, the first space shuttle was delivered to Florida,

1:13:23SPEAKERSpace shuttle Columbia.

1:13:24SPEAKERI mean, I guess actually the enterprise was,

1:13:27SPEAKERprobably didn't go to Florida,

1:13:28SPEAKERI guess it was they flew it in the desert, I guess.

1:13:30SPEAKER- Columbia was one of the, was the second disaster, right?

1:13:33SPEAKER- Columbia was the second disaster, yes.

1:13:36SPEAKER- Do you know how many there were?

1:13:38SPEAKER- Space shuttles?

1:13:39SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:13:40SPEAKER- Five, four or five? - Columbia Challenger Atlantis

1:13:42SPEAKERDiscovery, Discovery Atlantis Endeavor, five plus Enterprise.

1:13:46SPEAKER- What was the deal with Enterprise, sorry.

1:13:48SPEAKER- Enterprise was a flight bed, flight, a test flight,

1:13:51SPEAKERtest bed for the glide path stuff.

1:13:53SPEAKER- So it never actually.

1:13:55SPEAKER- Enterprise, they put up on the back of the 747

1:13:57SPEAKERand flew it up into the air and then cut it loose

1:14:01SPEAKERto see if they could control it.

1:14:02SPEAKER- Okay, but it never actually.

1:14:04SPEAKER- Never actually went to space.

1:14:06SPEAKER- Okay.

1:14:07SPEAKER- So there was talk that it would go to space,

1:14:10SPEAKERbut they ended up not doing it

1:14:11SPEAKERbecause it was easier to just,

1:14:12SPEAKERcheaper to just build a new one than to retrofit that one

1:14:15SPEAKERwith what they learned from the test program.

1:14:17SPEAKER- That makes sense.

1:14:18SPEAKER- So Enterprise is in, I can't remember where Enterprise is,

1:14:21SPEAKERmaybe it's in Houston.

1:14:24SPEAKERDiscovery is in, which is the oldest orbiter,

1:14:28SPEAKERwell, Enterprise is the oldest,

1:14:29SPEAKERbut Discovery is the oldest one that's been to space,

1:14:31SPEAKERis at the Air and Space Museum at Udvar-Hazy

1:14:33SPEAKERat Dulles Airport outside DC.

1:14:35SPEAKER- I would like to see that.

1:14:37SPEAKER- Endeavor is down south in LA.

1:14:40SPEAKER- Do you know if any of the museums let you go in them

1:14:43SPEAKERin any capacity?

1:14:43SPEAKER- No, you cannot go in.

1:14:44SPEAKER- Yeah, that's what I figured.

1:14:47SPEAKER- We talked about that when we went to Houston.

1:14:51SPEAKERI don't think it was on video,

1:14:52SPEAKERbut the curators, like they go in

1:14:57SPEAKERand they even limit access to like cameras

1:15:00SPEAKERand stuff like that.

1:15:02SPEAKERLike there's incredibly limited access

1:15:04SPEAKERto the insides of these types of exhibits

1:15:08SPEAKERbecause they don't want them to degrade.

1:15:09SPEAKERAnd anytime you put people in there,

1:15:11SPEAKERthey're gonna generate dust and stuff like that.

1:15:12SPEAKER- That's fair, that's fair.

1:15:13SPEAKER- So the one thing that they did do with Discovery,

1:15:16SPEAKERand I think all three of them actually,

1:15:18SPEAKERbefore they put them on display,

1:15:19SPEAKERwas they took a gigapixel cameras into the cockpit

1:15:23SPEAKERand there are gigapixel images of the entire cockpit,

1:15:26SPEAKERall the cabin area, all the living area, all that stuff.

1:15:28SPEAKER- Oh, that's cool, that's cool.

1:15:29SPEAKER- Which is pretty cool.

1:15:30SPEAKER- Yeah, one real quick note about Pluto

1:15:32SPEAKERbefore we move on that I wanted to throw out.

1:15:34SPEAKER- You got Pluto facts.

1:15:35SPEAKER- Here's a Pluto fact.

1:15:36SPEAKERYou made a, I don't know if you know this,

1:15:38SPEAKERyou probably know this, that Pluto crossing Neptune's orbit

1:15:43SPEAKERis one of the reasons it's not a planet anymore,

1:15:44SPEAKERnot classified as a planet anymore.

1:15:45SPEAKER- What?

1:15:46SPEAKER- That's one of the criteria that they came up with.

1:15:48SPEAKER- That's what made it special.

1:15:49SPEAKER- There's only one planet that did that.

1:15:51SPEAKERIt seems like they're just...

1:15:52SPEAKER- It's not a planet, it's not a planet.

1:15:54SPEAKER- We learn a lot about bullying as parents now.

1:15:57SPEAKER- I'm sure, I get it.

1:15:58SPEAKER- Look, I think those scientists bullied Pluto, Brad,

1:16:01SPEAKERthat's what I'm saying.

1:16:02SPEAKER- Dwarf planets are special too.

1:16:03SPEAKER- Wow, okay, they give them a special name.

1:16:05SPEAKERThat's always bad.

1:16:06SPEAKER- Pluto is, Pluto went from the smallest planet

1:16:10SPEAKERto the most famous dwarf planet.

1:16:14SPEAKER- Ceres and Eros are the other ones?

1:16:17SPEAKER- That's not Eros, but it's something like that.

1:16:22SPEAKER- I think there are potentially a lot of them in that class,

1:16:24SPEAKERin our solar system that are unknown.

1:16:27SPEAKER- Yeah, what is it?

1:16:29SPEAKER- Well, we don't have to get into it,

1:16:30SPEAKERbut to be a planet,

1:16:32SPEAKERthe object has to have cleared its own orbit

1:16:34SPEAKERis one of the criteria they came up with.

1:16:36SPEAKER- Wow.

1:16:37SPEAKER- It can't have any other similar objects crossing over.

1:16:40SPEAKER- No justice for Pluto.

1:16:42SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:16:42SPEAKER- You know what was fun is they,

1:16:44SPEAKER1979 is the first time that they televised

1:16:46SPEAKERall 500 miles of a NASCAR race,

1:16:48SPEAKERof a first televised 500 mile race.

1:16:51SPEAKERSo they televised the Daytona 500 for the very first time.

1:16:55SPEAKERAnd that, I think is, hmm?

1:16:59SPEAKER- I can tell you having grown up in a NASCAR house,

1:17:01SPEAKERthat is a long television program.

1:17:03SPEAKER- It is a lot, that's a whole day.

1:17:05SPEAKER- Is that like six hours or something?

1:17:07SPEAKER- I don't know, it takes, they drive 200 miles an hour,

1:17:08SPEAKERit shouldn't be that long, but for whatever reason,

1:17:10SPEAKERit takes a long time.

1:17:13SPEAKERI think this is interesting

1:17:14SPEAKERbecause this was a technological problem.

1:17:17SPEAKERLike being able to run broadcasts for that long

1:17:19SPEAKERand mix the video from that size of a track

1:17:23SPEAKERand stuff like that was,

1:17:25SPEAKERI assume something they couldn't do up until that point.

1:17:27SPEAKERSo.

1:17:29SPEAKER- Big deal for supporting events, live events.

1:17:33SPEAKER- Yeah, well like that and golf,

1:17:34SPEAKERit turns out doing golf tournaments usually weren't live.

1:17:37SPEAKERSo doing it live was, being able to do it live is important.

1:17:41SPEAKER- Probably a lot of listening to the radio before that.

1:17:43SPEAKER- I would assume so, yeah.

1:17:44SPEAKERAnd probably the radio guy wasn't even there,

1:17:46SPEAKERhe was just getting told it was happening by somebody else.

1:17:48SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:17:51SPEAKER- And the last one, Star Trek, the motion picture,

1:17:55SPEAKERpremiered at the Smithsonian Institute.

1:17:57SPEAKER- That's cool.

1:17:58SPEAKERI didn't know that's where it premiered,

1:17:59SPEAKERI've never seen it.

1:18:00SPEAKER- Someone with the bald lady.

1:18:01SPEAKER- Yes, I'm familiar, but yeah.

1:18:03SPEAKER- It's pretty, the costumes are really weird.

1:18:05SPEAKER- Right, that's V'ger, isn't it?

1:18:07SPEAKER- V'ger, yeah, it's basically the same story

1:18:10SPEAKERas Voyage Home, but without the whales.

1:18:11SPEAKER- Okay.

1:18:13SPEAKER- I want to see it at some point,

1:18:14SPEAKERI would like to get my hands.

1:18:16SPEAKER- What? - What?

1:18:17SPEAKER- I just said, I have not seen it.

1:18:20SPEAKER- What? - Brad.

1:18:20SPEAKER- What?

1:18:21SPEAKER- I thought you were a Trek fan.

1:18:22SPEAKERYou're a TNG guy.

1:18:24SPEAKER- Yeah, I'm only kind of a selective.

1:18:26SPEAKER- Wow.

1:18:27SPEAKER- There's a lot that I have not seen.

1:18:29SPEAKER- It has a transporter, it shows a transporter malfunction.

1:18:31SPEAKER- I've heard it's horrifying.

1:18:33SPEAKER- It's scarred me for a really long time.

1:18:35SPEAKER- I've read about the movie a bit recently

1:18:37SPEAKERand now I really wanna watch it

1:18:38SPEAKERbecause my impression of it is that they tried to make 2001.

1:18:41SPEAKERThey were trying to make a good movie instead

1:18:43SPEAKERof a "Star Trek" movie.

1:18:44SPEAKER- What I've read about it is that it has a lot of,

1:18:46SPEAKERlike a lot of really languid shots of starships

1:18:48SPEAKERand space and stuff like that and like.

1:18:50SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:18:51SPEAKER- It's going for that dreamy Kubrick kind of quality.

1:18:54SPEAKER- There's a lot of.

1:18:55SPEAKER- Sounds like a weird mess.

1:18:57SPEAKER- It's, yeah, like there's an opening sequence.

1:19:01SPEAKERThey do this a couple of times later on in the movies,

1:19:04SPEAKERbut there's an opening sequence where they fly a shuttle

1:19:06SPEAKERaround and it's just like model porn.

1:19:09SPEAKERLike spaceship model porn.

1:19:11SPEAKER- I do, I need to see that, that sounds pretty good.

1:19:13SPEAKER- Yeah, I feel like there's a left-handed spanner joke,

1:19:16SPEAKERwhich I can always appreciate.

1:19:17SPEAKERSo yeah, pretty good stuff all around.

1:19:22SPEAKERIt's not a good movie.

1:19:23SPEAKERI think "Voyage Home" is the superior

1:19:25SPEAKERof the giant spaceship coming to destroy us all, "Star Treks."

1:19:29SPEAKER- Sure, I wonder which of the six holds up the best

1:19:32SPEAKERthese days.

1:19:33SPEAKER- Of the six not-TNG movies?

1:19:36SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:19:37SPEAKER- "Undiscovered Country" probably.

1:19:38SPEAKER- That was gonna be my guess, actually.

1:19:40SPEAKERLike, I know "Wrath of Khan" is the go-to answer

1:19:42SPEAKERfor everybody, but like, and I mean,

1:19:44SPEAKERI'm sure "Wrath of Khan" is still great,

1:19:46SPEAKERbut like it's got a certain camp quality to it, right?

1:19:49SPEAKER- It's the ear thing, there's body horror.

1:19:51SPEAKERLike they still, like it's like they looked at "Star Wars"

1:19:54SPEAKERand they were like, hey, they have spaceships.

1:19:56SPEAKEROkay, we got spaceships, they have camaraderie,

1:19:58SPEAKERwe got camaraderie, they got weird aliens.

1:20:01SPEAKEROkay, we're gonna jam something in Chekhov's ear.

1:20:03SPEAKERDone, perfect.

1:20:05SPEAKER- I feel, I remember "Undiscovered Country"

1:20:06SPEAKERhaving some like really good political intrigue.

1:20:09SPEAKER- Yeah, it's all about the Klingons and bombs

1:20:11SPEAKERand spies and stuff.

1:20:12SPEAKERYeah, I don't know.

1:20:12SPEAKER"Undiscovered Country," I hadn't watched it

1:20:15SPEAKERuntil fairly recently, and when I watched it,

1:20:16SPEAKERI was pleasantly surprised, so.

1:20:18SPEAKER- Wow, I should go back.

1:20:18SPEAKERI haven't seen it since it came out.

1:20:20SPEAKERI should go check that out.

1:20:21SPEAKER- I don't know, probably a bazillion streaming services

1:20:23SPEAKERor whatever the CBS app is.

1:20:27SPEAKER- Hey, you know what?

1:20:28SPEAKERBig shout out to the San Francisco Public Library System.

1:20:30SPEAKERThey have got a bajillion Blu-rays.

1:20:33SPEAKER- There you go, that works too.

1:20:34SPEAKER- They've got all kinds of stuff.

1:20:36SPEAKER- They should set up a Plex server.

1:20:39SPEAKEROn that note, I think we should call it a day.

1:20:42SPEAKER- Okay.

1:20:43SPEAKER- Happy birthday, Brad. - Call it a year.

1:20:44SPEAKER- Call it a year, yeah.

1:20:45SPEAKER- Thank you, thank you, thank you.

1:20:46SPEAKER- If you like these episodes, please let us know

1:20:48SPEAKEReither on Twitter or on the Discord.

1:20:50SPEAKEREither one is great.

1:20:51SPEAKER- Yeah, we would love to like genuinely,

1:20:53SPEAKERwould love to hear.

1:20:54SPEAKERWe have batted around the idea in one form or another

1:20:56SPEAKERof maybe just doing this with other years, so.

1:20:58SPEAKER- As a semi-regular recurring feature.

1:21:00SPEAKERNot like, not monthly, but--

1:21:01SPEAKER- No, definitely not monthly,

1:21:02SPEAKERbut maybe a handful of times a year or something like that.

1:21:04SPEAKERJust pick a year.

1:21:06SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:21:07SPEAKER- You can do some newer ones.

1:21:09SPEAKER- Yeah, and if you wanna talk to other people

1:21:10SPEAKERabout stuff like the things that we discussed today,

1:21:13SPEAKERthe TechPod Discord is a fabulous place to do it,

1:21:14SPEAKERwhich you can get access to

1:21:16SPEAKERby joining the fabulous TechPod Patreon

1:21:18SPEAKERat patreon.com/techpod.

1:21:21SPEAKERIt's two bucks a month to get in the Discord.

1:21:23SPEAKER- For now.

1:21:24SPEAKER- For now.

1:21:25SPEAKERDun dun dun.

1:21:26SPEAKER- For now and some indeterminate time in the future.

1:21:30SPEAKER- We keep, we're busy, it turns out.

1:21:31SPEAKERIt's challenging to think up new things.

1:21:34SPEAKERSo anyway, you all continue to benefit.

1:21:36SPEAKERThe TechPod Discord, there's a bazillion channels.

1:21:40SPEAKERWe talk about interesting stuff all day long.

1:21:42SPEAKERLike this week was, you said it was Steam Deck Week

1:21:45SPEAKERfor like Thursday and Friday.

1:21:48SPEAKERI went, I was at basketball,

1:21:50SPEAKERmy daughter went to basketball camp this week

1:21:52SPEAKERand I was there watching her play basketball

1:21:54SPEAKERand my Twitter started popping off with people asking

1:21:57SPEAKERwhat I thought about this new Steam thing

1:21:59SPEAKERand I looked at it and I was like,

1:22:01SPEAKERoh man, Valve's gonna sue these people

1:22:02SPEAKERfor using the word Steam in a video game context

1:22:04SPEAKER'cause it didn't look like a Valve page.

1:22:06SPEAKER- You're behind the curve.

1:22:07SPEAKER- Yeah, I know.

1:22:09SPEAKERBut yeah, people are always talking about cool stuff.

1:22:11SPEAKER- Yes, it's a great place to get the straight scoop on stuff

1:22:14SPEAKERlike the nitty gritty.

1:22:16SPEAKER- Both, the straight scoop then the nitty gritty.

1:22:18SPEAKER- Well, like when the Steam Deck was announced,

1:22:19SPEAKERlike people immediately started going out

1:22:21SPEAKERand finding equivalent AMD APUs that are out there

1:22:24SPEAKERso you could kind of start seeing some benchmarks

1:22:26SPEAKERand like actual, you know, real world info on--

1:22:29SPEAKER- For reality.

1:22:30SPEAKER- On how powerful it is, yes.

1:22:32SPEAKER- Yeah, and as always, thank you

1:22:34SPEAKERto our executive producer, to your patrons,

1:22:36SPEAKERAndrew Slosky, The Bunny Fiend, Jacob Chappell,

1:22:39SPEAKERJoel Krauska, Twinkle Twinkie, David Allen and James Kamak.

1:22:42SPEAKERThank you guys all so much.

1:22:43SPEAKER- Thank you very much, very, very much.

1:22:46SPEAKER- And again, it's patreon.com/checkpot.

1:22:48SPEAKERIf you can't subscribe to the Patreon, that's fine.

1:22:50SPEAKERYou know, tell some friends, do a tweet, spread the word.

1:22:53SPEAKERLet us know what you think.

1:22:54SPEAKER- Listen to the show.

1:22:56SPEAKER- Yeah, listen, yeah, keep listening.

1:22:57SPEAKER- Leave a iTunes review.

1:22:59SPEAKER- Oh yeah, iTunes reviews are great.

1:23:00SPEAKEROur iTunes reviews are really, really pleasant.

1:23:02SPEAKERI always love checking it out.

1:23:03SPEAKERIt's nice to see what people think.

1:23:05SPEAKER- Yeah.

1:23:06SPEAKER- So anyway, thank you all so much.

1:23:07SPEAKERHave a lovely, lovely week, Mr. Shoemaker.

1:23:10SPEAKER- Thank you, same to you.

1:23:11SPEAKER- The Festival of Brad is--

1:23:14SPEAKER- I'm not, it may not surprise you to hear

1:23:16SPEAKERI'm not big on making a big deal out of my birthday.

1:23:19SPEAKER- Well, I'm gonna make a big deal out of your birthday then.

1:23:22SPEAKER- Well, thank you.

1:23:23SPEAKER- The Festival of Brad will live on.

1:23:26SPEAKERI hope you have a wonderful time and need some cake

1:23:28SPEAKERand do some good stuff. - Thank you so much.

1:23:30SPEAKER- We will see you all next week.

1:23:32SPEAKER(upbeat music)