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272: Mac OSX Snow Leopard 2

2025-02-02 · 1:28:19

00:00SPEAKERI've discovered something about myself, which is that I don't know how to function without eggs.

00:06SPEAKERYeah, I eat eggs every day, almost.

00:09SPEAKERI know eggs have been a topic of discourse for the last few weeks.

00:14SPEAKERI'm not looking to start any political conversations here.

00:17SPEAKERI'm just talking about the material realities on the ground right now.

00:20SPEAKERYeah, we were thrilled to get eggs last week.

00:22SPEAKERDid you find some?

00:23SPEAKERYeah, Amazon had them when Gina ordered groceries, just surprisingly.

00:30SPEAKERWe're seeing eggs around now, but they're very expensive, which we could afford it,

00:35SPEAKERbut $10 plus per dozen is a little hard to swallow.

00:40SPEAKERAnd just to be clear, they're not fancy eggs where they write the name of the chicken on the box.

00:45SPEAKERThese are bog standard, just in styrofoam packaging eggs.

00:49SPEAKERThose are the bargain basement eggs at the local bulk store that I'm talking about.

00:54SPEAKERBut the other thing is, I don't know exactly what the mechanisms are for the bird flu spread

01:00SPEAKERto humans, but I don't know if you're taking a risk by eating eggs right now or not.

01:04SPEAKERI don't know what the detection mechanisms are for making sure we are getting eggs from healthy hens.

01:09SPEAKERSo we had this conversation prior to January 20th in our house, and I did some quick research

01:16SPEAKERon the federal government's websites about avoiding getting H5N1 from food.

01:22SPEAKERAnd the thing about eggs is because it spreads so quickly in birds,

01:26SPEAKERthey cull the flocks immediately as soon as something tests positive.

01:30SPEAKERAnd they were confident at that time that H5N1 was not going to get into

01:37SPEAKERthe egg supply because of the speed at which the disease kills the birds.

01:42SPEAKERYeah, that sounds like there's still a chance.

01:45SPEAKERAlso, if you cook stuff to 160 degrees, it's fine.

01:47SPEAKERSo as long as you don't have a cold runny egg, you're fine.

01:51SPEAKERYeah. Well, cold egg, no runny yolk, yes. I'm a big runny yolk fan.

01:56SPEAKERI like it. I did poach. I poached some eggs and I was curious about how hot the yolk

02:00SPEAKERgot when I poached them properly and it was 165. So I was fine.

02:03SPEAKEROkay.

02:04SPEAKEREggs are delicious.

02:05SPEAKERYeah, no.

02:06SPEAKERI miss them.

02:07SPEAKERIt turns out, especially when I'm left to my own devices and there's not somebody else here to help

02:11SPEAKERshare the load, eggs are basically the load bearing pillar of my quick whip up a meal process.

02:17SPEAKERI hard boil a dozen at least every other week because quick snack, fast lunch, fast breakfast,

02:27SPEAKERwhatever, they're universal. The other thing I learned from reading the FDA's website was that

02:33SPEAKERif you are concerned about it, you can buy pasteurized processed egg. Obviously,

02:39SPEAKERyou're not going to get a runny yolk, but if you want to make scrambled eggs and stuff like that,

02:42SPEAKERthat stuff is all pasteurized and processed. That's why they use it in retirement homes

02:48SPEAKERand nursing homes and stuff like that is because you're less likely to get salmonella because the

02:54SPEAKERprocessed egg mixture is homogenized and pasteurized.

02:57SPEAKEROkay. Yeah, we considered the carton eggs, the egg beaters or so forth, but I did not

03:01SPEAKERrealize that stuff was pasteurized. Maybe I've got an out here.

03:05SPEAKERI think egg beaters are fake. I think egg beaters are fakes though.

03:08SPEAKERAre those fake eggs?

03:10SPEAKEROkay. Well, whatever. Real liquid egg, let's say, might actually suit then.

03:16SPEAKEROh no. It says it's made with real eggs. 100% egg whites.

03:20SPEAKEROh, 100%. Okay. I was going to say it could be made with real eggs and a lot of other things,

03:23SPEAKERbut I guess not.

03:25SPEAKERWell, hold on. They have a whole line of products. This is the original liquid egg substitute.

03:29SPEAKERThere's 100% egg whites. There's Southwestern style liquid egg substitute with vegetables.

03:36SPEAKERIt's capitalism doing the work once more.

03:40SPEAKERYes. I have considered alternatives, you know, beans, tofu.

03:46SPEAKERWhat about quail eggs?

03:48SPEAKERQuail eggs?

03:49SPEAKERYeah. You just get a bunch of quail eggs in like a 35 egg omelet.

03:52SPEAKERI was going to say I only need like three cartons to equal one pair of eggs.

03:57SPEAKERLook, I saw an ad for something the other day on YouTube. I think that was a guy that was trying

04:02SPEAKERto cut open quail eggs with like little like nail clipping scissors. Like it was clearly a chef and

04:07SPEAKERthe whole thing was like, Hey, get the right tools. And then it was an ad for someplace that you can

04:10SPEAKERbuy chef's tools. But I was like, cause you know, there's a, there's a thing specifically for topping

04:15SPEAKERquail eggs and giving it a nice round. But yeah, I was, I was just thinking, I'm glad I don't have

04:19SPEAKERto top quail eggs for a living. That seems like it would be pretty, I mean, I guess we're topping

04:23SPEAKERour own quail eggs here though. I don't know what the metaphor is. I got nothing.

04:27SPEAKERNo. The only quail egg ever had was raw on sushi.

04:30SPEAKEROoh, I had, I had quail eggs, I've had quail eggs and salads and stuff before too, but like,

04:35SPEAKERyou know, poached in the shell and the whole thing.

04:37SPEAKERWhat other egg options can we explore? Like, I mean, sure about platypus.

04:42SPEAKERUh, I don't think you want to eat a platypus egg.

04:44SPEAKERProbably not.

04:45SPEAKERI think they're like, I think they're pretty lousy with diseases, but I don't, I feel like

04:49SPEAKERif they're anything like koalas. Ew.

04:51SPEAKEROkay. I'm not sure we're going to get any koala eggs anytime soon.

04:55SPEAKERKoalas are, you know, lousy with chlamydia. Of course. It's a, it's a known problem.

04:59SPEAKERBut, uh, how dare you besmirch the honor of the noble koala.

05:03SPEAKERDuck eggs though, rip. Duck eggs are fantastic. I mean, I'm all about that duck life. If we,

05:08SPEAKERuh, I'll eat, I'll eat Peking duck for lunch. I'll eat duck eggs. They're,

05:13SPEAKERthey're a little more unctuous. They're tasty.

05:29SPEAKER[Music]

05:44SPEAKERWelcome to Brad and Will Made a Tech Pod. I'm Will.

05:47SPEAKERI'm Brad.

05:49SPEAKERUh, Brad, it is that time of month again. Well, actually it's,

05:53SPEAKERthis is going to be, this is going to be a day late, two days late.

05:55SPEAKERThis is a week late.

05:57SPEAKERWell, well, I mean, yeah, but it's like the end of the month is...

06:00SPEAKERYeah. We're just barely missing the end of January, but you know,

06:04SPEAKERthe standard is the last Sunday of the month.

06:06SPEAKERI know, but, but last week we had, we had video card embargoes to go through. So,

06:10SPEAKERso we're doing Q's and A's this week instead, which means we have an extra large crop.

06:16SPEAKERIt turns out when you do last month's, uh, Q and A two weeks early.

06:20SPEAKERYeah.

06:20SPEAKERAnd then you do this month's a week late. There are, there are seven by,

06:24SPEAKERby Google doc reckoning, there are 17 pages of discord questions.

06:29SPEAKERYeah. It's a lot of, so I was looking at emails. I was like, man,

06:32SPEAKERthere's not really that many emails. And then I was like, oh, right.

06:34SPEAKERI got to go back to December 14th. And, uh, there, there were a lot of emails.

06:38SPEAKERSo I think we should just get right into it. If you want to send an email,

06:42SPEAKERit's techpod@content.town. You can, you can send your missive there,

06:45SPEAKERor you can post a question in the Q's seeking a question seeking answers channel in the discord.

06:52SPEAKERThey both get to us in the same way. And if you're not in the discord,

06:55SPEAKERyou can get there by going to patreon.com/techpod and signing up for, uh, any tier of the Patreon.

07:00SPEAKERAnd you get access to the community discord, which is full of delightful people.

07:03SPEAKERTrue. People such as the askers of these questions.

07:08SPEAKERMany of them. Yeah.

07:09SPEAKERYeah. There's no time to waste. There are so many. I'm just going to jump right in here.

07:11SPEAKERI'm going to start with this discord question from annoyed and tired. Aside from fear,

07:17SPEAKERis there another big reason we both humans and specifically the United States haven't

07:22SPEAKERinvested in nuclear power? It's phenomenally expensive to set up

07:26SPEAKERbillions of dollars investment upfront. It takes a really long time. We talked about

07:30SPEAKERhow long it takes to build a fab a few months ago, a few weeks ago, I don't know, a while ago,

07:35SPEAKERbut it's nothing compared to what it takes to build a nuclear plant.

07:38SPEAKERYeah. I mean, I always see, you know, like, oh, it takes a decade to get a plant online

07:42SPEAKERfrom the approval or whatever, but like the proponents of nuclear would certainly have

07:46SPEAKERyou believe that a lot of that is jumping through regulatory hoops and like battling the people who

07:51SPEAKERare staunchly anti-nuclear and that like, oh, if you know, if the regulatory environment was

07:57SPEAKERmore permissive, then we could get these things going much faster and cheaper. I don't know who

08:01SPEAKERto believe there, honestly. Look NIMBY isn't an acronym for nuclear in my backyard, Brad.

08:06SPEAKERThat's all I'm saying. Yes. That's for sure.

08:09SPEAKERWhen you open up a nuclear, when you're like, Hey, I want to start a nuclear plant. Then people are

08:12SPEAKERlike, oh man, yeah, we, that's a, that sounds fantastic. Where's it going to be? Oh, it's three,

08:17SPEAKERthree blocks from your elementary school. Oh no, no, no, we don't, we don't want that. So, so yeah,

08:22SPEAKERI think it's all of that stuff. It takes a long time to get the regulatory stuff going. We haven't,

08:27SPEAKERas far as I know, started a new, like large scale nuclear plant in the United States in

08:32SPEAKER20 or 30 years, 40 years at this point, probably. Yeah. And there were places in Europe, like I

08:37SPEAKERthink Germany was literally decommissioning functional nuclear plants recently. Maybe they

08:43SPEAKERwere functional. I'm actually not sure, but I know that Germany has shut some plants down. Isn't,

08:47SPEAKERI think France is pretty strong on nuclear though. Right?

08:50SPEAKERYeah. France is, is, is big on nuclear. The, the newest one, the newest nuclear power plant

08:56SPEAKERin the United States was built 40, was open 42 years ago. The average age is 42 years.

09:03SPEAKEROkay. It's still pretty old. The newest reactor to enter service is the Vodel unit for an Alvin

09:10SPEAKERW. Vodel electric generating plant in Georgia that began commercial operation. Oh, this year,

09:15SPEAKERlast year, April 29th, 2024. So it is happening. Yeah. I mean, the thing, the thing I always see

09:22SPEAKERnuclear proponents say is that modern reactor designs are both way more efficient and way safer

09:27SPEAKERthan they used to be. I mean, that's what everybody says.

09:31SPEAKERYeah. I am absolutely not a subject matter expert. My, my gut feeling is that the shadows of Three

09:38SPEAKERMile Island and Chernobyl are so huge that a lot of, a lot of the resistance is kind of legacy.

09:44SPEAKERWell, I think people are afraid of it. I think people are afraid of it because the thing they

09:48SPEAKERcan't see. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Like, I think the general public also understands nuclear

09:56SPEAKERradiation, probably extremely poorly. Look, we've all watched Iron Man. We've

10:01SPEAKERall watched the Avengers and we know how the Incredible Hulk was made. And that's pretty

10:05SPEAKERmuch the extent of, I think most American scientific knowledge on the topic. The point of

10:11SPEAKERthe design, the modern design of like the newer reactors is that when they fail, they're supposed

10:17SPEAKERto fail in such a way that they don't go critical and don't do the thing that Fukushima did or

10:21SPEAKERThree Mile Island did or like super duper Chernobyl did. But, but yeah, I don't know.

10:30SPEAKERChernobyl is an ally or where there was like a fatal design flaw in the reactor that was known

10:34SPEAKERbefore it even went into construction and was kind of pushed through for other reasons than

10:38SPEAKERscientific ones. It's what happens when you don't have a good regulatory state controlling your,

10:43SPEAKERyour nuclear reactor growth and installation. The one place that there's a lot of nuclear growth is

10:48SPEAKERthere's a, there's several startups I know of that are spinning up a small scale nuclear

10:54SPEAKERgenerators for like disaster zones and stuff like that. So they're using like container size

10:59SPEAKERgenerators. Yeah. They can go on the back of an 18 Wheeler and replace like a, like a big,

11:06SPEAKERlike a cat, small, several megawatt generator for disaster relief and stuff like that.

11:12SPEAKERYeah. Yeah. I don't, I won't, I won't put anybody on blast here, but we have,

11:15SPEAKERwe have some folks on the discord who are working in that exact field in a startup capacity,

11:20SPEAKERworking on kind of portable and deployable reactor designs.

11:25SPEAKERSo I found a chart that shows when new reactors were turned on in the United States and the

11:31SPEAKERVodel unit three was in 23. The four was in 2024 Watts bar unit two, which is in Tennessee

11:38SPEAKERnear Chattanooga turned on in 2016. And then prior to that, the last one was in like 1996 or 1997.

11:46SPEAKERWe really don't turn them on very often. Yeah. There are a lot in the seventies and eighties.

11:52SPEAKERIt feels, I don't know, gut reaction feels kind of unfortunate to me again,

11:56SPEAKERnot a subject matter expert, but. Well, and I don't know if you saw,

12:00SPEAKERbut that's the concentrated solar salt plant outside of Nevada, outside of Las Vegas that

12:05SPEAKERyou see when you fly in, fly across the Mojave is getting shut down now too. They're not continuing

12:12SPEAKERto fund that. It, it, I think it was always a money loser. I don't know if it ever became,

12:16SPEAKERit was more of a test test situation. Back to coal, I guess for us then.

12:21SPEAKERYou know, it's the future. Yeah, of course, but go wrong. I don't know if you saw

12:26SPEAKERsometime last year, China demonstrated or some, some organization in China demonstrated kind of a

12:32SPEAKERlike a passive, not exactly a passively cooled reactor, but it was basically a fail safe

12:36SPEAKERsituation where it was effectively meltdown proof. Well, that's, that's the way all of the modern

12:43SPEAKERthird or fourth gen or whatever work is that I don't, I don't know. I mean, again, not an expert,

12:47SPEAKERbut the, the headlines about this made it out. Like this was a pretty radical new development,

12:51SPEAKERlike to the point that they did, they demonstrated it by pulling the cooling on the reactor. Oh,

12:55SPEAKERthat's fantastic. Literally put it into a meltdown situation to demonstrate the capability of it. And

13:01SPEAKERit did not, it did not melt down. So floats on the arrestor rods so that when the water goes away,

13:06SPEAKERthey just dropped down into place and they turn off the reactor. I don't know. Yeah. I don't know

13:10SPEAKERhow it worked, but it seemed, it seemed to be a pretty big deal anyway, the energy 21st century,

13:15SPEAKERwho knows where things are going? It seems, it seems like an area that probably bears more

13:21SPEAKERinvestment, but it's thorny. I mean, look, the growth of solar and the potential of solar is

13:26SPEAKERsuch that I think there's a, there's an argument that we need storage and things like that more

13:33SPEAKERthan we need. We need generation because of the stupid data center usage right now. But yeah,

13:42SPEAKERstorage also seems important. Like building big high, low reservoir systems where we can

13:47SPEAKERpump water up during the day when we have electricity generated from solar and wind,

13:50SPEAKERand then release it at night to generate hydro when there's no sun, stuff like that is good.

13:55SPEAKERYeah. Don't get, don't get me wrong. I would absolutely be fine with all green options if

13:58SPEAKERit could be capacity, but who was it that, Oh, I wish I had saved this. Who is it that's working

14:03SPEAKERon an orbital power generation station that is going to effectively beam energy back to earth

14:10SPEAKERvia microwaves? Oh yeah. That's Dyson sphere project. I do that right now. You put the solar

14:14SPEAKERsails out in orbit and then you beam the electricity back to your planet so you can

14:19SPEAKERharvest coal faster and better. I can't, it's just good science. I don't, I saw that story,

14:24SPEAKERbut I don't remember what it was. Yes. This one. Okay. Yes. This, this was scientists in China are

14:28SPEAKERworking on a solar based or sorry, a space-based solar power station. I mean, it makes sense.

14:36SPEAKERApparently like it's fully safe to beam the energy back with microwaves. Like they pass through

14:41SPEAKERstuff just fine. It's fine. I mean, look, what's the difference between a space-based power

14:47SPEAKERgeneration thing that beams back energy with the microwaves and a space-based microwave death ray

14:53SPEAKERthat you know, cooks people from space. It's the same thing. It's just a difference of amplitude,

14:59SPEAKERright? Yeah. They're the same picture, Brad, the same picture. Amplitude the right word there? I

15:03SPEAKERdon't know. I don't, I'm going to mess this up, so I'm not going to say anything. Frequency or

15:09SPEAKERamplitude or one of those, let's say. All right, let's move on to something we definitely know

15:14SPEAKERbetter than energy. Question for beach rave up next here. I love a beach rave. Yeah. For a long

15:21SPEAKERtime, I've carried around a superstition about using a real flash drive versus using a micro SD

15:27SPEAKERUSB converter, or these days an NVME enclosure. Are those fears founded? Do devices see the two

15:33SPEAKERthings differently and does it have implications for booting from them on older machines or

15:39SPEAKERbrowsing the files on a TV? This is one of those questions that I don't exactly understand the

15:44SPEAKERquestion, but I think I got the gist and it's also surprisingly complicated. Yeah. I do see

15:48SPEAKERwhere they're coming from because I do run into this. I have, I have a couple of SATA to USB

15:55SPEAKERcables. Yeah. The SATA end is a pretty fat plug. So I assume there's some kind of controller in

15:59SPEAKERthere. Like there's some conversion happening, which, you know, lets you take an off the shelf

16:03SPEAKERSATA drive, that SSD and plug it into anything as if it's a USB drive. Yeah. I have, I absolutely

16:09SPEAKERhave things. In fact, I believe my TV and my Xbox series X both refuse to recognize drives through

16:16SPEAKERthat thing as like USB drives. Like I can't. Even if they're formatted right? Yes. Like,

16:21SPEAKERlike I plug that thing into the Xbox and I get a message that it's not like a, not a supported

16:24SPEAKERdrive type or whatever. So, so there are, there are definitely situations where whatever controller

16:29SPEAKERis doing some conversion from other media to USB might not work with a given device. And in

16:35SPEAKERthose cases, I do just have to use a straight up off the shelf thumb drive, which kind of done with

16:40SPEAKERthumb drives. Like they're, they're unreliable. They're slow. Like I, I am, I am actually,

16:44SPEAKERI think, going to get an NVMe enclosure soon. So I just think that, but, but I, but I don't know if,

16:49SPEAKERI don't know if that'll work with my TV or my Xbox. So the thing I find, I don't try to put

16:55SPEAKERstuff on my TV or Xbox all that often, but the thing I find is that thumb drives are really

17:00SPEAKERuseful for things that I need a specific, like a whole image dumped onto a thing so that I don't

17:07SPEAKERhave to, so that I don't have to like wipe my two terabyte NVMe drive, every external NVMe drive,

17:16SPEAKERevery time I want to reinstall windows on something. Right. That's, that's a pain in the

17:19SPEAKERbutt. The, so I use NVMe enclosures all the time to copy stuff off of old SSDs onto a new SSD,

17:26SPEAKERlike to image an old SSD to a new SSD or something like that. If I'm, if I'm upgrading sizes,

17:31SPEAKERthe, the big problem with most devices I find is not the controller. It's the formatting on

17:37SPEAKERthe, on the drives. Cause if you default format an external drive, especially a larger one in windows,

17:44SPEAKERit'll put NTFS on it, which is really lightly supported everywhere but windows.

17:50SPEAKERUsually want to use exFAT for like kind of quote unquote crappy devices, like say your TV that is

17:57SPEAKERmaybe not super well-designed, like generally, generally something older,

18:00SPEAKERFAT32 or exFAT is a safer bet there. Yeah. I was going to say sometimes it's all the way back to

18:04SPEAKERFAT32, depending on how old it is. Obviously that has implications for how big a file can be. And

18:09SPEAKERsure enough, my use case for this typically is, Hey, I have this video file that Lex is having a

18:14SPEAKERhard time with and I need to put it straight in. And then the other thing that you don't get with

18:19SPEAKERlike a thumb drive or a flash drive is wear leveling. So your NVMe has, has, has logic

18:26SPEAKERinside it that will say, okay, we've used these cells on the NAND a lot, and they're going to get

18:31SPEAKERworn out if we keep using them exclusively. So we will put data in other cells and avoid these

18:36SPEAKERfor a while until everything's even. And you're, you're like, this is why thumb drives and compact

18:40SPEAKERflash cards or SD cards wear out faster than, than a flash and an SSD. So if you are doing a lot of,

18:49SPEAKERbut, but it's a, it's a large scale thing. So like when you use SD cards to record video every day,

18:55SPEAKERso you're working on a website where you shoot video every day and you're constantly recording

18:58SPEAKERvideo and you're cycling those cards in and out all day and you're wiping them every week. And

19:03SPEAKERlike they, they're going to wear out faster than like somebody who uses it twice a year to install

19:10SPEAKERnew versions of windows or copy files to their TV or something like that. Yeah, that's why,

19:15SPEAKERthat's why SD cards tend to wear out very quickly in raspberry PI's because Linux is constantly

19:19SPEAKERwriting log files to the card. That's why every PI I have, I set up log to Ram on there, which puts

19:25SPEAKERthe moves the logs into a Ram drive. So you're not wearing, and those, those cards have gone for

19:30SPEAKERyears now with that installed. So that helps. Yeah. Most of the PI stuff now defaults to that.

19:36SPEAKERIf you install from scratch, I've found like this like PI hole defaults to log to Ram. Now I believe

19:42SPEAKERyou mean if it's like a, like a pre-made image of something we made image for that,

19:45SPEAKERyeah. Or like, like a home assistant image or something. Yeah. If you're just doing straight

19:48SPEAKERraspberry PI OS, you'll have to set that up yourself. Yeah. Yeah. So, so yeah, if you're,

19:53SPEAKERbut if you're just using, if you're just using it to copy files, like occasionally thumb drive,

19:57SPEAKERit's all equivalent. If you're doing stuff constantly and doing a lot of work on it,

20:00SPEAKERthe SSD in an NVMe enclosure will give you a better result. Yeah. I mean, my, my biggest

20:06SPEAKERproblem with thumb drives these days is the write speeds are intolerable. Like they are,

20:09SPEAKERit's just so slow. Like again, again, it's usually a big video file I need to put on there so I can

20:14SPEAKERplug it in directly to play it on something. And when you're getting 20 megabytes a second on a

20:20SPEAKERfile that is gigantic, it's like, well, I guess I'm coming back in 30 minutes to watch this. So

20:25SPEAKERthat's the biggest reason I'm going to get an NVMe. So I will tell you, there's a wide variance in

20:31SPEAKERthumb drives. I bought a couple of SanDisk, new SanDisk thumb drives, cause my old ones had,

20:37SPEAKERlike I had these little, the ones that just like are the nub that poke out of the USB-A port. I

20:41SPEAKERwanted something that I'd see on one side, nay on the other. And the, I tried three before I found

20:48SPEAKERone that was sufficiently fast. So there is variance in the controllers and the, and the

20:53SPEAKERthumb drives, and it's worth actually spending 10 bucks more on a good one. And don't use the ones

20:58SPEAKERyou get at trade shows, please, for the love of God. Yes, definitely not. The thing I am looking

21:02SPEAKERat now is which enclosure to get for an NVMe drive because the 10 gigabit per second ones are

21:09SPEAKERplentiful and cheap. The 20 gigabit per second ones are still quite expensive and also apparently

21:13SPEAKERare just like hot as hell. And that's like, we're not just talking to heat from the NVMe drive,

21:18SPEAKERlike the controllers in the enclosures apparently also generate a shitload of heat.

21:23SPEAKERLike people, people saying like, Hey, these things get too hot to touch while they're in use,

21:27SPEAKERwhile they're being written to. So I don't know if it's worth getting a 20 gigabit

21:33SPEAKERper second enclosure just yet. I might, I might get a 10 because that's still like a good gigabyte

21:38SPEAKERa second, which like, come on, that's probably fine for a while. So I was going to say you're

21:42SPEAKERgoing to be fine with a 10, 10, like we use at PC world, we use these tough gaming AS 1000s, which

21:50SPEAKERare, or maybe they're A1s, I'm not sure. They're an ASUS, an ASUS external, like NVMe cage. It's

21:59SPEAKERreally, really sturdy. It's waterproof and dust resistant when you seal it up the way they tell

22:04SPEAKERyou to. And they're like, it's just, I don't notice a whole lot of speed difference between

22:11SPEAKERthat and an internal drive for copying. And we're almost exclusively using to copy large files.

22:17SPEAKERSo I'm on their site right now. They really go out of their way not to say where, okay, here,

22:23SPEAKERoh, these are 10 gigabit ones. Okay, sure. These are 10 gigabit ones. Okay. Yeah, sure. I mean,

22:26SPEAKERI had 10 is probably fine. Like you can get a good, you know, they're $20 10 gigabit enclosures

22:31SPEAKERthese days. So I was going to say, I have an NVMe that's a 10 gigabit, $20 one, a USB cage,

22:38SPEAKERand it is not, I've never seen 10 gigabit out of it. It is slow and janky. And if I do a huge

22:45SPEAKERtransfer, it craps out. I threw one in the trash before I got to the one that I like.

22:50SPEAKERTo be fair, the one you just held it up, it's one of the ones that doesn't even close the drive.

22:54SPEAKERIt's basically just a bare circuit board with the NVMe drive just open to the air.

22:59SPEAKERHow do you, what do you, you want to coddle it? You want to put it in a little house?

23:03SPEAKERI mean, I mean, most of these things have a lot of passive cooling in them. Like,

23:06SPEAKERlike I've actually wonder if you're thermal throttling and one that doesn't have any cooling

23:09SPEAKERfor the drive. Look, I have little, I have little, I have little heat sinks that I stick on there

23:15SPEAKERthat I have little, a little graphite pads on the bottom that I just rest on there. It's fine.

23:19SPEAKERThe last thing I was gonna say real quick, if you're using a giant dry, like a two terabyte

23:22SPEAKERdrive, and you're talking about like having to format ex-fat or whatever, you should just

23:25SPEAKERpartition it. It should just make a 512 gig or even like 128 gig partition, something small-ish

23:32SPEAKERand format that to ex-fat. And you can still use the rest of it in TFS.

23:36SPEAKERSo I find that sometimes weird with booting depending on, on what you're trying to boot into.

23:42SPEAKERSo when I was doing a lot of bizite stuff and all that, it was, it was always questionable what was

23:47SPEAKERgoing to boot the right way and whether it was going to recognize it once you got into the boot

23:52SPEAKERthing on a multi, like a lot of the installers are designed for a single partition device. So.

23:58SPEAKERLast question from this before we move on, does, does this have implications for booting from

24:03SPEAKERthose devices? Like those, those little SATA cables I mentioned, like I've never had a problem

24:07SPEAKERbooting a machine, booting a PC off of those things. So those tend to work just fine. Like

24:11SPEAKERcomputers tend to read all forms of external storage fine. In my experience, it's usually

24:17SPEAKERan embedded devices like TVs and stuff that have an issue. Yeah. The lower power device,

24:22SPEAKERthe worse your time is going to be generally speaking. Let's see. Here's a question from

24:27SPEAKERSpasium. Would you consider making a forum like Shaq news, not like a PHP forum, but one that looks

24:34SPEAKERand feels like the Shaq news chatty. I'll, I'll jump in here and mention, I don't know what the

24:38SPEAKERname for this is like nested comments, I guess is the way to describe this. It's like, it's kind of

24:42SPEAKERthe slashdot forum. Discord calls it a forum. So it's like, it's like a channel in discord

24:50SPEAKERthat instead of having a rolling scroll of text, there's top level posts. And then you can reply to

24:56SPEAKERthose. There's a conversation happening in those top level posts, basically. Actually, I feel like

25:00SPEAKERan idiot. It's Reddit. Like to be, to be on, to be abundantly clear, it's just Reddit. It's just,

25:05SPEAKERit's just comments with nested comments underneath them. It's definitely a reference point. Everybody

25:12SPEAKERshould understand. You're saying Shaq news was the original Reddit, basically is what I'm hearing.

25:16SPEAKERKind of actually, or slashdot maybe. I don't know who did it first actually.

25:22SPEAKERDo either of you still find that format more compelling than the more transitory nature of

25:26SPEAKERdiscord? I like the Shaq news format a lot. I like the nested, nested style of comment replies.

25:32SPEAKERYeah. I would never run a forum like that because the burden of having to be the person responsible

25:39SPEAKERfor what gets posted on the forum and having to moderate the forum and all of that stuff

25:44SPEAKERseems like a nightmare. There's, there's something nice about the transitory nature of discord.

25:48SPEAKERIt, when I, when I used to mad because it's like the maximum PC forms were pretty big and it was

25:53SPEAKERa fair amount of work to maintain them. And honestly, the forms that tested in giant bomb,

25:58SPEAKERI don't, I don't, you guys didn't do a whole lot of moderation. You had a pretty good mod team on

26:01SPEAKERthe giant bomb. We definitely had moderators. Like Rory was in charge of, was mostly in charge of

26:06SPEAKERliaising with moderators. So we, we had a couple of moderators untested, but the traffic was never

26:12SPEAKERreally high. On maximum PC, it was an unbelievable amount of work to keep the moderators, to keep

26:17SPEAKEReverything going and to keep the, keep the peace there. Yeah. The transitory nature means that a

26:22SPEAKERlot of things that are going to upset people or cause problems just are gone by the time

26:27SPEAKERsomebody who'll be pissed off about them, see them. And that makes everything easier. Also,

26:33SPEAKERI don't feel like I have to read the whole thing when it's a forum, when it's a forum,

26:37SPEAKERI feel like I have to read everything. You know what I mean? Sure. Sure. Yeah. I'm pretty bummed

26:42SPEAKERabout the collapse of the shack news community that has taken place over the last few weeks.

26:46SPEAKERCause I basically have gone to that site every day for the last almost 30 years. Yeah. Since it was

26:52SPEAKERthe quake, Holyo. Yeah. Kind of sad. And also just sad to see that style of a forum that formats kind

26:59SPEAKERof going out of fashion outside of Reddit. I kind of always thought that old forums didn't die. They

27:03SPEAKERjust faded away, but it turns out sometimes they also just die. Sometimes the bottom just falls

27:07SPEAKERout. Everybody should have just moved to blues news because blues is still going strong. Blue

27:11SPEAKERis still posting just like, but just like it's 1997 again, such a trip. It is such a trip going

27:16SPEAKERto blues news these days. Cause he's still there posting constant gaming news up to now,

27:22SPEAKERbut with the exact same site design he's had for 25 years. I love it. It's such a weird anachronism.

27:28SPEAKERI sent a Anna Cruz's press releases and he posted him every single time, 100%, 100% pick up. Yeah.

27:34SPEAKERSo shout out to blue. Blue's doing all right. I was a shack shack news regular too. And I am sad.

27:41SPEAKERIt's gone. The discord's nice. The folks who run in the discord that they moved migrated to

27:47SPEAKERare doing a really nice job. They're doing it. They're doing like, Hey, Hey guys, here's how to

27:52SPEAKERuse. We're going to teach you how to use discord. There was a discord introductory session on Sunday

27:56SPEAKERthat I thought was the, I thought it was a cool thing to do. So they're, they're working to keep

28:01SPEAKERthe community together, which I love. Yeah. A question from annoyed and tired. You think

28:07SPEAKERthat in 30 years, we'll have to convert media like photos and video, like, wow, we now have

28:11SPEAKERto convert VHS and CDs. Eternally. Yeah. It's the, that's the future, but maybe I don't know. I, I,

28:19SPEAKERI feel like once we get it at digital, you know, he's talking about, he's talking about physical

28:24SPEAKERand in some cases, analog media, but like once everything is digitized, I feel like it's mostly

28:27SPEAKERjust going to hang around for probably the rest of our lives, at least because, you know, there

28:32SPEAKERare enough tools like FFmpeg out there that don't deprecate support for old formats aggressively,

28:37SPEAKERthat yet by and large, if you've got something already encoded digitally, you're probably going

28:42SPEAKERto be able to read it just fine. I mean, I think, I think there's a, the other problem is that

28:47SPEAKERbit rot on all media exists. So even your hard drives, your SSDs are definitely SSDs unpowered

28:55SPEAKERare good for like five years. I think is the, is the spec for most SSDs. So you like your, your,

29:03SPEAKERthe problem becomes a, what happens to these old weird formats? So like if you downloaded

29:09SPEAKERreal music stuff in 1998, 19 or 2001, that's probably unplayable. Now, any, any DRM to WMA

29:17SPEAKERfiles are going to be an enormous pain in the ass to get into probably. I have just searched

29:23SPEAKERmy NAS for, for dot RM files. Yeah. I bet VLC plays them. Let's see here is here's one. Well,

29:31SPEAKERhere's Lieberman dot RM. Don't open that one from 1999. Oh boy. That's going to be about video games.

29:39SPEAKERHere's a, here's a couple of RMS in a, in a nested folder called Tenacious DWHFS interview.

29:45SPEAKERThat's probably okay. I'm going to, I'm going to drag this into MPV.

29:50SPEAKERDouble-click. It's not, I don't hear anything. This is the problem. It is not playing. I,

29:56SPEAKERI, you know, I'll, I'll revisit that. Yeah. I bet, I bet VLC would play it.

30:01SPEAKERAll right. If I think it couldn't convert it, but like, like the other day I pulled,

30:05SPEAKERthis is maybe a little bit of a deep cut. This is circa 2006. Do you remember birds dot MOV?

30:12SPEAKERNo, it was like an early sort of pre viral viral video on the internet. It's it was,

30:18SPEAKERit was made by some art collective in France. I think they're, I think they're French.

30:23SPEAKERIt'll be hard to find. Now, if you search birds dot MOV now, you're just going to get a lot of

30:26SPEAKERbird videos, but it was, it was, it was a, it was this really nice artsy video of a bunch of

30:31SPEAKERslow motion dogs, sort of like flying through the air with like laser lights. Yeah. That came up

30:38SPEAKERrecently. That came up recently and I looked and sure enough, I still had it from 20 years ago.

30:44SPEAKERIt's but it's a, it's a super old QuickTime video encoded in a Sorenson codec, but I was still able

30:50SPEAKERto convert it with FFmpeg to something modern and play it just fine. But you converted it?

30:55SPEAKERWell, no, actually it played, it played out of the box on an MPV. Okay. So it played just fine,

31:00SPEAKERbut I mean, okay. Yes. If we're the letter of the question, are we going to have to keep converting

31:05SPEAKERmedia then yes. Yes. Like wherever and ever. Amen. Common, common players will drop support for old

31:10SPEAKERcodecs and stuff, but there will still be tools around that you'll be able to do that with.

31:14SPEAKERLook, you can't play a CD on the PlayStation 5.

31:18SPEAKERWell, yeah. I mean, that's more a question of hard, like they didn't put the laser in to,

31:21SPEAKERto read a CD though. Like that's more a question of saving either, either saving on the bill of

31:26SPEAKERmaterials or maybe those things are not widely available anymore. Actually. Brad, can you even

31:31SPEAKERplay a DVD on the PS5? I, I don't know. That's a good question actually. Oh, okay. Yes. I got an

31:39SPEAKERanswer. I'm on the support page here. But no CDs. PS5s can play DVDs, Blu-rays, ultra HD Blu-rays,

31:49SPEAKERbut no CDs, which I, again, is I understand is just because they don't have the right kind of

31:53SPEAKERlaser to read them in there. I believe. It won't play BDRs. It won't play eight centimeter disks,

32:00SPEAKERthe little baby disks, like a game cube disk. They want you to think that actually I would,

32:05SPEAKERI would not put a tiny disk in my PS5. You might never get it out again. That's going to be a

32:09SPEAKERproblem. I don't think I've ever used the display or my PS5. I've used it like basically to test

32:15SPEAKERit. I've put a couple of old PS4 games in there that I wanted to dabble with a little bit, but.

32:19SPEAKERAh, I can see that. But, but yes, it's as much as, as much as I decry the looming death of the

32:26SPEAKERoptical drive and video game consoles, like I have to admit they are not widely used for most, for

32:33SPEAKERmost people at this point. Nope. Anyway, neuro flare in the first patron episode, this was a

32:40SPEAKERdeep cut. You mentioned someday asking Toto for washlets to review when you're big enough.

32:47SPEAKERHave you ever asked or, and would you, I have not asked, I don't know about you.

32:51SPEAKERI have not asked. I also am not plumbed appropriately for, I don't have a power

32:55SPEAKERplug in a safe place to put the washlet, to plug the washlet in.

33:00SPEAKERYeah, I definitely, and in this apartment would not be equipped to test such a product.

33:05SPEAKERLook, I also, the other problem I realized I have is I don't think I have enough clearance on either

33:10SPEAKERside of the toilet. Cause our toilet is not to modern code because it was built, the house was

33:14SPEAKERbuilt in 56 and it's real close on both the left and the right. So, yeah, I think the Totos are

33:23SPEAKERpretty narrow, but like those, those bidets that have the arm that comes out on the right side,

33:29SPEAKERwon't fit in our bathroom. Really? That is what we have. Is a washlet is the, in the Toto parlance,

33:36SPEAKERis that an entire toilet? That's not just an add on. It's just the top. It's like, it's like the

33:40SPEAKERlid. It's like lid and seat. It doesn't have to be the entire toilet. Although they certainly will

33:44SPEAKERsell you an entire toilet for upwards of $5,000. If you want to pay that. Yeah. I like the, I like

33:50SPEAKERthe toilets that look like they're not making toilets that don't have a tank on the back. And

33:55SPEAKERthey look like I was, I was thinking it was like RV or houseboat toilets. Yeah. I don't know. It

34:02SPEAKERseems like some, some of these look like they maybe don't look here. Here we are. G four 50

34:06SPEAKERintegrated smart toilet. Yeah. That's a great smart toilet. I mean, what, what? Okay. I mean,

34:14SPEAKERI might, I I'm, I'm thinking I might have to dig up a press contact for this one. I want to know

34:19SPEAKERwhy the toilet smart bread. Yeah. I don't know why I kind of went into this podcast thinking I would

34:25SPEAKERsolicit a lot more products for review or testing than we actually do. And I'm not sure why I've

34:31SPEAKERbacked away from that. The format isn't great for it. Cause a lot of the stuff that you would review

34:36SPEAKERwon't, won't hold a 45 minute or hour long podcast. Like there's not enough to talk about

34:42SPEAKERand, and lacking a video component makes it tough sometimes to show off certain sorts of things we

34:47SPEAKERhave done in the past here and there. Yeah. I don't know. It might be something I had started

34:52SPEAKERpursuing a little more because there's a lot of interesting stuff out there to try and talk about.

34:57SPEAKERYeah. I also also a lot of the stuff that I would be interested in trying, it has some secondary

35:03SPEAKERcosts associated with it. Like somebody was trying to send us, send us smart blinds, which I think

35:09SPEAKERwould actually be really useful to try. Oh yeah. But like installing and doing power and all that

35:15SPEAKERstuff and, and getting the ones that are the right size for your windows, it turns out was fraught.

35:20SPEAKERAnd we have to replace our windows soon. So it's like, you know. Yeah. Power has always been the

35:25SPEAKERhang up for, for me on smart blinds as nice as they would be. I can still pull a cord. Honestly,

35:32SPEAKERit's not that big deal. This a Washlet G450 has the tornado flush system, which is complete with

35:39SPEAKERtheir CEF ion tech to ion barrier glaze. It minimizes sticking debris. Ionized toilet water

35:46SPEAKERis something everybody needs in their life. I just want the toilet to sing a little song when I come

35:50SPEAKERin in the middle of the night and be like, Hey man, I'm ready for you. There's a, there's a,

35:54SPEAKERhere's a question from dairy guy that I meant to read right after that, that kind of external USB

36:00SPEAKERbridge and micro, you know, micro SD cards getting killed by constant rights question.

36:05SPEAKERThis is a good follow up here. Again, dairy guy is the asker here, which is more useful,

36:10SPEAKERa raspberry PI five or a mini PC. Let's say you want to have a Plex media server and run

36:16SPEAKERhome assistant. You can only have one, which one would you buy? I think I might, this is tentative,

36:23SPEAKERbut I might be done getting raspberry PI's because the upward creep of raspberry PI prices and the

36:29SPEAKERdownward kind of the decline of, of cheap, fast X 86 pricing has reached close enough to a convergence

36:37SPEAKERthat I think it actually probably makes more sense to like, you're going to get way more

36:41SPEAKERhorsepower for the money. I'm getting a lot of these, a lot of these little low end, especially

36:47SPEAKERlike fanless X 86 boxes. Like they're definitely still more, but they're not that much more now,

36:51SPEAKERlike when a raspberry PI five, especially with a case and you have to buy the power supply

36:55SPEAKERseparately and everything, it's like well up over a hundred dollars. See, I just make the case.

37:01SPEAKERWell, you can do that, but well, actually, I mean, for a modern one, I don't know that I would

37:06SPEAKERrecommend that these days because the fives is like the fours were on the cusp, but the fives

37:10SPEAKERabsolutely need cooling, like substantial cooling. You can cut fan holes in the laser.

37:17SPEAKERYou could bolt a heat sink and fan on yourself if you want. But I mean like a really good raspberry

37:22SPEAKERPI case is like 20, 30 bucks these days. It's not the end of the world, but the bigger thing

37:27SPEAKERis these little Alder Lake in X 86 boxes are way faster and they have quick sync,

37:32SPEAKERwhich is fantastic for Plex as we've talked about for transcoding. Yeah. And, and like,

37:37SPEAKERthis is the big one to me, the, the Ram and storage is user replaceable and that's where

37:41SPEAKERthe SD card connection comes in. I mean, because those, those, the X 86 boxes take their own,

37:46SPEAKERlike they have user replaceable or not even replaceable. They tend to not come with Ram,

37:50SPEAKERlike you buy your own Ram and they have M.2, they typically have NVME sockets for storage. So

37:58SPEAKERyou can put bigger and more durable storage and more Ram in there than you would get out of a PI.

38:04SPEAKERI think those Beelink mini PCs that I get have Ram soldered on probably.

38:09SPEAKERI'm sure some of those embedded ones do. The ones I'm talking about are the,

38:12SPEAKERlike these are all over all the express and stuff like these are. Yeah. In fact, you, you can,

38:17SPEAKERyou can buy them pre-configured or you can buy them bare with no storage or Ram and add your own.

38:21SPEAKERLike they're, they're, they're just, they're just faster and more expandable for not that much more

38:26SPEAKERmoney these days. For me, this is a, this is a, sometimes one thing is the right thing and

38:30SPEAKERsometimes the other thing is the right thing. Like I still run my PI hole on the, on the Raspberry PI.

38:37SPEAKEROh yeah. Yeah. I mean, my PI hole is a Raspberry PI two that does nothing but run PI hole. Like

38:41SPEAKERthere are certainly still use cases for a tiny low power thing. Yeah. And, and, and to me,

38:46SPEAKERthat's the perfect case. Cause that thing runs all the time. It's like, I don't want to have

38:51SPEAKERthat on a machine that's more likely to fail. Right. And I don't want to, I also don't need

38:59SPEAKERto have a real computer running that cause it's just going to use extra electricity. And as we've

39:02SPEAKERpreviously established, our electricity is crazy expensive here. So, you know, the question here

39:08SPEAKERwas like Plex and Home Assistant, you know, like we're talking something that's probably going to

39:12SPEAKERrun more than one thing. Like you're definitely not going to run Plex on a, on a Raspberry PI.

39:16SPEAKERYeah. But at the same time running Home Assistant on an x86 machine is really hard.

39:20SPEAKERIt is, it is not, it is not very friendly for that kind of stuff in my experience.

39:25SPEAKERYeah. Actually in that case, like Home Assistant is an example of the thing I would put on its own

39:29SPEAKERdevice just because you don't want your lights to stop working if you're like tinkering with

39:33SPEAKERother things. Yeah. And you know, like if you, if you have to reboot the machine or take it down to

39:38SPEAKERmess with something and then somebody else in your house is like, Hey, why can't I turn the light on

39:42SPEAKERanymore? That's not a great situation. Yeah. Home Assistant should be split out to its own,

39:48SPEAKERits own thing, but, but by and large, if you're going to run like a bunch of things on a,

39:52SPEAKERon a little low power thing, I would go for one of those x86 boxes at this point.

39:56SPEAKERYeah. Well, and the nice thing about the Home Assistant stuff is with the plugins,

39:59SPEAKERyou can run, like they have a whole plugin, a community plugin architecture that uses

40:04SPEAKERDocker containers. That's pretty transparent to the user. So like if you have lightweight stuff

40:09SPEAKERthat you want to run, like a, like a WireGuard NAS, WireGuard VPN, or Let's Encrypt certificate

40:20SPEAKERsigning thing, or any of that kind of stuff, you can run that low power stuff inside the Home

40:25SPEAKERAssistant. Like I wouldn't run Pi-hole in there, but pretty much everything else that you would run

40:29SPEAKERon a Raspberry Pi type machine, if you do a Home Assistant Pi 4 or Pi 5 install, you can probably

40:35SPEAKERdo that. And then, and then having the other machine, the x86 machine to run your server stuff

40:42SPEAKERmakes a lot of sense to me, like run real server, like then you can run game servers, you can run

40:46SPEAKERPlex, you can run all of that. And, and the only gate on that is what your Quick Sync supports in

40:52SPEAKERmy experience. It's funny, something's changed on Plex in the recent months. My Plex server is

40:57SPEAKERcomplaining about transcoding again. So I have to look and figure out what's going on with the Quick

41:01SPEAKERSync stuff. Cause it's being janky. Interesting. Always something. There's like, yeah, but sometimes

41:10SPEAKERI w I think I just make more work for myself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Here's a double whammy from

41:16SPEAKERAnnoyed and Tired. Annoyed and Tired is prolific this month. Oh yeah. I guess this is maybe three

41:21SPEAKERquestions. It might be a record. Why are website tabs so RAM dependent? That's the whole question.

41:31SPEAKERYes. Yeah. So in my head, I often think of a website tab as being a thing that's like,

41:38SPEAKERyou know, a megabyte of, of, of, of stuff that you download and, and you know, that's what,

41:46SPEAKERthat's what display I'm thinking about the web in nineties terms. Right now I'm looking at my

41:52SPEAKERFirefox task manager, my process manager in Firefox and my home assistant tab is 172 megs

41:59SPEAKERof memory used my B-link.com tab that I opened up to look up and see if my memory is upgradeable

42:06SPEAKERis 201. Google.com. That's just google.com. The search engine page is 795 megabytes. Oh my God.

42:18SPEAKERThere's another google.com. That's 179. I think that that one, I think the 795 might be aggregating

42:24SPEAKERGmail and drive and a bunch of other stuff. The Google doc. I just opened the task manager for

42:30SPEAKERmy Chrome instance. The Google doc that has all the questions in it for this podcast we're

42:35SPEAKERrecording now is about 300 megabytes. Yeah. We'll see that Toto. Oh, okay. Look,

42:42SPEAKERshout out to Toto. Cause I still have that washlet page open. That's only 60 meg.

42:46SPEAKERThat's paltry. I have Nabu Casa. Oh, that's the worker for receiving notifications from the home

42:56SPEAKERassistant cloud thing is 34 megs. That's my low one. Modern web's a nightmare.

43:00SPEAKERYeah. I mean, look, we're not, we're not web developers. I don't think we can say definitively,

43:05SPEAKERbut like web pages are doing a lot these days. Are they doing what they're doing efficiently?

43:09SPEAKERI'm not here to speak affordatively on that subject. Some people would certainly tell you

43:14SPEAKERthat there is a lot of waste and inefficiency in modern web development practices.

43:21SPEAKERIn fact, there, I bet there are, I bet there are a lot of people on our discord who could

43:23SPEAKERspeak to this question very directly, actually. I mean, just, just, you can always load your

43:28SPEAKERdeveloper tools in your browser, different browsers, call them different things,

43:32SPEAKERbut in Firefox, it's called web developer tools and you get to it by hitting control shift I.

43:36SPEAKERAnd then if you go over to the memory tab, it'll show you, you could take a snapshot and it'll tell

43:42SPEAKERyou what the page is using and why the memory is there. And like, there's a million little,

43:48SPEAKERon this Beelink page, not to pick on Beelink, there's a little tiny section. That's the actual

43:52SPEAKERcontent of the page. And then there's an enormous section. That's all the code that runs on the page.

43:58SPEAKERAnd then there's a reference to a bunch of JavaScript and stuff like that. So like,

44:01SPEAKERit's just a lot of stuff. Like it's, it's, it's kind of ridiculous.

44:06SPEAKERYeah. I, I don't live in this world and I'm very much like kind of an outside looking in,

44:10SPEAKERbut I know there are, there are some moves toward lower level, more efficient code

44:15SPEAKERexecution and web development these days, like web assembly is, I barely understand it, but

44:20SPEAKERweb assembly is effectively an interface to running lower level code and not having to do

44:26SPEAKEReverything through JavaScript. For example, like I know that I would love to hear more about that

44:30SPEAKERfrom people on the discord who know more about it than I do. The radicals are also doing the thing

44:34SPEAKERwhere you just render the page. Like you just write the page and it's all flat pages. People

44:40SPEAKERare back to just flat page generation these days. Just come here. I'm just going to serve you some

44:44SPEAKERHTML. Turns out it's real cheap when you just serve HTML and you're not running a whole load

44:49SPEAKERof code and putting cookies and shit on people's computers. What if, what if you just had to

44:53SPEAKERgenerate a page every so often instead of like at time of request every single time constantly.

44:59SPEAKERLook, we started doing dynamic page generation because everybody wanted comments on and live ads

45:05SPEAKERon the, on the pages. And I'm going to say everything's gotten worse since then. So you

45:10SPEAKERshould just go back to no comments. I don't disagree. Here's the other annoyed and tired

45:15SPEAKERquestion. This is referencing episode 263 when we talked about phone orientation in your pocket.

45:20SPEAKERYeah. They say screen facing out reduces the possibility of the phone being triggered by sweat

45:26SPEAKERphone facing the thigh in the pocket is a great way of screwing up music and even worse with

45:31SPEAKERaudio books. I lock my phone right in my pocket. So it's not a problem. It's not going to unlock

45:36SPEAKERwithout my seeing my face. So I'm pretty cool. Also how sweaty is your pocket? I mean,

45:42SPEAKERsome people exercise. Yeah. Fair. Yes. Yes. I mean, I, I am, I am with them here. I am screen

45:48SPEAKERfacing out all the way. I just, I just think it's like, I would rather not smash my glass.

45:57SPEAKERI'd rather skip the skip music by accident than smash my glass, I guess I just, yeah,

46:02SPEAKERI've never had, I've never run into that, but I, I will allow it. It's possible. I have smashed

46:08SPEAKERback glass on a, on a Google pixel in my pocket before that was a bad day. That was a way it would

46:15SPEAKERhave been way better to smash the front glass on that phone. Cause the back glass was crazy

46:18SPEAKERexpensive for a place. Oh, I've gone caseless. So I pulled the case off of my SE three, finally six

46:25SPEAKERweeks ago or something. It's, it's so thin and tiny and light without a case on it. I've been,

46:30SPEAKERI've been caseless on my 15 tight, whatever the 15 titanium one is. And I'm going to say the

46:36SPEAKERtitanium, like there's usually there's gauges by now in the year. Plus since I've had this phone

46:43SPEAKERfrom where I dropped it on concrete or something, they get a little, it's a little divot. None of

46:46SPEAKERthat. It's fantastic. I love it. All right. Okay. Photos are starting to come out of the SE four

46:52SPEAKERnow, which I'm very excited about. Finally have a modern phone design soon with these square

46:58SPEAKERcorners. Like I, for people who don't know, the SE three is still the iPhone six design.

47:04SPEAKEROh really? Yes. And the rounded I'm I'm so over the rounded edges on that style of phone. And it's

47:10SPEAKERjust, especially with the case off, it's very slippery to hold. On the glass. Does it have

47:14SPEAKERthe rounded glass still? Like the corner chamfers of the glass were round on the six originally,

47:20SPEAKERand it made them real fragile. Yes. That got way better. Yes. I broke a six. Six is the only phone

47:26SPEAKERI've ever broken. Yeah. I don't know what they did to the glass structure or whatever, but they,

47:32SPEAKERthey made the, they made the subsequent versions of that design way more resilient. But I am still,

47:37SPEAKERI am way ready for just like square chunky square corners on a phone that make it easier to hold.

47:43SPEAKERIt's not, I guess it is, it is square. They're still rounded, but they're not like,

47:48SPEAKERit's not like curved. There's an edge. There's an edge to it. The SE four is basically like a

47:53SPEAKERsomewhere between a 14 and a 16 in design. It basically just looks like a modern iPhone.

47:57SPEAKERDoes that mean you're going to be a notch guy, Brad? Let's let's not talk about it.

48:02SPEAKERLet's see. I've actually got another question about this, about phones, about phone designs here

48:08SPEAKERthat I was just reminded of from tactical tug. Do you think we'll see a flagship phone anytime soon

48:14SPEAKERwithout a massive camera bump at the back? No. This annoys me every single time I put the phone

48:19SPEAKERdown on the table, especially if I'm not using a cover and the phone is tilting back and forth,

48:23SPEAKERlike a fishing boat in the middle of the Atlantic. Yeah. I'm with you. That's it sucks. I hate,

48:28SPEAKERI would absolutely rather have a fatter phone that makes the camera flush, especially not using the

48:35SPEAKERcamera on this. The camera on this SE three is tiny, but like most camera bumps are gigantic

48:40SPEAKERthese days. And yes, like not having the phone sit flat really sucks. So let me give you an

48:46SPEAKERinteresting thought. If you put a screen protector on the front of your phone, you just put the glass

48:51SPEAKERside down and then the machine doesn't distract you. Problem solved. Well, my watch is doing all

49:00SPEAKERthe distracting these days anyway, but you got to turn off those notifications. So,

49:04SPEAKERso the camera bump thing is interesting. There's a conversation on, on Mac blogs this week about

49:09SPEAKERwhether USB C and the requirement that the EU has to use that as a charging standard is holding back

49:15SPEAKERthickness on phones. And there's, I think a four millimeter theoretical minimum thickness

49:24SPEAKERto accommodate a USB C connector. So the conversation around it was interesting. I,

49:31SPEAKERGruber had a good post about it that kind of summed the whole thing up. I'm not going to

49:34SPEAKERrepeat it here, but I don't, I don't find the thickness of my phone to be a problem with where

49:41SPEAKERwe are now with the, with the 15, 16 design. I think weight is an issue. I really, I don't

49:48SPEAKERever mind the camera bump because I literally, because the, the, the Sapphire glass on the lenses

49:53SPEAKERis the thing I want to scratch on my phone least. I I've been putting screen side down for years

49:59SPEAKERand I buy a $5 screen protector that I can pull off and replace if it gets too,

50:04SPEAKERbecause the thing on the screen side that makes me crazy are those micro scratches.

50:07SPEAKERSo when you're out in the sun, you see a bazillion little tiny scratches on the,

50:10SPEAKERon the glass of your phone and the screen protector lets me buy my way out of that

50:14SPEAKERproblem for $5 when it annoys me and I replace them probably twice a year.

50:18SPEAKERYeah. The, the constant pursuit of ever thinner devices is just really not something I understand

50:23SPEAKERthough. Like I really, I don't see the value in like, I think I saw that they're working on an

50:28SPEAKEReven thinner iPad than already exists or that's the rumor. And also on the subject of the USB C

50:34SPEAKERthing, I fully, I fully believe that Apple would make a completely portless device if they could

50:39SPEAKERand make you do everything, including charging wirelessly. Well, so that was one of the op that

50:43SPEAKERwas one of the threats is if they were, if they mandate the C port, then they'll just provide a C

50:49SPEAKERadapter. That's a mag safe charger, which is great until you need to plug into a wired car play car

50:55SPEAKERor something like that. And in which case, like they're 20 years away from being able to do that

50:59SPEAKERbecause of the existence of, of, because of the lifespan of cars, frankly. So I think it's probably

51:04SPEAKERokay. I I'm, I am, I am definitely up with you on the, the pursuit of thinness is unnecessary and

51:14SPEAKERoften counter to, to like good human interaction. Like often devices that are too thin are hard to

51:21SPEAKERhold, frankly. So, yeah. Yes. I fully agree with that. And also, I don't know what the

51:27SPEAKERdimensional requirements of batteries are. Like do they, what I'm asking is kind of battery expand on

51:32SPEAKERany individual access and get more capacity like for the most part is a, is a, is a thicker battery

51:37SPEAKERjust as good as a wider battery, for example, because it's about volume, not, not linear

51:42SPEAKERdimensions. Yeah. Right. So, so if that's the case, then if a thicker phone also meant more

51:47SPEAKERbattery life than like, absolutely sign me up. I don't have really my house. So I don't really

51:51SPEAKERcare that much about battery life these days. I don't, I don't have a problem with my current

51:54SPEAKERbattery life, but I'm, I'm the same as you. I work from home, so it kind of doesn't matter,

51:57SPEAKERbut still it would be a nice option. It was so funny when we went to see Taylor Swift,

52:01SPEAKERit was the first time my wife has been in a, in a, Hey, I'm going to be out of the house

52:07SPEAKERaway from charging and watch people to use my phone situation since she got this phone a year

52:14SPEAKERago. And she was really, really worried about battery life, shooting video and stuff like that.

52:20SPEAKERI was like, I think you're probably gonna be fine, but we carried a bunch of battery backups

52:23SPEAKERand stuff with us. And it turns out we were totally fine. But, but it's, it's interesting

52:28SPEAKERbecause when you don't do outside stuff a ton, that battery life becomes a real, it's, it's like,

52:35SPEAKERI don't have a good grasp of how good my battery life is at this point on this phone. To the point

52:41SPEAKERthat I often have it locked to only charge 80% because I don't ever need more than that.

52:47SPEAKEROh, I, yeah, I should probably do that. I don't have that turned on.

52:51SPEAKERYou keep your phone long enough that matters. I usually don't do it with the new phone. It can be

52:56SPEAKERa test. Yes, I probably should. Also, I really shouldn't get into it here. This is inspired by,

53:02SPEAKERthis is inspired by Vinny and also some people on the next lender discord. I'm going to switch

53:05SPEAKERcarriers by the time we record again next. Yeah. Cause you guys had a deal through your

53:11SPEAKERold employer and I bet it's not a good deal anymore. It's not a good deal. The price has

53:15SPEAKERcrept up so much that like, even with the, it was not, it was like an 8% discount or something. It

53:19SPEAKERwas not even amazing to begin with, but like my Verizon bill has just gone up and up and up.

53:24SPEAKERSo I'm going to, I'm going to switch to one of the like MVNOs, you know, one of the

53:28SPEAKERsmaller areas that piggybacks on the big guys infrastructure. You're going to get that boost.

53:34SPEAKERI don't know. Haven't decided who I'm going to switch to yet, but that is, that is a project

53:39SPEAKERfor this weekend is to cut my phone bill by about 75%. So, so which is exciting to me.

53:45SPEAKERI was looking at that. We're paying like 200 bucks a month and it feels like too much.

53:48SPEAKERIt's insane. Like I'm, I'm paying almost 80 a month for one line. Like that's, that is just

53:52SPEAKERlike what? Well, and, and like, so we're, we're, I've stayed with Verizon because we're on one of

53:57SPEAKERthe old family plans, which means we pay X amount for a bucket of data. And then we pay 10 bucks a

54:03SPEAKERmonth or 20 bucks a month for a line, depending on whether it's a phone or a watch. But, but like,

54:09SPEAKERI don't, I want an unlimited plan because A, I'm tired of having to like, Gina's phone went haywire

54:15SPEAKERthe other day and downloaded 11 gigs of data in like a three hour period and kind of blew through

54:21SPEAKERour, our limit for the month. So now everybody else's it's famine on the downhill side of this,

54:26SPEAKERof this, of this, this thing. And like, I don't know why I should have to deal with this. And

54:31SPEAKERsince Verizon doesn't offer family plans anymore for me to get out of this, I would have to pay $240

54:38SPEAKERfor three phone lines for $80 a month, which is too much. Oh, well, let's table this. Maybe we

54:44SPEAKERshould revisit this in more of an episodic format on the other side of it. Cause maybe this seems

54:50SPEAKERlike this is like good actionable stuff that people should hear about. I would love to hear

54:54SPEAKERyour findings. Yeah. Hey, I don't know if you've heard, but phone bills are too much. Well, cause

54:58SPEAKERthe other thing is like I switched to Verizon in the, in the, like in the tested days, actually,

55:03SPEAKERwhen we were going to PAX and comic con and stuff like that. And the phones AT&T didn't work,

55:07SPEAKERbut Verizon did because Verizon had invested in capacity for venues. Yeah. And I don't ever go to

55:12SPEAKERthose things anymore. So like, you know, capacity coverage was the reason I moved to Verizon from

55:19SPEAKERAT&T as well. Some of the carriers, some of the carriers out there lease infrastructure from

55:25SPEAKERmultiple of the big companies. Like some of them, some of them let you choose between like, Hey,

55:30SPEAKERwe have AT&T and T-Mobile or we have Verizon and AT&T like we're all three. So you can both pick

55:35SPEAKERyour network and also switch to a different one probably month to month. If you find the one you're

55:39SPEAKERon is not great. The one thing I will say about Verizon is that they have done a good job with the

55:44SPEAKERsecurity stuff so that if somebody tries to hijack my SIM, I get a note. Yeah. Like that is the thing

55:50SPEAKERto, okay. So you went out, we're just cannibalizing a future episode. Let's do an episode. This is

55:56SPEAKERgreat. Like the lower, like lack of frills and maybe questions about infrastructure and account

56:00SPEAKERmanagement and stuff like those, those are where a smaller carrier would differ, but we'll, we'll

56:05SPEAKERmaybe get back to this when we have experience with it. This is a buttload of questions, Brad.

56:10SPEAKERYeah, it really is. How about we do a couple more here? Actually, there's a couple of CPU ones I

56:14SPEAKERwanted to do. Yeah. I'm an expert now. I've done a lot of, I've actually spent more time with CPU

56:18SPEAKERtesting this year than I have in my entire life up until this point. Wow. Yeah. All right. Skip asks,

56:24SPEAKERwhen does the extra cash on the Ryzen X3 CPUs come into play? Obviously more is better, but what

56:30SPEAKERactivities benefit the most from the additional cash? Should, should gamers care about it? Does

56:34SPEAKERit mean smoother streams or faster renders on audio or video production workloads? This is random.

56:40SPEAKERAlso, will we see either of you as VTubers anytime soon? Okay. Okay. On the last point,

56:45SPEAKERI'm going to say for my part, probably not. When I was doing Foo, one of the things that we did

56:51SPEAKERas a prototype for somebody was what they didn't call it a VTuber back then here, but what would

56:56SPEAKERhave been a VTuber interface. So there is a VTuber version of me, not, I'm not like animated up and

57:02SPEAKERlike cat girl or whatever, but, but there's a virtual version of me that runs that can green,

57:08SPEAKERthat can give an alpha video. So you can superimpose a version of me, they run a virtual

57:14SPEAKERliving room or on a, I'm never going to dig that up again though. It required a bunch of VR stuff

57:19SPEAKERto work. I was going to say, you should release that under creative commons and let people have

57:23SPEAKERat it. No, thank you. That is a bad idea. Yeah. To answer the actual question here,

57:29SPEAKERit is almost entirely for games. There are a handful of benchmarking workloads that include

57:35SPEAKERa lot of V cash that will benefit from a buttload of VP cash, but it's, it's they're unusual and

57:40SPEAKERyeah, games is it. Yeah. And, and, and even within the games subsets it, it manifests in a lot of

57:47SPEAKERplaces, you know, like a lot of standard 3d games, first person shooters and stuff in some cases

57:51SPEAKERbenefit noticeably from the V cash, but the, or the, the, the extra cash, but the one place you

57:58SPEAKERreally see it just go through the stratosphere is like strategy games. Like anything, anything that

58:02SPEAKERis hitting that cash a lot. And that tends to be stuff like, like factorio or, or X games,

58:08SPEAKERsomething that is like, you know, I lack the, I lack the low level programming vocabulary to

58:12SPEAKERdescribe this well, but you know, something that is like executing a lot of code, doing a lot of

58:16SPEAKERsimulation where the CPU is going to be hitting the cash, like kind of constantly like something

58:21SPEAKERlike if you look at benchmarks for something like factorio, it's like, it's something insane,

58:26SPEAKERlike, you know, 60 or 80% faster on the cash part. So I'm opening up our benchmarks from the,

58:34SPEAKERfrom the 9,800 X 3d review and like, like Cinebench numbers are pretty much the same,

58:44SPEAKERright? Like there's a tiny, tiny variance, but when you look at, when you look into even a non

58:52SPEAKERnon like cyberpunk saw a pretty good lift, right? It's it's like a, yeah, it's a substantial lift.

58:59SPEAKERIt's like 10%, 15%. For more kind of standard action games, it seems, it seems much more engine

59:05SPEAKERdependent in that case, you know, like some, some games and some engines benefit enormously from it.

59:10SPEAKERSome don't see a whole lot of lift and I forget which is which like, like Far Cry, for example,

59:14SPEAKERI don't, I don't remember why, but Far Cry was seen in a lot of benchmarks because it was either

59:18SPEAKERone or the other of those. I forget which it was. Yeah, I think, I think that's, I think that's

59:23SPEAKERright. It's it's really part of the reason a lot of cash helps with games is because games are often

59:31SPEAKERmemory bandwidth limited. And if you have more cash than you can store more stuff in the, in the

59:36SPEAKERmemory on the chip, which is much faster to like a couple of orders of magnitude faster to access

59:42SPEAKERthan system RAM. And that's the, that's the, that's the big thing. So if you have a memory

59:47SPEAKERbandwidth limited benchmark, that's going to show you a bigger boost on the V cash. This is why the,

59:53SPEAKERthe risens with two CCDs, one that has V cash and one that doesn't are, are kind of best of

59:58SPEAKERboth worlds for, for games and productivity stuff, because a lot of productivity stuff

1:00:04SPEAKERis benefit benefit. The, the stuff where performance matters on productivity

1:00:08SPEAKERbenefits typically from having a lot more cores and more clock speed and more clock speed.

1:00:14SPEAKERThe V cash then gives you the boost in the, in the memory bandwidth limited stuff,

1:00:19SPEAKERwhich is like I said, mostly games. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the short version,

1:00:23SPEAKERif you're just looking at something to buy is if you, if you were primarily building a game machine,

1:00:26SPEAKERyou should get an X3D. Like that's just kind of, that's the blanket recommendation.

1:00:30SPEAKERSo I I'm, I want to test with the, the nine, we, we haven't seen the, the two CCD V cash chips from

1:00:38SPEAKERAMD yet from the Zen, from the Zen 5 launch yet. I'm really curious because I think one of the

1:00:44SPEAKERthings I noticed moving from a 24 core Intel CPU to this eight core AMD CPU is that I noticed CPU

1:00:53SPEAKERchugging a lot with only eight cores. And I'm, I want, I'm, I'm working. One of the things I'm

1:00:59SPEAKERworking on for PC world right now is figuring out ways to test that and quantify that feeling.

1:01:03SPEAKERSo if people have suggestions, I would love to hear that. I know there's a lot of people who

1:01:07SPEAKERthink about this kind of stuff as well. But, but yeah, I'm I think, I think there's something there

1:01:14SPEAKERbecause I feel like even in games, I'm seeing games that are spiking eight cores now on PC,

1:01:20SPEAKERlike Outlaws and Indiana Jones and some of the higher end single players things will,

1:01:26SPEAKERwill hit all the cores, even when you're not doing shader processing and stuff like that. So.

1:01:30SPEAKERYeah. When, when you say chugging, you're just talking about things bogging down in general.

1:01:34SPEAKERYeah. I'm talking about you click a button. I'm I'm used to my desktop computer, clicking it,

1:01:38SPEAKERclicking something and having it happen pretty much instantly. And there's times when that is

1:01:43SPEAKERdefinitely not the case on the eight core machine. Yeah. That is, I mean, granted I use this machine

1:01:48SPEAKERfor a lot of things at once. Like I, I am in some pretty heavy multitasking situations when we're

1:01:53SPEAKERlike streaming and I'm running 800 different things, but I have, that's why I, that is exactly

1:01:57SPEAKERwhy I have always prioritized more cores in this, in the modern era over faster clocks or some,

1:02:02SPEAKERsomething that like drills down to just game performance. I will always sacrifice that in

1:02:07SPEAKERfavor of having more cores, because like you said, like, no matter what I'm doing and no matter how

1:02:11SPEAKERmuch I'm doing, I want something to respond instantly. As soon as I do it, like I don't

1:02:16SPEAKERever want to have to wait in a heavy multitasking situation for things to go. So I, I am, I'm pretty

1:02:21SPEAKERheavy all in on, on more cores these days, but, but also like for just a gaming machine, not quite

1:02:26SPEAKERas, not quite as dire, but like you're saying, maybe it is getting a little more demanding.

1:02:31SPEAKERWell, and I'm looking at like, I'm looking at task manager on this machine with eight cores

1:02:35SPEAKERand I'm seeing like 23, 25, 26% CPU utilization while I'm literally in a video call and recording

1:02:42SPEAKERaudio and have a browser with like, you know, realistically it's too many tabs open, but this

1:02:49SPEAKERshouldn't be a problem. Do you mean across all cores? Like all the cores are doing something?

1:02:53SPEAKERIt's across all the cores. Like my, when I look at the, when I look at the process tab, hold on,

1:03:01SPEAKERI've lost my window here. When I look at the processes tab and I sort by CPU, the number at

1:03:07SPEAKERthe top is 30, between 22 and 31%, depending on what's going on and how many windows I'm opening

1:03:12SPEAKERand closing. Yeah. I'm on, I'm on a 14,900 K and I've got quite a few cores doing nothing right now

1:03:17SPEAKERin a similar situation. I mean, I definitely have idle. Well, no, actually I have, everything is

1:03:22SPEAKERdoing a little tiny bit. Yeah. So yeah, I, I, more cores is good. 9950 X3D or bust. That's what I say.

1:03:29SPEAKERYeah. I like, I like a lot of, a lot of cores, a lot of CPUs. Okay. The other CPU question is from

1:03:35SPEAKERiamhydrogen. On CPUs, what makes something like a Ryzen 5700 better than a Ryzen 2700?

1:03:42SPEAKERThe chips are fairly similar clock speeds and they both have eight cores. So what makes it

1:03:46SPEAKERworth upgrading? I don't know if the 5700 is a good chip, just the idea of chips several

1:03:51SPEAKERgenerations newer, but with similar basic specs. Like it really comes down to implementation. Like

1:03:56SPEAKERit really, it comes down to how the chips internally are doing what they do to be CPUs.

1:04:03SPEAKERThat's a very vague answer. Well, I mean, some newer chips will do more work per cycle,

1:04:09SPEAKERper clock cycle or capable of doing not just in terms of number of threads and number of cores,

1:04:13SPEAKERbut inside those threads, you know, each thread is a pipeline that's many, many

1:04:18SPEAKERsets of instructions deep, right? There's many, many registers and stuff in between

1:04:22SPEAKERwhere electrons go in and where electrons come out. They don't, I guess they don't really come

1:04:25SPEAKERout. But anyway, the other thing is the process sizes change. So from 2,600, from, let's see,

1:04:34SPEAKERI'm looking up Ryzen 2,600. I don't remember what the process was for that, but it was,

1:04:38SPEAKERit was probably like, I don't know. It was, it's a long time ago. You're going to generate less.

1:04:45SPEAKERLike 14, 14 nanometer maybe. Yeah, that would be my, that's what I was going to guess, but.

1:04:50SPEAKEROr maybe even bigger than that. Of course, of course here, he's asking about ships that are

1:04:53SPEAKERroughly the same speed. You know, like, like when we're talking, we're talking the same clock speed,

1:04:57SPEAKERa smaller process is more about limiting heat. Well, yeah, but they will generate more heat or

1:05:03SPEAKERthey'll run at higher speeds, one or the other. And, and the, the other thing is you get extra

1:05:08SPEAKERstuff. Like there's new, there's new instruction sets that are added as time goes on. There's

1:05:13SPEAKERsupport for things like AV1 in the, in the codex, which sometimes is on the CPU. Sometimes that's

1:05:18SPEAKERon the GPU. The, on the Ryzen side on machines that have graphics built in, the integrated

1:05:25SPEAKERgraphics have increased dramatically. And then the other thing about the Ryzen 2 and 3 series

1:05:31SPEAKERis that their compatibility with memory has gotten much less fiddly in the, like the Ryzen 3 3600

1:05:38SPEAKERthat I have here is the fiddliest machine I've ever had for Ram. I have one stick of Ram that

1:05:43SPEAKERworks right in that. And if I try to do dual channel ever, it just doesn't work. So, well,

1:05:47SPEAKERthat sounds fun. I think just kind of looking at the language of the question, I think, I think

1:05:51SPEAKERreally what they're drilling down on is when, when everything else is like for like, you know,

1:05:55SPEAKERwhen you're talking the same clock speed, same number of cores, same everything except

1:05:58SPEAKERand do regeneration, why is it shipped faster? I think it probably helps to understand the meaning

1:06:03SPEAKERof the word architecture here, because that word gets thrown around a lot about CPUs and GPUs for

1:06:08SPEAKERthat matter. There are actually two types of architectures that work here. There is the

1:06:12SPEAKERinstruction set architecture, which is x86 in this case, like that's just kind of like the language

1:06:17SPEAKERthe chip speaks, you know, and, and basic operations it's capable of. The micro architecture

1:06:22SPEAKERis what we're talking about. If you're saying like, like Skylake on the Intel side or Zen 3 or

1:06:27SPEAKERZen 4, those are micro architectures. And that's basically just an implementation of the instruction

1:06:32SPEAKERset. So Skylake is one generation of CPU design that Intel generated to execute x86 instructions.

1:06:41SPEAKERAnd like, like you said, like you said, it's an internal layout of stuff, you know,

1:06:46SPEAKERSilicon fixed function instruction implementation, like other, other mechanisms that you and I

1:06:51SPEAKERbarely understand. Like we've talked about branch prediction in the past, a few months ago,

1:06:54SPEAKERif you remember that. There's an incredibly complicated internals. I am months late here,

1:07:01SPEAKERbut some people on the discord actually corrected me on, if you remember me talking about that

1:07:05SPEAKERbefore I had said branch prediction was, Hey, the CPU like calculates multiple versions of an

1:07:12SPEAKERoperation and then takes whichever result was the one that was needed. Apparently I got that wrong

1:07:17SPEAKERwhat it actually does because, I mean, this makes sense because it's Silicon is fixed function. It

1:07:22SPEAKERcan only do so many things at one time, right? What it's actually doing is guessing which

1:07:25SPEAKERoperation it's going to have to carry out and executing that one. And if it turned out to pick

1:07:31SPEAKERthe wrong operation in the beginning, then it has to go back and do the right one after that. So

1:07:35SPEAKERthat's, I think there's a term for that. It's like, it's like a, like a prediction miss basically.

1:07:40SPEAKERSo it's actually even less efficient to miss the prediction, but that's getting in the weeds a

1:07:45SPEAKERlittle bit, but the point I'm making is that like, there's all kinds of stuff going on inside the CPU

1:07:49SPEAKERto make it faster, to execute instructions more efficiently or carry out operations more

1:07:54SPEAKERefficiently. And that changes generation to generation from one micro architecture to the next.

1:07:59SPEAKERSo then there's other stuff too. Like you add support for newer memory standards and

1:08:04SPEAKERnewer PCI express standards and things like that. So different kinds of connections get faster.

1:08:09SPEAKERI found some benchmarks from Gollum.de, which is a site that does a lot of benchmarking in German.

1:08:15SPEAKERThey did around the time of the 5800X launch, not the X3D part. They compared

1:08:22SPEAKERRyzen 7 1800X, 2700X, 3800X, and 5800X, which are all eight core 16 thread parts.

1:08:30SPEAKERAnd the clock speeds range between 3.6 and 3.8 gigahertz for a base clock

1:08:37SPEAKERbetween 4.1 and 4.7. And so these percentage increases are from the 1800X to the newer chips.

1:08:46SPEAKERSo the generation to generation of the 1800X to the 2700X is 116%. So it's 16% faster.

1:08:57SPEAKERFrom the 1800X to the 3800X, it's 28% faster. And from the 1800X to the 5800X, it's 189% faster.

1:09:09SPEAKERSo they're like 20-ish percent gen over gen, but from gen one to gen four or gen three, it's 189.

1:09:18SPEAKERIt's almost twice as fast for the same clocks. And that's in applications. In gaming, it was similar.

1:09:25SPEAKERIt was 123, 148, and 184% lift from first gen to second, well, to zen plus to zen two and zen three.

1:09:37SPEAKER- Right, yeah. And you can look for that when the CPU reviews come out of new generations,

1:09:41SPEAKERlike it'll typically be referred to as like IPC improvement, instructions per clock,

1:09:46SPEAKERis how it's often referred to. And that's typically the kind of like apples to apples,

1:09:51SPEAKERhere's how much faster on one core this is than the previous generation.

1:09:55SPEAKER- I think this is why people were... So early in the architecture, we saw a lot of gen over gen

1:10:02SPEAKERlift. That 16-28% lift from generation to generation is pretty atypical the longer you

1:10:10SPEAKERstay in an architecture, in a basic structure of your CPU. A lot of that was because they figured

1:10:18SPEAKERout, hey, the chiplet design that AMD uses for the Ryzen, it turns out there were some complications

1:10:28SPEAKERthat were weird bottlenecks, and they were adjusting the bottlenecks each generation with

1:10:32SPEAKERwhat they'd learned from the previous stuff and so on and so forth, so.

1:10:34SPEAKER- Yeah, like zen three in particular was a huge lift over zen two in that regard. So that was the

1:10:39SPEAKERthing that got me looking at AMD in the modern era. And that was also the thing Intel was really

1:10:44SPEAKERblowing it on for pretty much from like Skylake or from like sixth to like 10th,

1:10:52SPEAKER11th gen, Intel was doing like single digit percentage IPC increase per generation because

1:10:59SPEAKERthey had no real competition and they were just kind of churning out the same chip over and over.

1:11:04SPEAKERAnyway, nice to see competition in the CPU space. - Yeah, it's really good.

1:11:08SPEAKER- All right, let's wrap up with a quick cake batter minute here.

1:11:12SPEAKER- Okay. - Got a couple. I find it really

1:11:15SPEAKERannoying that the new Department of Energy El Capitan supercomputer shares the same name with

1:11:20SPEAKEROS X El Capitan. So now I'm constantly wondering why an old ass version of OS X is in the news.

1:11:25SPEAKER- This annoyed me too. - I have to say I don't love like

1:11:30SPEAKERproduct code names are cool or I mean, these aren't even code names. They're part of their

1:11:33SPEAKERshipping names, but Apple's whole like national parks in California thing or like notable

1:11:38SPEAKERgeographic locations in California is like probably the most boring product name/codename

1:11:45SPEAKERI have ever seen. Like remember the big cats? - Well, they ran out of them.

1:11:49SPEAKER- I know, but like you could have come up with something better than this, like Panther.

1:11:53SPEAKER- They could have done Panther 2, Panther Harder. - Like Leopard.

1:11:56SPEAKER- Panther-er. - I love the idea of like

1:11:59SPEAKERLeopard Snow Leopard 2 would have been way better. I just, I mean, like High Sierra, El Capitan,

1:12:07SPEAKERSequoia, like just not doing it for me. - And that also led to my least favorite

1:12:13SPEAKERconferringy joke of all time. We're introducing OS X Weed because Weed is a California and

1:12:20SPEAKERit's a city in like the Norther, Northeastern, North middle part of California.

1:12:24SPEAKER- Yeah. I also miss the OS X name for that matter, but it's not OS X anymore.

1:12:29SPEAKER- No. - I think it's OS 15 now.

1:12:32SPEAKER- Really? - I believe 15 is the newest,

1:12:35SPEAKERyes. I have to go check my MacBook, but I'm pretty sure the newest one is 15.

1:12:40SPEAKER- I like the Intel code names actually. I think they're really good because they use

1:12:44SPEAKERrivers and lakes and things like that in the Northwest and there's an infinite number of

1:12:49SPEAKERthose. So they're never going to run out. - Yeah. I don't know. I mean, they're fine.

1:12:53SPEAKERGeography is just kind of boring in general. There's so much, there's so much more you could do.

1:12:56SPEAKER- Well, but when I drive by Klamath Falls, I think about the Pentium 3 and that makes me happy.

1:13:01SPEAKER- Yeah. All right. Fine. Fair. I don't know what I would pick. You know,

1:13:05SPEAKERwe did that FOS pod talking to Jonathan from Debian, you know, they use Toy Story characters

1:13:10SPEAKERfor their releases. There's a lot you could do. - The Android doing things that were sweet was bad.

1:13:17SPEAKERLike, and then there were product tie-ins for that. That was unfortunate. Like,

1:13:20SPEAKERyeah. I just put a number, man. - Yeah. I, yes. I like, like, you know,

1:13:25SPEAKERI run Debian and I have just gone to referring to it as Debian 12 and Debian 13 and not, you know,

1:13:30SPEAKERBookworm and Trixie. - Well, Debian also does the, the, has the numbering

1:13:35SPEAKERscheme based on the year and the month that it's released. So that's easy to understand.

1:13:39SPEAKER- No, that's Ubuntu. Debian is just traditional versioned, like 12.1, 12.2.

1:13:44SPEAKER- Oh, Debian doesn't do the year and the month? - I'm trying to think which distros do that.

1:13:48SPEAKER- Ubuntu does it for sure. - Ubuntu. Yeah. But they also

1:13:52SPEAKERhave their weird alliteration thing, you know, jammy jellyfish or...

1:13:54SPEAKER- Yeah, I hate that. - Which I'm not a fan of. And those are not even,

1:13:58SPEAKERlike, directly alphabetical. So I always have to look up which version is which. It's, yeah. No,

1:14:03SPEAKERmaybe, maybe naming things is hard actually. - I mean, look, I always name things with

1:14:09SPEAKERplaceholder names and then they end up being the real name and I'm disappointed by it. So...

1:14:13SPEAKER- Yeah. - You know, I'm bad at names.

1:14:15SPEAKERDon't ask me about this. - I should know this cause I'm

1:14:18SPEAKERrunning Ubuntu containers in various places. But yeah, you're right. Like Ubuntu does like 24.04,

1:14:23SPEAKER24.10. - Yeah. Well, it's always

1:14:25SPEAKERApril and October because that's when they do releases. Yeah.

1:14:28SPEAKER- Yeah. For their April and October releases. - Well, there's also hidden information in there

1:14:32SPEAKERcause you have to know that it's, I think it's always the October one that's an LTS usually.

1:14:36SPEAKER- No, it's the April. - Every other year or something.

1:14:38SPEAKER- So LTS is only every two years, I think. Yeah. It's the even numbered years in April are the

1:14:45SPEAKERUbuntu LTS releases. The October ones are like noted to be less stable.

1:14:50SPEAKER- And they put LTS at the end of those version numbers too, right?

1:14:54SPEAKER- Yeah. They make it really obvious which ones are LTS.

1:14:56SPEAKER- Yeah. - Where you get the way Debian,

1:15:02SPEAKERwhat's the term for this? Like the way Debian kind of demotes old versions. Like you have, you know,

1:15:07SPEAKERyou have stable. - Oh yeah.

1:15:09SPEAKER- And then once a new stable comes out, the previous stable becomes old stable.

1:15:13SPEAKER- Yeah. - And the previous old

1:15:15SPEAKERstable becomes old, old stable. - Look, I like that.

1:15:18SPEAKER- And like when you're like managing your app sources and like looking in there like

1:15:22SPEAKERpackage tracker, it's literally old, old stable, all one word, no spaces. Like that's the code name

1:15:28SPEAKERfor it. It's like, man, they really just bolted this thing together with chewing gum over time,

1:15:33SPEAKERdidn't they? - Well, I don't, I actually, I think that that's smart because you look at old,

1:15:37SPEAKERold stable and you know that it's three versions back, right?

1:15:39SPEAKER- Yeah. You're not wrong. Like it definitely sends a message like, hey,

1:15:42SPEAKERyou probably shouldn't be running this unless you really need to be running this one.

1:15:45SPEAKER- And is old, old stable though the final step before being deprecated or is there like old,

1:15:51SPEAKERold, old, old, old, old stable? - I don't, there's no old,

1:15:54SPEAKERold, old stable that I know of, but they have, they've like contracted or I don't even know if

1:15:59SPEAKERthere's money changing hands or not, but there is like an external group that now does like extra

1:16:04SPEAKERlong-term support for very old Debian releases. - Okay.

1:16:08SPEAKER- Yeah. Support in the open source world is interesting because it's like a resource problem,

1:16:11SPEAKERright? Because you've- - Of course.

1:16:13SPEAKER- You're all volunteer, you've only got so much manpower.

1:16:16SPEAKER- It's not all volunteer, but it's mostly volunteer.

1:16:19SPEAKER- Yeah, yeah. But like, you know, you really have to make like hard choices about when to cut off

1:16:24SPEAKERsupport for old versions. So like how they all handle that is kind of like a fun management

1:16:28SPEAKERproblem. All right. Last question real quick. Also kick better. I can't read analog clocks. Is this

1:16:35SPEAKERa me thing or a generational thing? Will, can your daughter read an analog clock?

1:16:39SPEAKER- My daughter can read an analog clock, but we had to actively teach her.

1:16:42SPEAKER- Okay. Yeah. - Cause they just, I mean,

1:16:44SPEAKERI think they did it in school, but they spent like five minutes one day and, and like everybody else

1:16:49SPEAKERwas, so he also put an analog clock in her room when she was really little. So that unlocked

1:16:55SPEAKERinformation for her. - I think, I think everybody should have a couple of analog clocks in the house

1:16:59SPEAKERjust to keep sharp. - I, I love analog clocks.

1:17:03SPEAKERWhen I was working with folks in different time zones, I would set the, I would, I have a couple

1:17:09SPEAKERup on the wall behind me that are set to whatever time zones is the people I work in easily. So I

1:17:14SPEAKERcan look, I can just glance at them and know whether I'm being rude when I send a message

1:17:17SPEAKERto somebody or sometimes be 12 hours off from being rude. If I, if I mess up the conversion,

1:17:26SPEAKERbut yeah, it's analog clocks are good. I was gonna say, I can see people having an information

1:17:33SPEAKERprocessing problem with analog clocks though, because it's, it's a difficult interface.

1:17:38SPEAKER- That's, I mean, yeah, I don't know. It's not that, I find it fairly intuitive once you

1:17:43SPEAKERunderstand the system. I don't know. It's like, it's like, it's like big in the media these days,

1:17:47SPEAKERlike, oh, Gen Z can't tell time on analog clocks anymore. And I don't know how overblown that is.

1:17:53SPEAKER- Gen X were a bunch of wasted losers. Gen, millennials are never gonna, look,

1:18:00SPEAKERthey're pissing away all their money on avocado toast instead of saving money to buy houses.

1:18:04SPEAKERGen alpha are a bunch of raging malcontents who are nothing but socialists and don't want to work.

1:18:09SPEAKERThis is the same bullshit they turn out every 10 years for a new, new generation of kids.

1:18:14SPEAKERGen Z doesn't understand file systems or analog clocks. I don't know, but at the same time,

1:18:18SPEAKERlike there's, this is, this might be my most like dangerously boomer opinion,

1:18:23SPEAKERbut it feels like there is a little bit of a crisis of helplessness out there these days where

1:18:27SPEAKERlike, I don't know, something like reading an analog clock is so imminently knowable. If you

1:18:31SPEAKERjust go look up how to do it, like, I think, or here, let me put this a different way. I think

1:18:37SPEAKERcuriosity is a muscle that can be developed and strengthened and honed. And it's good to just get

1:18:43SPEAKERin the habit of going to a search engine and just typing like, how do I blank?

1:18:47SPEAKERBut what if the search engine gives you bad AI results that are untrue?

1:18:51SPEAKERThat is absolutely a crucial problem in this age, for sure.

1:18:54SPEAKERSo Shags had a question at the top of the list that was about this. And I think,

1:19:01SPEAKERI think this is, this might be a generational thing, but I, I think that like, look, I think

1:19:10SPEAKERthe challenge, one of the challenges I think that my, I, my daughter has that we didn't have to deal

1:19:14SPEAKERwith until we were a lot older is that she's growing up in a world where there's infinite

1:19:18SPEAKERentertainment, right? So we've talked about this a little bit before, but teaching her how to manage

1:19:24SPEAKERthat and how to not just fall down the Netflix hole infinitely is, is, has been an important

1:19:29SPEAKERpart of, of her childhood. That's exactly what I'm getting at, you know, or like when the TikTok band

1:19:35SPEAKERwas temporarily looming, you saw people going like, well, how am I going to discover new music

1:19:38SPEAKERnow? You know, it's like, there are other avenues for discovering things like that. Like, like,

1:19:43SPEAKERlike, I'm not saying this stuff to be critical. It's more like an effort at empowerment, you know,

1:19:46SPEAKERlike, it's like, like, Hey, you, you are capable of going out and finding things and like teaching

1:19:50SPEAKERyourself to do things. And like, that's a very, that's a very good feeling when you,

1:19:54SPEAKERwhen you realize like, Hey, I can do this. Like, I don't have to just like, feel like I can't.

1:19:58SPEAKERSo I think for like, like a lot of stuff, this is a place that working in VR helped me. I,

1:20:05SPEAKERI did not fully appreciate the, the level to which human experience is a spectrum

1:20:11SPEAKERuntil I started working in VR and did a bunch of VR demos and saw how different

1:20:15SPEAKERpeople reacted to the same stimuli. And some people really it's, it's Zach Gage who makes

1:20:22SPEAKERPuzmo and made Spelltower and a bunch of those were like, also good Sudoku and a bunch of good

1:20:26SPEAKERword games has done talks about this. Some people really love being presented with novel problems,

1:20:35SPEAKERlike two problems that they don't understand the framing of and have to figure out the framing and

1:20:39SPEAKERhow to solve that problem. And, and then, and then doing that, some people really love and respond

1:20:45SPEAKERreally positively to problems that they like repeated, repeated problems, like, like problems

1:20:52SPEAKERthat are normalized, they understand the scope and the constraints of them and then how to solve

1:20:57SPEAKERthem. And then the, the, the value is in repeating that solve as efficiently as possible. And those

1:21:03SPEAKERare like, like, just like the ability to detect frame rate changes in a video game, which is

1:21:08SPEAKERanother thing that some people are really good at and some people are bad at.

1:21:13SPEAKERLike your desire to solve those types of different types of problems varies widely from person to

1:21:19SPEAKERperson. So like, I totally see a world where somebody has a mental physical, like, like,

1:21:25SPEAKERlike they have a mental processing problem with reading the analog position on the clock. Cause

1:21:30SPEAKERlike if you're bad at left from right or whatever, your clock doesn't have numbers on it. It just

1:21:33SPEAKERhas data. Like there's a bunch of terrible design analog clocks out there. Like look at what Swatch

1:21:39SPEAKERdid in the nineties. They had watches that didn't have marks. They had watches that had one hand,

1:21:43SPEAKERthey Swatch internet time while fantastic and unimpeachable also was problematic.

1:21:49SPEAKERNot, not a fan of weird, minimal, abstract analog clock face designs, but like,

1:21:53SPEAKERlike cooking is a great example for me of what you're talking about of something that like, I'd,

1:21:57SPEAKERI'm not, I'm not great at cooking and I'm pretty intimidated by it. And like at some point,

1:22:02SPEAKERlargely out of necessity, I was just like, all right, this is pathetic. I've got to learn to

1:22:05SPEAKERmake a few basic dishes so I can like sustain myself. And like, I guess that falls into the

1:22:11SPEAKERcategory you were talking about of like repetition in that case, because like you sure can, you sure

1:22:16SPEAKERcan fuck up a recipe the first time you look it up and try it. But like, you kind of just have to eat

1:22:20SPEAKERit like figuratively and literally and keep trying and like, it turns out you'll get better over time.

1:22:26SPEAKERWell, but, but that's, that's also one of those examples. That's if you taking a problem that you

1:22:30SPEAKERdidn't understand, like how to read a recipe is the problem, right? How to read and execute a

1:22:34SPEAKERrecipe. And then the more you do that, the better you get at at learning how to do those, learning

1:22:42SPEAKERhow to read a recipe and learning, learning the tricks and trade and of getting timing and all

1:22:46SPEAKERthat other stuff. And, and, and like, that's part of the, that's part of the difference in problems.

1:22:52SPEAKERRight? Yeah. Like, like, like, like spatchcocking, for example, I ended up not cooking a turkey over

1:22:57SPEAKERthe holidays because as much as I thought, I was like, I'm just going to look at how to do this and

1:23:00SPEAKERdo it. And then I got to the part where you have to go buy poultry shears and then cut the spine.

1:23:04SPEAKERAnd I was like, maybe I'm not ready for this yet. And so I did not do it, but like, but you know,

1:23:09SPEAKERlike it's, you can, you can, you can ramp yourself up to harder problems over time.

1:23:15SPEAKERThe, the, the talk, the Zach Gage talk that I think is, is my favorite treatise on this is called

1:23:21SPEAKERdesigning for problem solvers. If you search for Zach Gage and designing for problem solver problem

1:23:28SPEAKERsolvers, it comes right up. And it's about routine versus non-routine problems. That's what we're

1:23:33SPEAKERtalking about. So like in the example of cooking, the routine problem is following a recipe and

1:23:38SPEAKERexecuting the recipe and collecting all the ingredients and figuring out the timing and,

1:23:41SPEAKERand then actually doing the mechanical part of cooking and then putting it on a plate and eating

1:23:45SPEAKERit right. The non-routine problem is learning how to read a recipe in the first place. Cause it's a

1:23:50SPEAKERspecialized bit of knowledge. And, and this, this talk is really good about breaking down how that

1:23:57SPEAKERapplies to games. Cause that's what Zach cares about, but it, it, it's, it's quite good. Very

1:24:03SPEAKERinformative anyway. Yeah. It's a thorny prop. So I don't think you're a gen alpha kids or shiftless

1:24:08SPEAKERlayabouts because they don't know how to use a file system. Brad clearly with his boomer take

1:24:13SPEAKERdoes though. No, no, that's not what I'm saying at all. Nobody ever showed them how it's just

1:24:17SPEAKERthat what I'm saying, what I'm saying more generally as again, as an effort toward individual

1:24:22SPEAKERempowerment, like if you don't know how to do something like really just try to develop the

1:24:25SPEAKERhabit of just typing, how do I do blank? Yeah, absolutely. And see what you find. And it might

1:24:31SPEAKERnot be something you're interested in or feel like you have the aptitude to approach, but it might be

1:24:36SPEAKERlike it might, you might, you might learn that you can learn it more easily than you think. And

1:24:40SPEAKERthere's also, there's the thing, this is directly applicable to my parenting. I realized that my

1:24:47SPEAKERwas afraid to try doing stuff cause she was afraid she was going to break something. Yeah. That's

1:24:50SPEAKERkind of how I feel about cooking. Right. But, but so we, we spent, I made a concentrated effort to

1:24:56SPEAKERteach her that it's pretty hard to break most things beyond the point that you can repair them

1:25:01SPEAKERand also break things in a way that's going to hurt you or hurt something that you love or hurt

1:25:05SPEAKERsomething that you enjoy doing and, and, and all of that stuff. So like knowing one of my earliest

1:25:13SPEAKERformative memories for learning how to work with PCs was one of my, the guy who lived across the

1:25:19SPEAKERhall from me in my freshman dorm fucked up his computer one day and it wasn't booting. It was

1:25:23SPEAKERan OS 10 warp machine. So it was a weird computer, OS2 warp machine rather. And he was like, I don't,

1:25:29SPEAKERI'm not going to get this paper done. I was like, well, here, what do you show me what you have?

1:25:33SPEAKERAnd he had the disc, the thing with six floppy disks in it. And you know, here's how you

1:25:38SPEAKERreinstall OS2 warp. And I sat down and I just followed the fucking instructions in the book.

1:25:43SPEAKERAnd I was like, Oh, okay. So if I can fix this computer that I know absolutely nothing about,

1:25:48SPEAKERjust by following some really basic instructions that were written in this manual that came with

1:25:51SPEAKERthe computer, I can probably fix almost anything that's wrong with the computer. And that knowledge

1:25:57SPEAKERwas formative and important. And if you, if I hadn't had that experience, I don't think I'd

1:26:03SPEAKERbe where I am right now. I don't think I'd be sitting here talking about this with you. Right.

1:26:07SPEAKERYeah. Yeah. So yeah, try, you have to be willing to take chances and break shit, which, you know,

1:26:14SPEAKERjust don't, don't break anything that's going to hurt somebody. Yeah. Yeah. That's good advice.

1:26:18SPEAKERYeah. And I think on that note, is that a wrap? Should we wrap it up?

1:26:23SPEAKERYeah. Let's call it. I apologize for referencing Shags's question, but we'll answer it in the,

1:26:27SPEAKERin the patron episode. Cause it was a discord question. So we can take some more of these there

1:26:30SPEAKERif we want. And speaking of the patron episode, if you would like to hear the patron episode,

1:26:35SPEAKERyou can go to patreon.com/techbaud. And for five bucks a month, you get access to the discord. You

1:26:40SPEAKERget access to the patron exclusive mode. It's also, this is a listener supported show. So

1:26:44SPEAKERwithout you all, we aren't here. We don't have ads. We don't, we don't take money from anybody

1:26:48SPEAKERelse. It's just listeners in us. It's the way we like it. It turns out my anti ad, somebody,

1:26:54SPEAKERa friend of mine described it as my anti ad agenda the other day. And I was like, look,

1:26:58SPEAKERit's just easier this way. So again, it's patreon.com/techbaud. And we do appreciate

1:27:07SPEAKEReach and everybody who supports us. We do. And things are tight. So if you can't chuck a review

1:27:12SPEAKERon iTunes, cause that helps a lot too, or tell a friend, send them a link to the podcast and let

1:27:15SPEAKERthem know that you think that we rep, we appreciate it. People said really nice things about the

1:27:20SPEAKER50 90 episode last week on the blue skies, which I thought was, which was kind. This is the portion

1:27:27SPEAKERof the show, of course, where we thank our executive producer to your patrons, including

1:27:30SPEAKERAndrew Slosky, Jordan Lippett, BunnyThing, TwinkleTwinky, David Allen, James Kamik, and

1:27:36SPEAKERPantheon makers of the HS3 high-speed 3d printer. Thank you all so, so much.

1:27:41SPEAKERBunnyThing, I still have not quite. What's a BunnyThing?

1:27:44SPEAKERDo your BunnyThing. I look, I'm not going to, I'm not going to

1:27:47SPEAKERkink shame anybody who's doing their BunnyThing. Okay. It's just so vague. It calls all kinds of

1:27:52SPEAKERimages. Anyway. Well, huh. I didn't really have any image. What images are you talking about,

1:27:57SPEAKERBrad? No specific image. That's it's more, I guess what it calls to mind more is like,

1:28:01SPEAKERwhat kind of thing are we talking? I don't actually know. Anyway. Yes. Thank you to all.

1:28:05SPEAKERWell, that'll do it for us this week. We'll be back next week with another edition of the tech

1:28:09SPEAKERpod. Until then, please consider the environment before printing this podcast.